What are you trying to "break"? I know....I am an ***. But this bubbly I am drinking makes me think I am funny.
I would not. 1961 brakes are for 1961 roads. Last time I checked, we are in the waning hours of 2022.
Go check the Thunderbird sites and see what other owners have used that works. Just because a kit bolts in does not make it an improvement. Do your homework. I’ve leaned that the hard way. Unfortunately, I don’t have the skills to calculate and design a brake system like some here do. Neither do all the companies selling “kits”. They all work in the driveway. Go find a wide vacant road and try a panic stop from 70 or so. Especially if it’s for your wife.
The 'kits' that are out there really are a mixed bag - some better than others, and most aren't that great to begin with. And virtually all of them, while they may claim 'bolt-on,' require some kind of fabrication. The easiest and closest thing to a 'bolt-in' swap is to use 1965-1966 T-bird spindles/rotors/calipers/wheels and adding a dual MC + proportioning valve, but the drawback is the size of the OEM calipers and the need for 15"+ diameter wheels that have the inside clearance to not hit the caliper body. As a '63 owner, Technical Director of Vintage Thunderbird Club International and one of the overseers of the VTCI Forum at www.vintagethunderbirdclub.net and its 1961-63 Modified Thunderbird section, I see many people commenting about various 'kits' that require some kind of tweaking or don't perform up to expectations. For example, a couple of participants put together an article on a kit they used and what it took to make it work: http://www.southsandia.com/forum/website/***ets/pdf/61-63_T-Bird_Disc_Brake_Kit_Guide.pdf You do realize the '61-'62 T-bird front suspension setup is pretty unique to itself, right? Dropped spindles? I'm not aware that anybody makes any. In stock trim the car sits low to begin with. Dropping it lower could result in you actually breaking things.
Please send my regards to the blokes who wrote that T-bird disc brake write up. Made me smile. I recently went through a similar process “bolting” Mitsubishi rotors to a 1960 GM Holden kingpin front end. It was a “bolt up” kit too. I’m about 80% of the way through writing a similar how-to do***ent. Cheers, Harv
Looking at that link that Yutan flash posted got me to thinking a bit, First thing when trying to swap hubs or rotors is check to see if the bearings match and check to see if there are bearings that are campatible with the spindle and hub if they don't. 63 T bird inner wheel bearing = National A6 set of cone and race. Outer is a National A3 Wheel seal is a National 9150S All info gathered from Rock Auto but those numbers can be crossed at any parts house in the world. With the 80 Grenada rotor inner wheel bearing set Natonal A 13 Outer = Natonal A 12 Rotor RAYBESTOS 6042R 11 inch rotor Meaning to use that rotor you would need to figure out how to get bearings and races to work both inner and outer. Looking at a 75 Galaxy with a 11.7 rotor it uses the same bearings in and out as the Grenada. That makes me thing that the bullet Bird is the odd duck in the Ford lineup. Blowing the hell out of my concept that damned near every Ford uses the same outer wheel bearing and most use the same inner bearing. Scarebird doesn't show a kit, Meaning that there isn't enough interest or there are too many complications. I enjoy doing research on things like this but right now I am not up to spending the time to figure out how to make it work with standard parts outside of fabricated caliper brackets.
^^^^^^Looks like the answer^^^^^ Ask questions and for photos if possible. If the seller will download or send you the instructions that my help you decide if it’s for you. Today brakes are our best upgrade.
I read a post on another forum that Scarebird is closing up. I’ve been working on a project that I was planning to source some caliper mount brackets from Scarebird. I went to their site and didn’t see much listed available and definitely didn’t the brackets I was looking for.
I hope it works better than the kit you sold me for my car. The bracketry for that was a horror show. I was lucky to have a machine shop on the premises and made it work.
Sounds like easiest, and likely least expensive route, is to rebuild the stock brakes, which are more than adequate for cruise nights and ice cream runs
Im with pprather. Make the stock system as good as it can be and see if thats adequate before you leap into the world of aftermarket kits where nothing is straight forward.
Just a couple of helpful hints: (1) Always do needed ch***is, suspension and engine work first, paint last, (2) Put where you are (city and state) in your avatar, it helps when you are needing help or parts, (have a set of 65-66 disk brakes to sell, not knowing where you live doesn't help) (3) The HAMB is a great resource, but not the only resource. You might find better answers for your disk-brake questions on a T-Bird specific website. Best of luck with your project.
Sure, as long as no *****s pull in front of you and you're not going over 40 MPH... Those were dark days for Ford brakes. The cars had gotten larger/heavier but they were still using 14" wheels which severely limited the size of the brakes which could be installed. Ford did offer better brakes on their HiPo models but then swapped to a 15" wheel. Those cars came with dog-dish hubcaps as they didn't make matching full wheel covers in the 15" size. Those weren't an option for the T-bird... My '60 Ford Sunliner 'vert has power drum brakes, all freshly rebuilt. They are NOT 'adequate' for current traffic IMO, and while they will stop the car you better not be in a hurry. The reviewers of the day when these were new held pretty much the same opinion, but as very few cars had brakes any better the playing field was fairly level. Mine is getting four wheel discs with four piston calipers up front. Which brings this back to the OPs T-bird. As noted, these didn't share steering parts with the rest of the Ford line so kits are in very short supply. I'd look into a spindle swap, Ford did use the same basic spindle architecture on the full-size cars up to around the early 70s to get into a more 'common' application or to get OEM disc brakes or bite the bullet and get one for your specific car while expecting some fab work. That will probably be the case anyway, as very few of these kits are true 'bolt-ons' as delivered. The '65-66 T-bird optional discs may be one of the easier swaps, but those are rare and expensive these days. You might look for the late '60s/early '70s Lincoln discs also, but again these are rare now. One last comment. Many of these kits that use smaller floating single-piston calipers aren't that much of an improvement over drums in terms of stopping distance (but do offer much better fade resistance). A fixed (non-floating) four piston caliper will offer better braking performance as well as an easier install if 'home brewing' the caliper brackets but will require diligent maintenance of the wheel bearings to keep rotor run-out to a minimum. When Detroit first started offering disc brakes, these are what they used but most switched to single-piston floating calipers in the late '60s for cost reasons as well as more tolerance for run-out. Any true high-performance disc system will have multi-piston calipers at least in the front.
Fords early brakes were 4 piston and Prestige T-Bird sell them for the baby birds. I have 4 piston on my car without power ***ist and am very happy. I believe with some research a set could be acquired.
I believe those are reproductions of the original Mustang '65-67 discs. Stainless Steel Brakes (and other vendors) sells these for pretty much any '55 though mid-'60s Ford product with drums (EXCEPT the '61-64 T-bird) and have one advantage in that they'll fit inside of a 14" disc brake type wheel. If a spindle swap with another Ford drum brake product on the T-bird is possible, this would be a very viable option. They do offer a complete bolt-on kit for the full-size Ford. Not cheap however.... Had these on a '67 Cougar. Very good brakes, but the parts supply dried up in the early '80s for a while. SSB finally started repoing them...
Let me put it this way: Both my wife and I drive modern performance cars. Both have active suspension, stability control, and ABS controlled huge brakes. Each can stop from 65mph in about 45-fewer-feet than that T-Bird, with a level of comfort that I let my 76-year-old mother drive my car when she's in town. Legal following distance at 65mph is 190-feet, except we know all too well that NOBODY does that. It cannot even be done where I live. If you try to follow 190-feet behind, six cars or two trailer-trucks will pull into that gap. Here is the not-negotiable physics issue: We've got a lot of curves in the local freeways, and people quickly forget how steering works. Topology and flora lead to obstructed lines-of-sight. That combo leads to having to panic-stop on a regular basis. Provided that you have not recently heavily braked, leaving the drums hot, and you simultaneously hit the pedal with either my wife, or myself, and you are following at the "culturally acceptable" following distance, well, guess what is going to happen. If the drums are already nice and toasty, welcome to Fadeville. Delay one-half second in hitting that pedal, and you lose 47.5-feet of stopping distance. Delay one-second, you lose 95-feet of stopping distance, and you put either, or all of us in the hospital, and court. Like I have said, and will continue to say: you can drive yesterday's car, but you cannot drive it on yesterday's roads. Just as @Crazy Steve said, those were dark days for Ford brakes. There is just no getting around that.
Here is some homework for all of you: Grab any old object and a tape measure. Go out in your driveway/yard/side of the road. Put the object down and measure to a spot that is 50-feet away from it. Stand there. See how far that it is? How does that compare to how close you follow people in traffic? How about at 65mph? Now do the same for 190-feet, which is 2-seconds of following distance at 65mph.
60s in general were a "special" time for brakes, and Ford was no different. Ford used several spindle designs and several different disc brake setups, some of which require special wheels. Kelsey Hayes 4-piston, 2 piston, single piston, etc. Many used common bearing sets, but that does not make the rotors interchangeable. Best bet is a complete spindle, rotor, caliper swap rather than mix and match.
The Jalopy Journal
