I have a 51 Merc. 255 V8 6v electrics with Borg Warner Overdrive. I have read about the way the Overdrive operates electrically, and how in some experiences, electronic ignition will short out the module and in other they're fine running for years. I have a PERTRONIX electronic ignition module, I'd like to in stall. In my research I found PERTRONIX suggesting to install DIODES and Resistors to the coil (-) side to ground out at KICKDOWN. The diagram I downloaded from PERTRONIX, is suggested for the Merc boat motors . Again in my research I read guys suggesting this too. I went out and bought the DIODES and Resistors PERTRONIX is suggesting to buy. Now my question is , those of you that are running this set up with the DIODES and Resistors in the system. Can you show any pictures of this part of the system. I'm no Sparky, but I have an electrician at work willing to help build/solder these pieces together. I would love to have a visual for him to see how others are using it. Thank you.
You have a positive ground electrical system. The screen shot shows a negative ground system. The diodes would need to be reversed (the colored bands go to the left - they now are to the right) I can not verify if this works. I am very cautious about the source of this diagram - The following words are misspelled: "serers" and, "sodered". Makes me wonder if the "engineering" was done in the Peoples Republic of Tinpanistan. Russ
I can't tell for sure if the diagram is for a positive or negative ground system; there are wires running all over the place. The important thing to know is that 6 volt Pertronix systems are fragile and very prone to failure. Plus, they are unnecessary. Over drive electrics are complicated in their own right and difficult to troubleshoot. Do yourself a favor and stick with points.
Instead of grounding the "points" as original equipment, install a relay to interupt the positive power supply to the coil. End result is to stop the ignition and unload the transmission so the solenoid can withdraw the pawl.
Let me think this one over. I can say that a relay will not work the way you think it will. Follow the wiring on this diagram, it shows why it won't... that other diagram I need to digest... Remember that no spark is produced UNTIL the points open. Interrupting power to the coil is not the answer, you need to maintain power.
Thank you guys, for your responses. As brought up, the initial diagram looked funky and didn't make sense with what my current setup is. I looked further into the PERTRONIX diagrams, and it turns out I downloaded the wrong one. I looked for the part# 1283P6 and located the diagram below. In some responses, the suggestion is to stay with points ignition, I was just looking to do something different here with a mindset of efficiency. I currently have an issue at high RPM while driving/in gear all 3 speeds, in direct drive. I recently bought the car. When I got it home and did a deeper inspection I noticed the Overdrive electrics were disconnected and the Overdrive relay was substituted by a starter relay. I haven't looked into the misfire yet, but when I get a chance to do so I would like to have an alternative, if electronic ignition a solution I most certainly would like to install the system correctly with the inclusion of the Overdrive. Thanks again, I really appreciate the insight and Ideas. If you will, keep'em coming.
Maybe concentrate on the high rpm miss you have, that I suspect is not that high, as you mention all three speeds. Ie I think of high RPM to be 4-4500plus, surely you’re not running those RPMs in 3rd? I’d think you have a sense that maybe 2500/3000 is high RPMs? But regardless, I haven’t looked at the diagram close that Steve posted, but if you have the Pertronix on hand, put it on, see if the miss is there or if it’s gone. Don’t hook up the OD though. If the miss is there, you know it wasn’t the points or condenser. Also, I’m not sure how the pertronix will work with a generator on 6v. I’ve never used one, but did use -for a day- a converted HEI in a 235 I had with a generator I had to crank the idle up to around 1000 RPMs (yes, I changed out the ignition wiring to 14 gauge like the factory used) to keep it from dieing at idle. Does Pertronix say to use an Alternator?
I was thinking about doing it that way first, just to see if it was the Point system. Hooking up the Overdrive system wasn't a thought until I can confirm what is the best way without the casualty of frying something. As fas a running an Alternator with this ignition setup, I havent seen anything from them suggesting an Alternator over a Generator.
I just read your post about the overdrive being disconnected and non-operational. Take a bit of advice from one who has been through it many times. Only change one thing at a time. It's much easier to solve one problem and then go on to the next. Several here have suggested installing the Pertronix and see if that solves your miss problem. Although I have advised against it, if you are dead set on using one, follow this advice. Get the miss out of the engine before proceeding on the overdrive. Someone mentioned an alternator. There is a very good reason to use an alternator when installing a Pertronix. A traditional generator puts out what is considered these days to be very "dirty" power. Voltage spikes of up to 250 volts can be experienced from one. While a points is system is a relatively crude method, it tolerates this "dirty" power and keeps working. A Pertronix is a relatively sophisticated electronic device and is easily damaged by dirty power; an alternator reduces this tendency, but doesn't completely eliminate it. Also, since there are overdrive components missing and you are unaware of the condition of the rest (solenoid, governor, kickdown, wiring) and you may be considering an alternator, this may be the time to consider a change to a 12 volt system. Overdrive components are expensive and hard to find (especially 6 volt versions) and a 12 volt system may just make things easier and cheaper.
That diagram makes more sense.... As to the OD, you can connect it minus the kickdown wiring/switch (thereby having zero effect on the ignition), you just won't have any way to drop it out of OD if the governor contacts are closed. You will need to connect the governor to the relay.
Top end is more appropriate I guess instead of high RPMs. It make sense to get running correctly first. Figure out the misfire first. Then figure out why the Overdrive electrics weren't hooked up. I just scored on a 6v solenoid and relay, used but in good condition. I'll at least hold up with the electronic ignition. For now.
I'm going to figure out why I'm misfiring first, then figure out what's up with the Overdrive. I just scored on a good but used condition solenoid and relay 6v. I work on getting it working like it should before I consider the ELECTRONIC Ignition. As far as 12v I'll have to wait for a bit and money up for such an endeavor.
Well, I’m not advocating the Pertronix, but if you have it, go ahead and put it in, if your miss is solved, we’ll, then you know. If not, then do some digging. I’m helping out a fella long distance, he’s early 20’s, trying to get a carbed , points engine running. Many times he says “it should work, I’m calling a mobile mechanic “. I say “well, Ask some questions, if a 30/40 year old shows up, how often has he diddled with a carb and points”? I’ve never changed over to anything “better and improved “ unless I knew the issue was due to what I was working on, if that makes sense. Guess I’m saying it’s easier to have a carburetor rebuilt, and less expensive, than to swap to EFI. Not that you are considering it, but is kinda relevant.
I have read about that, bypassing the kickdown switch. So after sorting out the misfire, I can wire up the system with out the kickdown switch, and use a toggle switch instead. So then the electronic ignition module won't be affected by shutting of the toggle switch, and no Diode and Resistor is necessary?
I have a different electronic ignition, but hat's exactly what I did, for the same reason. Maybe this helps:
Right on, Thanks! I see the diagram says " Inine Fuse" to the Ignition switch. What did you use? Do you have a picture? Where is it located, Under the dashboard, firewall?
Actually I don't have a fuse there (and yeah I know I probably should - need to look into it, what it takes). Still trying to get the spaghetti monster harness (the whole car, not just the OD) under control. Basically I have everything working, but now I want to make it look nice and tidy. But yeah, the fuse would be best under the dash. I would use something like this:
The Jalopy Journal
