I am FINALLY driving my '30 coupe with a 350 chevy for power. All seems well so far, but each time I start the engine, the starter stays engaged until I throttle it up a bit. I have put in all the shims that was given me with the new unit, but it acts the same with or without the shims. What did I do wrong, or what do I need to do? Motor is a fresh build, and fires right off, but this starter thing seems to be kicking my a$$.
Maybe the problem isn't what you think it is. Perhaps the starter switch is sticking? or the solenoid is hanging up? When you were playing with shims, did you check clearance as specified? or just add shims? Have you considered using a stock Chevy starter, since they work?
Could test the starter terminal to make sure you're not still getting power after starting. Short of taking it apart, could test it out of the car and make sure the pinion gear is retracting in on its own. Rule out a fork/starter clutch issue.
Yes. I used the tool that was sent to check clearance. The way I have this set up, I am using a Ford solenoid in the trunk, and the starter has no current to it once the key is released from the start position. This prevents anyone from trying to start this car with a screwdriver. I can lock the trunk, keeping unwanted people from hot wiring the car and taking off.
If I disable the ignition and turn the engine over it works and sounds just fine. But once I return power to ignition, this is what it does.
I'm seeing a lot of discussions about "High Tech" starters and alternators both here and on "The Ford Barn". In my opinion, these are just "band-aids" people are using so they don't have to troubleshoot the actual problems and solve them. Sure a 560 ci Ford or a 486 ci BBC may need something a little more robust, but my advice to the rest of you is to find the problem and fix it. (Unless that is, you really like the panache of saying : "I had to put a gear-reduction starter on it").
Are you using proper GM style starter bolts or hardware store items? Had a similar problem and installed the proper bolts. Seemed to clear it up.
I had a parts store reman starter that the slug in the solenoid didn't have enough clearance and wouldn't let the drive return. Gary
One trick I do Slightly snug up bolts, pull Bendix gear out set clearance and angle so retracts freely , ,(add shim if needed ) Tighten /torque bolts
I assume it's a gear reduction style starter like a Proform, I believe are the common ones. Those should use a sprag or one-way clutch bearing in the starter clutch pack. That allows the pinion to free wheel and more or less relies on the pressure release of the flywheel once it spins faster to allow it to retract in. If that's what you're using, it's usually a shimming issue. I've seen a bit on people only shimming the outside bolt and have better luck. But those type starters are never made to spec of the original and are typically hard to shim properly. Measure the height of a original and yours, make sure the bolt isn't bottoming before its properly tight. Short of that, strange it doesn't do it with that disconnected. I'm curious how you have that wired with the ford solenoid.
The wiring is simple. Mount the Ford solenoid in the trunk, run the battery cable to it and the other side goes to the starter. Then the start wire goes to the start side of the Ford unit. On the starter side, a wire is connected from 12v input to the starter solenoid terminal. I have wired several other starters this way and the result was excellent. This way there is only 12v to the unit when the Ford solenoid is activated.
You might be right. I had no real reason to use the small starter, other than before I had this engine in another car and when it got to operating temp it cranked slowly before it started. But now the engine has all new internals, and has never cranked anything other than normal short of this current problem.
Electronic ignition. I explained the wiring in another reply. I have used this setup several times, cars, equipment, etc, and never had an issue. I had a loader one time that if it didn't start right away, would just keep cranking until the cables got hot or the battery died. Used the remote Ford unit and all this went away.
Laying on my back, I was trying to put my kids starter in (OT car, but SBC) I was fighting that hunk of iron long enough. Took it back, ordered a mini starter. Ease of putting it in was worth it for me
Chevrolet made factory gear reduction starters for 168t flywheel. 95-98 silverado 4.3 starter ACDELCO 3371022 is the gear reduction MUST use correct bolts. New Bolts GM 12338064 dorman 678107 GM # 12338064 (3/8”–16 x 4–5/16” under head length.
Used on the last of the 4.3 and 5.7 trucks and vans during "vortec era" before going to LS. Bottom on this link lists all the applications https://newparts.com/product/acdelco/3371022
I’ve got two of these in service, they work very well and help quite a bit for header clearance. They can be bought new with no core charge for a fair price.
I have never had to shim a GM starter, not ever. I'm OCD about lots of things, including getting a starter with any engine I buy. It wards off evil spirits. I'm using a truck starter (bolts to the bellhousing) in my car with a Ford solenoid. I had the electric shop go through it and convert it to a hi-torque. I have been using that combo in a few cars since 1978, only recently discovered that I have a '55 Chevy bellhousing and not one from a truck.
You need to change your wiring. The big cables need to be attached to the same side of the Ford solenoid so the starter sees 12 volts all the time. Only the start signal wire from the starter should be attached to the other opposite big lug side of the Ford solenoid. This way, the starter sees 12 volts all the time like it was designed to do, and the start wire only has voltage when the Ford solenoid is closed. This is the way Ford wired their starters when they switched to the permanent magnet style with attached solenoid. A lot of guys tried to shortcut the start wire by just hooking it to the power cable, and it would drag for a few seconds after starting. Wired as I described above it doesn’t do the run on. There are lots of posts about this on the web of Ford guy’s experiences with run on and this is the cure. As far as your anti theft idea, you might want to incorporate a locking solenoid in the main hot cable that is only locked when the key is on.
I think he's on to something....maybe try wiring the starter as it was designed, first? Just to see if it works? don't cost nuthin
A diagram (from op) would be nice. I got lost reading this wire that side then that wire other side and so on.
Since you can cure your problem by throttling up a bit, it seems your problem is more likely mechanical than electrical. Any chance the return spring on the starter solenoid is weak or broken? If you operate the starter on a bench, does the drive snap back nicely when de-energized?
^^^^^ Bridging the battery terminal and S terminal leaves a constant point of contact at the starter. What do motors become when they get spun?
This...sounds like you are trying to use the Ford style starter solenoid for a pilot duty relay. It was never intended for this.....it was intended to give power to the ignition coil bypassing the ballast resistor for initial starting....that is an inductive application and a starter hold in coil is not.... You state that you've used this set up on other applications...but with a mini starter of the exact same specs?...I say this because I am expecting push back from you
On my other installations, NONE were mini starters. But on these other applications, these starters cost several hundred dollars and my goal here was to keep from damaging them. Since I converted several of these I haven't had to change out any of those starters. I went through six starters @ $700 a throw until I came up with this solution. This and the disconnect kept me away from that parts counter for a quite a while.
THANK YOU BamaMav!! I followed your suggestion and starter situation resolved!!! Many thanks to you and the others here on this great board for seeing me through this. I also put in new starter bolts (knurling was wore down) and she starts like she is supposed to now. Time for some SERIOUS cruising now. I'll post a pic or two of my rolling collection of parts soon. It is the car in my avatar only finished.
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