Projects How many times have you went to look at a potential project and said Oh my God!

First off, I have been at this old car thing for over 50 years and a professional builder for close to 40. And I am the first to admit that I have a barn full of forgotten Projects, some going back 30 plus years. And I also admit that there are several that if I do get back to building, I would redo a lot of the metal work on them because 30 plus years ago I did not have English wheels. panishing hammers, bead roller, tig welders and all the metal shaping experience I have now. Same goes with chassis and suspension.
But even though I need another project like a hole in the head, Me and my friends still waste too much time at night looking online.
A little while back a Gasser style 63 Ford Galaxie came up. First off, I am always amazed at the photography skills of many people being able to hide the obvious.
Anyhow I decided to take the 2-hour drive to look at it. The axle was out of an early 50s Chevy truck bugger welded to the frame and no concept of what caster is. The cross shaft connecting the steering box to the right-hand spindle was a combination of Chevy truck and Ford ends stuck into a piece of black water pipe and welded with no means of adjustment. The rear axle had some homemade spring saddles welded on top of the axle above the originals with no concept of pinion angle. And the list would go on.
The car itself was an early style 63 Galaxie square top 2dr. and the more you looked the worse it got.
To be honest the trip was more of an adventure for me and my equally retire gear head buddy than a serious car purchase trip, I politely thank the guy for his time and went on our way. I am a big fan of early 60s full size Fords and Mercury's, having owned two 62 XL's and my current 64 Marauder.
Had the car been what it was represented as I would have definitely considered it. But there is no way this car will ever be actually finished, the ad disappeared after a couple weeks so either he found someone with more dreams and ambitions, or he gave up. Seemed like a nice enough fellow. But it is scary what some people might actually put on the road. Larry



As an edit to my post, Yeah a lot of people misrepresent or have insane ideas of value. But what really got me going was the workmanship and engineering. It would have been a total death trap had he actually got it on the road and believe me I have seen plenty of that on the street especially when you see the street freak gasser or slammed to the ground so called traditional and rat rod styles. If a little is good, a lot is better. lol not really. Build the style you want but gain some knowledge and ability before you either destroy a good car or worse your life or others. Larry

PS, Administrator's if this the wrong category please feel free to change it.

 

What really amazes me is when I read a story about someone who bought the car based on a picture without inspecting it first.

 

It’s always buyer beware!

 

What he said, Caveat emptor, true since Roman times and before

 

Back in around 96 or so, I`m on the search for a old car, open to anything interesting really.
Add in the local buyers guide listed a 64 Galaxy 500 XL, 30-40 miles away, off I go. I got there and followed the guy in his back yard, there she was looked beautiful , red, white interior. Walked around to the passenger side, and the whole car was badly side swiped. That was a let down, been nice if that was disclosed in the first place

 

Sometimes the best and cheapest trip to look at a project results in coming home with an empty trailer. My dad and I have done that a lot. Luckily the stuff we've brought home over the years has been as advertised, and we're glad we left the others where they were.

 

Yeah, of course there have been a few that have given me pause. I'm especially hyper-sensitive when the "project" is one that I intend on actually using and driving without totally pulling apart. The one time I let my guard down and bought a car basically sight-unseen, it turned out to be a huge disaster. The "project" could be a weekend worth of work, a week, a month, or in my case, going on 4 years.

If you're buying a car with the intention that you're going to blow it completely apart and fix everything, it is what it is. Of course you prefer better, but if you get worse, it just sort of goes along with the build.

When I was kid, the first old car I looked at was a 57 Chevy 210 sedan. Drove all the way to southern NJ to look at it, and when we test drove it, the powerglide sounded like a coffee grinder. I left that one there and wound up with another one.

Oddly when I drove 7 hours to get my 56 Olds, I was a bit disappointed that the car that "ran and drove", ran like shit and had no brakes. I was prepared to leave it there, but the guys I bought it from renegotiated a number and a deal was made. It took 5 weeks and $1500 to get it running and driving properly but otherwise it has been the best old car I've ever owned.

I recently picked up another car that will be a long-term project. It's a mess, but I knew that going in and paid accordingly. Most importantly, it has all of the parts that are specific to that model, stainless trim, headliner bows, garnish moldings, etc, and of utmost importance, a proper title.

 

The ad said it was a 37 Ford panel. Only a hundred miles round trip.
Upon arrival I found it to be a humped roof truck.
Thinking maybe I can like this... Potential Possibilities??
At this time, I am informed that it sits on a 72 something or other frame.
That's life.

 

I tend to look at them, throw up and then buy it anyway. It's a disease.

 

About fifteen years ago I ran across a late 60's Merc wagon sitting in a driveway I passed every day going back and forth to work. Couldn't seem to catch anyone home so I left a note in the mailbox by the front door. Couple of days go by and I get a call from who SAYS they're the owner (more on this later) and they'd be happy to let me make an offer after I looked it over. Mind you, it was sitting on four flat tires in loamy soft dirt amongst the worst mosquito habitat possible, but I made the effort to clean out around it to ensure the frame wasn't AWOL...
Brought a battery and tried to turn it over, the last driver had monkeyed with the carb and distributor and I didn't want to do an impromptu tune up on a car I didn't own, so just getting it to spin without hammering the shit out the block was a victory of sorts. It was a pretty solid wind wagon and probably wouldn't have taken $500 to put back on the road, prices were still down on oddball longroof Mercs at the time, so I made an offer of $750 as long as it had a good title.
That's where I should have left the premises with my good sense intact.
The guy claiming to be the owner says he has to get the title from "someone else" even though the last registration in the glovebox listed him as the owner... he "MIGHT" be able to convince them to accept $1000 but $750 was not enough.... I say no thanks, I'll pass, pick up my stuff and leave.
Dude calls me a week later says the least they'll take is $1500..
look, I said; $1000 is out of the question; $750 was me being nice, and to tell the truth, it's worth about $500 in parts.
Guy cusses me, I hang up. I drive by a couple of weeks later and it's been hauled away... probably for scrap.
I've been given better cars for FREE than that car was.

 

The other end of the scale is go look at one car and finish up buying that one and the one standing next to it

 

yep, more than once arrived at car For Sale location and had to ask where is the car For Sale at? seller says this is it. just walk away. do not try to convince him that it is a piece of crap. do not try to convince yourself that "I can fix anything". with the variety of car shows on TV that find a piece of junk that easily starts, and drive it a long distance. people feel obligated to try to do the same thing.

 

Anymore I think kinda like Derek from Vice Grip Garage... maybe ... maybe I can get this deathtrap running and operable and make it X number of miles home.... maybe not... I used to be a lot better at making it happen the way he does it. It's definitely more entertaining to WATCH and LISTEN to him doing it than hearing my OWN play by play

 

It seems that all of the stuff I look at, buy, and build would fall into that category for most guys! But the reality is, that is the price range of the junk I look at. Sometimes I actually have passed on some piles, and there were some I should have passed on, but the challenge was just too enticing.

I don't build show cars, I build drivers. I can afford to put a few bucks a month into a project and build something debt free much better then if I would buy something nice and make payments on it, even if starting with the much nicer financed car would have been cheaper at the end of the adventure. This is a no debt hobby for me.

When I go look at something, I look at what its going to cost to make my vision of it road worthy, how much time and effort is going to be involved, and what stuff on the project might be out of my skill set (machine work, body filler work, and paint mostly). The final test of the deal is if I can picture myself driving my vision of the finished project. I'm not the guy that is going to look at many "great projects", but there has been more then a few that I didn't buy simply because they didn't pass that last test.

For me, that "Oh my God" project I'm looking at usually means it was just what I had pictured, and is in my price range! Its usually one of those "I'm dragging this one home!" projects. And for the record, my wife is usually sitting beside me shaking her head in approval.

 

Hello,

We were looking for ways to do three things. Advertise indirectly about our photo business, have a nice place to put my longboard when going surfing, camping, and cruise around in a cool hot rod/station wagon with my wife, on our coastal road trips.

A 50 Ford coupe was our next choice of advertised cars. We had gone down to San Diego to buy a 283 SBC powered 46 Ford Woody, check in hand, but the person selling the woody would not budge on the “out of city” customers with a check. It was a Sunday and no banks were open and no such thing as an ATM machine. If that owner had accepted the check, we would have been in a woody as long as we owned the 1940 327 powered Ford Sedan Delivery, plus a few more years.



Jnaki

The antsy, almost purchased, woody action spurred us on to all of the local sources. We even test drove a new German made 4 speed Ford coupe at a dealer’s lot. We were desperate. But, there was one last place a 35 minute drive from our house. It was a black 50 Ford coupe with stock appearance, but with chrome wheels. The long trunk and removable rear seat back would have held my short, longboard on our surf trips, too. So, he Ford coupe was in our eye sights.

The 50 Ford was one of those nice to look at and had nice features, but the presentation and aroma was a total turn off for my wife and me. No way we would be driving down any street with that aroma that permeated our clothes when we were looking at it. We liked it, but walked away as the owner “left his mark” on the whole car. Not a good smelling hot rod or owner.

But the next week, we happen to be in central OC and visited a small hot rod parts shop. There in the parking lot was this old 40 Ford Sedan Delivery. Instantly, it took me back to my high school days and the Flathead Sedan Delivery I owned for 6 years of So Cal adventures prior to going away for college.

Little did we know that it was a project, although to the passer by, it looked finished and ready for a long cruise up the coast. Even when we took a test drive, it had the “stuff” and perhaps the rest was overlooked at the time. But, by the time we got back to our apartment, things were definitely noticeable as far as safety and handling. Looks were deceiving.

For the next several months, it was not a daily driver, but up on jack stands being worked on to get it right. Sitting inside was fun, as it was fully upholstered, but the mechanical portion was a mess and we could actually call it, “The Wanderer” on any street or freeway. The look overcame the build quality and we needed to get it right. So, professional help was on the way.

Our friend who owned a wheel and alignment shop that did work on all of our other hot rods and cruisers moved near us and the sedan delivery took up residence in that shop for weeks. The sedan delivery was a work horse for the next 5 years. My wife could have been considered the primary driver due to her winning the coin flips before selecting which car to drive for the day.

After spending a good portion of the early days getting it right, many miles later, we sold the sedan delivery due to not being a three person daily driver. My wife and I fit perfectly. But an additional safety seat for our son was not in the build cards. The woody would have a back seat and provisions were easy to install a third safety seat location. So, on the way home we talked about still going hunting for another hot rod of sorts.

 

And yet we have a company like carvana that advertisers doing exactly this. What does that have to say about the population as well as cars

 

1 in 20 are at best somewhat sound in the ways of engineering and craftsmanship. So many TV soaked dreamers think they're pro builders because they saw something done with no concept of the pre-show realities and prep. And frankly I see some pretty "accomplished" shops that have stuff I would never do being done as if it's "the way" and only makes matters worse. Just imagine how many forlorn and forgotten projects never make it. I tubbed dozens of cars back in the 90s. I've seem maybe 4 or 5 racing or driving. "I can do my own (fill in the blank)." which in fact many of them couldn't. A lot of the nightmare scenarios are O/T cars for here from years past, now I tend to stay with mostly original unmodified stuff. However I did just run across a 60 Starliner that turned out to be...

 

THIS.
If you show up, and the car isn't what was represented, you have to be prepared to leave it there, even if you have cost involved. Too many end up buying the vehicle due to the 'sunk-cost fallacy'... the idea that 'I might as well buy it since I already rented a trailer, took a day off work, spent gas money to drive here, have cash in hand etc.'.

Five or six years ago, I drove 8 hours north one way to pick up a 61 F100. Was a 'done' truck, but the owner passed away and his brother was selling it. He sent me numerous pictures. I sent a deposit to hold it.
When I got there, the paint was coming off the doors and bed in sheets. No transmission cover on the floor, and while driving it, I watched the whole engine moving forward whenever I pressed the clutch.
When asked about the discrepancy, the seller admitted that he was using pictures from 10 years prior because no one was willing to make the drive to see it in present condition.
We were there such a short time, my girlfriend didn't even bother to get out of the truck while I was looking at it.

 

I am guilty of this years ago. Lesson learned, never again. The photos of my avatar made it look like a pretty solid truck, just beaten up. So since it was over a thousand miles away, I trusted my gut and payed to have it shipped to me. Surprise! The outside sheetmetal was there but razor thin in most places. I ended up using only one fender, hood top, the bed sides, cowl, cab back, roof and dash. I replaced every other part of the truck including the complete chassis and had to patch panel the parts I did use. NEVER trust photos, afterall, they make old movie stars look sexy..

 

A former neighbor was going to go look at a '63 Falcon convert he was interested in. He likes cars, actually works as a parts guy at a car dealership but just isn't anywhere near experienced enough to be in a position to inspect an old car. I had to go to a wedding the day he booked to inspect it. I told him to take someone who knows what to look for with him. Offer a case of beer to a mechanic from your shop and have him tag along I suggested. Nope, he took his wife

He paid $5,000 for the worst piece of crap I had ever seen. I would have offered $50, taken the 9" out of it and left the carcass, it was that bad. Not only can I not believe the seller was asking that much money, I can't believe my neighbor (or ANYONE for that matter) bought it

 

I have looked at a couple potential projects recently and the price they wanted is what I have sold finish running cars before, and not that long ago.

A car that needs floors & patch panels, needs new glass and chrome, engine & transmission and they want 10 grand for is ridiculous, and the truth of the matter is it isn't a desirable car. HRP

 

Gotta be careful even when you're looking at it in person.

And you're right, Danny. Some of the prices they're asking for sketchy stuff I think is especially hard to accept for those of us who remember prices from not that long ago. I refuse. It leaves some of the sellers at a bit of a disadvantage when they're dealing with me. Lol.

 

I've never had any experience with Carvana or the like, but their ads always leave with the impression that you're essentially only leasing a used car from them with no expectations of actual ownership. I wonder how many of their customers end up actually owning their purchase after making payments for 72 or 84 months. A used car sold on these terms certainly can't have much value when purchased this way.

 

Friend of mine took me along to look at a used (dealership) Ridgeline he wanted. The salesman was prompt trying to tell him how it was such a clean car no accidents reported ect. Wasn't too happy when I showed him how the panels were ziptied back on, how the door was rubbing ect. It had been hit but not reported. Of course the salesman never looked at it and just believed the Carfax. Conversation went like this . . .
Salesman "make me an offer"
"We can't, we know it has been hit and an offer would reflect that which you would naturally refuse as you will instead sell it to someone who won't inspect it"
"Goodbye"

 

I said oh my lord when this arrived, but with perseverance it turned out okay in the end

 

Any 34 Victoria can land in my yard like that,i for sure will not complain one bit.Love the victorias. harvey

 

Last weekend, drove six hours to rediscover that not everyone’s definition of mint is the same as mine. Years ago I bought my 60 elcamino project delivered to my place sight unseen, based on pictures. Sent a cheque for half the amount and agreed to pay the flatbed driver the balance on delivery. When the car showed up, the engine that was with it was not exactly as described. The driver called the seller and we made a mutually agreeable adjustment. Two car guys that had never met, just making it right. Sometimes it works out.

 

When I bought my shoebox the owner gave me a tour of his home shop, and we looked over his 32, cobra, and a few muscle cars that are ot here. We walked up to the shoebox and I handed him my envelope of cash. He said don't you even wanna start it first? I said I've seen your work. Do I need to? And he said absolutely not, car is perfect. I drove it home and haven't been sorry once.

Here's a recent boat engine I saw though. Anyone see anything odd about the fuel line? Lmfao....

 

I've looked at several cars that had pictures in ads that cleverly omitted areas that would have kept me home. I've also looked at, and bought cars that had lots of issues that I knew were there, but prices were too good to walk away from.
I've been on the other end selling also, and had people call to come and look with absolutely no intention of buying. One pair of guys came by and after looking my car over they admitted they just saw the ad, and weren't doing anything, so they wanted to come take a look, just for something to do. People wasting my time for their enjoyment is little irritating.

 

My son bought a 1963 Chevrolet Belair sight unseen. He knew it didn't have an engine or trans. When it arrived he was seriously surprised to see it had factory power steering, power brakes and AC. One of the few stories where the car was actually better!

Larry