Technical Opinions: Order of Operations

DO NOT CUT THE WHOLE THING APART if you have to ask.
This journey your on is like a long book with many chapters that will be incredibly hard to read, sometimes written poorly, sometimes small exciting parts. You need to read every page of it before you get to the next one, finish every chapter, all the way to the end or you lost.
Right now you have the best idea of where everything is supposed to go and how it’s supposed to be.
Knowing the specific car would help too.

The cowl section is pretty important because it’s got most all the moving parts attached to it, fenders need to line up and at right height, door gaps and all that stuff.

If the chassis and frame need work then get that done first and use it to build up the body off of. Fresh rubber body mounts will cause you nothing but trouble on an all out build, use solid blocks that represent the compressed thickness of the future installed rubber bushings. Use a little bit thicker block than the bushings and then you have room for shims. It’s sucks being off the other way.
On a square chassis, center and square the cowl, are doors even? Fenders core support sitting correctly? Door jambs in the right spot, deck lid square ? Trunk lock on center line ?
Brace things the best way you can and start with the floor pans, then rockers. Everything still good?
Door jambs good? Braced well, start on your 1/4s.

Plan on taking most every part on and off at least 10 times, some will be 50. On your hinges and panels it’s very very important that they are going to the exact same place to call “home” every time do you know where “good” is and work to that.

 

Really good idea on the solid blocks.

And for the record, the car in question for me is a 57 Chevy Nomad. But I also ask the question in general terms for anyone else dealing with a similar issue.

 

Well a 30s car is done a bit different than a 50s or 60s. And a 30s ford different than 30s Chevy. mopar a little different than GM.

Make it stop
Make it go
Make it pretty
Always in that order, never deviate from that.

 

Pretty sure it was a 2 1/2" hole saw I used to make my "body bushings" out of 3/4" plywood. Also I made a set from 2x6 that are an inch and a half thick.

 

X2 on not buying new tires early on, they just age out before you get it driving. Find used/worn examples of what you want for the build phase, buy new ones at the end. Same with the engine; as much as we try, it's hard to seal up and protect fresh cylinders to last 4-8 years. Just use the core or a plastic dummy as a place holder.

 

There’s truth to this, for sure.

However on a custom build the first thing I start with is the wheels and tires and build to them. Wheels and tires make or break the car and there’s probably nothing worse than trying to find something that fits and looks good enough to fit what you’ve built.
Sounds counter intuitive at first glance on the surface, but the first thing I start with is the wheels and tires. The body establishes the wheel base and track width and rake. Then build the suspension and frame to suit.
Worn out examples of exactly what you want are great if you can find em. Usually you can’t.

Only my stuff stays unfinished long enough for tires to expire ( man that pisses me off!!!) & not the tires , that everyone else’s stuff comes first.

 

I avoid rust situations like the plague. I had to go 1800 miles to find a Ford with zero rust on it.

 

Under ordinary circumstances I would totally agree with you. The situation I find myself in here I think posed a unique conundrum because of how low production these particular cars are. They seem to come in 1 of 4 varieties;
1 - A complete pile of shit without a title.
2 - A complete pile of shit with a title. (like this one)
3 - A running and driving complete pile of shit.
4 - A beautiful, fully restored car.

Varieties 1, 2, and 3 are basically the same amount of work, except the price of acquisition is about $20K higher for variety 3. And I'd spring for variety 4, except it seems dumb to spend $60K+ for a car only to gut it for a custom interior and strip it to the bare steel for a complete color change, in the hopes that the work under the paint is acceptable.

 

Thanks Jeff, I appreciate the kind words. Yes, I do have a rotisserie, and I do plan on separating the body from the frame. It just seems like the best way to go to do the most thorough job the most efficient way. Not sure if I'll put the chassis on a rotisserie as well, since most of the work I can do much easier with the body off the frame, and especially so with it on the lift. I feel like this will make much quicker work of plumbing and whatnot.

I don't plan on a significant amount of chassis fabrication, especially since there is such an expansive aftermarket for the 55-57 Chevy, a lot of the R&D has already been done for me. Unlike with my Olds where when I wanted to modify the suspension, I was making cardboard templates, sawing up plate steel, and TIG welding for what turned out to be months.

 

Mine was like a 1.5 with a good title, sound body and MISSING PARTS. The car was part of a divorce settlement and was being taken apart for paint or whatever. Some guy was sitting back chuckling with a beer in his hand after that deal went down.

 

^^^^ This.
Once the doors are fitted, weld a couple of straps or 1" square tubes across the inside door opening, welding them to the inner door, front & rear jambs. This is better than drilling/clecoing or welding on the outer skins. When you grind them off later it won't be on the money side of the car.
Build a substantial inner cage, then cut away the old floor, lift the body, then drop on the new floor. Once the floor is welded in, you can fit the quarters one side at a time. Once they're fitted you can place the body on a rolling cart and separate the chassis.
You'll have 100's of labor hours in body work. IMHO, this warrants farming out the engine, trans rebuild (if you have someone reliable) to keep this from being a 10 year project and you from getting burned out. You'll be buying all new suspension and brake parts, so other than painting and assy, that takes care of the chassis.

 

My Model A was a Phaeton (I only have the front half of the body), but it's going to be a RPU. I've thought a lot about this question. I'm going get the new RPU sheet metal installed and bed shortened before I remove anything from the chassis. Once I have the body mocked up and braced up, I'll be able to box the chassis as I then will know where all my body mounts will land. Then suspension, then drivetrain, body back on to see firewall modifications, trans tunnel, etc. Mock in the floors, then back apart to weld and plumb.

That's a rough plan of attack.

 

I usually start with the drivetrain, but then get sidetracked on some patch panel on the body. That turns into some custom sheet metal work that gets halted because I realized I wanted to change the way the exhaust is routed, but I didn't like the trans crossmember, so while I'm trying to be artistic I lose track of my vision for the exhaust and move on to the suspension, but quickly found out that the rear axle has a bad pinion seal, so I took that apart, but while I'm waiting on those parts I find some bondo in the quarter panel that needs to be removed, but that snowballs into a full quarter panel replacement, but I run out of welding wire, then I decide to swap the cam out, so I pulled the motor apart, and the next thing I know is it's been 4 years and everything is in various state of disrepair and I don't know where anything is anymore. It's like a Trosley cartoon around here.

 

Then you've something to look forward to: Trosley cartoons usually end nicely, w/a kickass-mill, fabulous bodywork/paint, showcar detailing & wonderful drivability, getting all the cute-well-built-girls, trophies, & sometimes selling the car for dbl-stupid money... .
My stuff doesn't work out quite that well... ;( . .
Marcus...

 

EXACTLY! This is my actual order of operations even if my plan was good in the beginning.

 

Some of your decisions are gong to vary depending on the car you are building and whether using an engine similar to the one that came in the car. The problem with installing a complete floor before you sit it on the chassis is whether or not everything will clear. That new floorbord runs into the bottom of the firewall and thats where many engine clearance problems happen. You may be able to just lay the repop floor on the chassis without the body and determine if its going to clear a different transmission or a distributor. Thats why I would always install the engine and trans before reflooring a body. If however you are removing a 283 and replacing it with a 350 and a 350 turbo, probably no worries. Just remember that a lot of firewalls have had to be modified over the years in hot rods, so check before welding.

A variation of opinion above, but they all have merit. Again, the car of choice makes some difference. I think everyone would agree that the location and size of the tires used is a major decision on how the finished car will look. Its a lot more critical to get the rear tires just right on a fendered 32 than on many later model cars. I remember a thread a while back where a guy found that his newly narrowed rear end was 1/2" too wide. He was in a quandry about what to do. I decided that when I narrow my rear end for the 32, I will make it slightly narrower than what I want it to be. That allows me room for some error and I can make shims to get that fender to tire just perfect. If I make it just right to begin with, and the tire does rub......I'll be the one in a quandry. So I'm going to try to give myself room to adjust somewhat.

I mention all that because of the difference in opinion about getting tires and wheels for the build. One big problem that many builders have is that the wheels and tires they built with were slightly different from the ones they buy for the finished car. Allowing for some adjustment can help if a builder is changing rearends or narrowing. I bought my tires and wheels because that will be the starting point for getting my rear end correct. I hope they don't dry rot. I would buy the rims you plan to use and then shop for some used tires as rims offset may vary from manufacturer to manufacturer.

 

This is how I would work it. ^^^^^
Build structure first then work around it.

As for build in general I generally shoot for a good solid roller then drive train then body. Ugly and fast trumps pretty and pushing it any day. Sometimes when I am short of cash I do busy work until I have the cash/parts I need to continue on.

 

This guy gets it!

 

You forgot 3.5, being sold as a #4, but is in fact a #3 with lipstick. I've seen more than a few of those.
Not germane to the question, but be careful out there, fellas.

 

My Ford, I jumped into the brakes and front end work. Also did a ton of cleaning and cleaned up a lot of the chassis... got a nasty-ass spider bite too. Shot some paint on the front half of the chassis making it nicer to work on.

 

Oooh squirrel!

 

Hello,

When we bought our Model A coupe, it was my brother’s idea to clean it up and get it running. So, his point of view was to be able to sell the motor and driveline as a running motor, etc. We got it running and after a couple of driving around days, we started to work on it. That did not last as he got a wild hair to sell the Model A Coupe to a friend and his other close friend offered a good price for his 51 Oldsmobile two door lowered rake mild custom sedan.

So, a new 348 /280 hp 1958 Impala showed up on our driveway for his next adventure that would last for the next three years of weekly racing.
Narrow daily driveway action... but, with a happy face!

Now, after three years of racing, cruising and doing all things teenager with the Impala, it got use as one last thing, a tow car for our next adventure, a 1940 Willys Coupe modified for the Gas Coupe and Sedan Class racing. And perhaps some Friday/Saturday night cruising. Finally, a possible daily driver to high school for me.

But, our journey started in the backyard garage area. Everything was removed that could be removed, except for the pristine Willys Coupe body. We crawled under the car and cleaned up what was hanging around in a backyard, for the last couple of months to a year. We primed the cleaned up frame and painted it black. Little to no rust and that was fine with us. Then we gave everything a couple of coats of red primer to keep it in fairly good condition while we worked on the build.

I thought of several colors, the instant we painted the whole car, body parts, doors, etc, the red primer color. It was my brother’s idea to work on the build, get it running, get everything lined up/modified and in great working order before we paint the final color. It was my idea to paint it a nice color, now that we painted the red primer. The body and parts did not need any kind of body work or damage control.

It was his final say to tell me that with all of the modifications we were going to do, why have a finished coat of paint that we might mess up during our take apart/put back together project? We did not like to do body work, minimal is ok… Luckily, this Willys Coupe after we prepped the removable parts and worked on finishing the body, did not need any body work or replacing worn/rusty parts.

Jnaki

I cannot fathom having the finished paint on first, then tip toe around the modifications to be added or corrected. Even the best builder has their errors and accidental “bonks” on various surfaces. My brother said that “we” would select a good color once we got it running and upholstered.

There would be more films and photos of our build, but over the years, the films and photos got damaged or lost somewhere during our house moves.

So, if we did get it painted, these are the choices that were his choice and mine.
a bright yellow or silver

 

When you get 1/2 way done and it`s in 100`s of pieces. A true barn find with an affordable price will show up.

 

That's probably going to happen.

In perspective though, that's OK. Chances are that barn find is still going to need floor work, and a quarter patch, etc. The beauty of replacing the entire floor is that whether the floor has a couple soft spots or whether you could fit a human through the hole, either way it all gets repaired the same.

 

Having witnessed a beautiful Black Nomad that was a 3.5 get a new rear floor, I want to mention that you need to have and test fit everything back there before final weld. They are a monkey puzzle of parts in the rear interior and the underside of the floor.