Aussies - SR Plates...your thoughts?

Hi all,

I am a queenslander and very interested in the varying rules, that seem to be drifting into our hobby.

I have also been an ASRF member for over ten years and still run by myself (no Club)

It might be worth your while to check out the National hot rod guidelines that have been released in the Dept of transport web pages....basicly they are designed for full rego vehicles.

As I understand this , if you build a car within these specs you could rego either full or on concessional.

I have had cars on both systems...the biggest problem is the fairy ****d restorers (coneheads) that spot you going for a cruise on the weekend and them make it their business to dob you in to some other idiot that makes it his duty to phone you and let you know that you were seen.....utter **** in my book.

I am not a rich visa card rodder and I build my own cars usually top out at around $20,000, my major concern when building is to make sure that they can stop, (boosted drums work well).
Too many other ****heads out there with jap **** and 4 wheel disc brakes that want to jump infront of me in traffic (another piss off).

All I can suggest is that you build your cars with full rego in mind and then take the concessional rego if you want to.

Thats my two bobs worth.

 

Prob coz Con knows that the ****ers (errr, Engineers) wont touch rods on repro frames with a bargepole. Theyve been told....

The whole system in Vic is an absolute joke atm - we used to be the leaders when it came to rods, kustoms, hotties and the Drags in this state, now we are a lauging stock and lag behind the rest of the country badly.

Thanx to **** ROADS and our State Govt.....

Striper PM me if you want the drum, Ill give it to ya straight.

Rat

 

Danny,
Con says I wouldn't get full rego because I've cut my (original) frame. I have a 10" Z in the back and a 2" sweep in the front. Also issues with suicide front end and some other stuff. I don't believe him 100% but by the same token I don't feel like taking the high road when I can just mosey on down the low road.

Chebby, No real update on the 90 day thing. Late next year he said.

Frank, PM on its way.

Pete

 

Hi Pete,

Looking through the vic roads website, all that is needed for a frame modification is an engineers certificate? I would have thought just about every engineer approved hot rod woudl have had some sort of frame mods done to it at some stage.

This is the sort of thing that makes me sceptical about Con and the scheme. If he said to you, this is the process for getting it fully engineered and here are some of the issues you may face and as an option we can offer the street rod ref etc I would be more inclined to believe him and have a little more faith in the scheme. I've heard almost nothing but "it cant be rego'd" stories about Con which makes me belive he doesn't give honest advice, becuase I know for a fact a couple of those cars did infact receive full reg.

Anyway, rumours and heresay so I cant really make a valued judgement.

Danny

 

Danny,
I think you are spot on. I am smart enough to see what Con is doing but at the same time, if he can provide me a quick, cheap(er) and easy way to get on the road, I am thinking I might as well use it to my advantage. Of course it will all turn to **** for me if the 90 day log book scheme falls over.

Pete

 

Thanks mate, looks like full reg for me after I come back from the states

 

Hi Pete,

Totally agree. If it suits your purposes it's a good deal. One thing that concerns me is if people start to move away from full reg towards this scheme becuase of the advice given by Con, it may reduce even more the engineers willing to become Vic Roads signatories. Reduced numbers of engineers will see less options for those still going for full reg and more influence given to Con and the perveyors of the street rod reg.

Danny

 

Hmmm, cunning plan.

Probably not far from the truth. On the flip side of that, if Con and the ASRF have more influence, maybe the DOTARS guidelines have a better chance of being adopted and full rego might become a more reasonable option for more rodders.

 

the dotars scheme is supposed to be a "full rego "scheme ,that will be implimented across all states ,it is being pushed by various people who have something to get from it being implimented most of these are engineers like manteriz and the ASRF who are becoming quite pushy,they are now offering paid positions for their staff etc ,whereas previously it was done by volenteers and now they have to make money to stay afloat and the only product they will have is your rego and membership ,we all know how big buisiness usually ****s it all up for the little guy ,i believe this will be the same , i think as they are making money and wish to make more ,so you will be required to be a member of the asrf and be limited to the choice of engineers,who will be recieving kickbacks this way ,and lining their pockets,i have heard the asrf say they organise events etc but have you noticed the best events are organised by a bunch of guys who have little or no affiliation with asrf events :RAT DAY,COSTAS BBQ,etc i would prefer not to be a member of the asrf cause i was for years and they did nothing except take fees an whinge like upand coming politicians,i hope the scheme does not blanket australia as this will mean when some clown with his finger in their pie will make rules we all have no choice but to follow ,Id go for full rego as your resale price will be alot better and i dont need no ****wits telling me when i can or cant drive MY car,do you????read up on the rules via the asrf website and youl see its just gunna line a few pockets and limit your options ,the guys pushn for it are the guys who will be robbing you later

 

building a car with full rego is not that hard you are just building a safer vehicle most times so i cant see whynot go the extra yards its your *** in the event of an accident

 

I would beg to differ. Building a full reg car should NOT be that hard but it is for one simple reason; in Victoria there is no cohesive set of guidelines that you can fall back on when having your car engineered. You are at the total whim of the engineer's interpretation of the Vic Roads engineering guidelines. He may choose to intrept those guidelines as nessesitating a role bar or headrests, perhapes split bones are ok this week but not next or from one engineer to another. Add to the confusion the very real issue of orginal ch***is Vs repop. At what point does an original ch***is become a repro, when one crossmember is replaced, when two or is it ok with all original crossmembers but stamped rails? No original rails = no full rego unless you meet the 2006 ADRs.

You can see what I'm getting at, its a gamble aiming for full reg unless you have a steel body and an orginal set of rails. Full rego has nothing to do with safety and everything to do with politics.

Danny

 

Just a quick update on the 90 day log book scheme. Vicroads will be holding a meeting at the Ballarat Light Car clubrooms on Saturday 25th of November to discuss this scheme.
I don't know if the organisers of this meeting are aware that the Ballarat Road Rodders will be conducting their annual rod run on this weekend and it will be based in the adjoining building, with the 1/8 mile drags on the same day at the airport which these meeting rooms are a part of. So not only will they be discussing the log book scheme they will be able to witness first hand how popular hot rodding is and hopefully get on with making some relavent decisions towards rego for hot rods in Victoria.

 

****** it all - I've got my daughter's Ballet concert on Nov 25th, so I can't go.

Can some-one keep me informed of the outcome of this meeting, please?

 

But seriously how many RAT RODS have we seen actually get rego?

 

plenty ......youve obviously not attended a Rat Day in Sydney

 

Nopes. live in melbourne. land of hard to get rego.

 

Ah man..I was born in 1970, arent a redneck, but you're giving me the ****s.

I Know we live in the present, but your rationale on safety concerns is grating on me..collapsible safety columns? why stop there? Airbags in every rod! Its not 1976 any more...
This argument is so ****ing circular.
I guess at the heart of it is that we arent being allowed to build what we want, but we arent being told what we can build either. if we have to be governed as we are a danger to ourselves and others, ****ing well set out some rules that are interpretable! otherwise ****** off and let me spear my chest in my rat rod.

Four bars are awful.

 

i did not attack you in any way and i too was born in 1970 ,i work in the helicopter industry and have been present on MANY mercy dashes to hospitals via chopper from people involed in car accidents im sure if youd seen only 1 of these youre opinion may differ,i hope you do spear yourselve you uninformed ****wit ,im sure if you have already built a decent safe rod you may well agree but until then im sure you can build what ever car you want but youll be trailering it to meets as it probaly wont p*** rego ,and thereis more than just you on the road there is other people on there too, just imagine if your hairpin car dropps a clevis and kills some kids in an oncoming car ,or do you have kids yourself and we all know rodding is a heavily family involved hobby and do you want to risk your kids lives?
ps if i have given you the ****s my work here is done ****wit!
youve failed to add any decent content to this post just abuse so you reap what you sow

 

Wow, what have I produced?

I was born in '66 so I am the senior one here. Stop it kids!

 

sorry striper it just pisses me off when people put looks in front of safety as it is usually someone else who ends up s****ing them off the road,and ps im not a kid ive lived more an experienced more than most people your age (no disrespect)

 

It's true that the rego thing has gone on for too long without any good results.
But lets get some facts straight about SR plates.
SR is not rego, it's a permit to drive an unregistered car on club events and the club is the ASRF, which is why you must be an ASRF member.
Con is not the only person who does inspections, if you want to know who else does, contact him.
SR is an accountable system, Con has regular meetings with the authorities, all details of your car are kept, you must supply detailed photos.
Con inspects your car every year when the permit has to be renewed.
My own '28 rpu has SR plates, so I have had firsthand experience.
A friend is building a 34 plymouth sedan which is a highboy, has been converted to 2 door and widened, has split wishbone beam axle f/end, Con recently inspected it and only requires minor changes.
If you want to gat the facts, why don't you speak to the man himself?

 

Hmm,

I respect your position but dont get your point? What is your point? That full reg automatically makes rods safer, or safety is the most important factor when deciding which cars receive registration? I think you're shooting down your own arguments.

Ok, so you dont like being on brains detail when it comes to car accidents. Me neither but how many of them are either caused by, or involve, a hot rod? Not many. How many involve a high powered car with an inexperienced 17yo behind the wheel? Or alcohol? Or excessive speed?

So if what you're saying is, full rego keeps the unsafe cars off the road, I say unreservedly, ******** and I say it for two reasons.

1. The majority of cars involved in accidents are not hot rods. The majority of accidents involving hot rods are not due to engineering issues, they are speed, not driving to the conditions, alcohol et al. Alcohol related deaths 100,000. Hairpin failure: 0. Therefor full reg or otherwise when it comes to hot rods doesnt affect road safety at all. A hundred less hot rods on the road will not affect the statistics: fatalities and accidents are overwhelmingly the product of alcohol, exccess speed and driver inexperience.

2. If by your argument, hair pins or split rods are unsafe, then why are they allowed on club registration? Surely only driving it to and from events doesn't somehow make the componentry or engineering safer? If it's unsafe, its unsafe and shouldn't be allowed on the road. Either its too unsafe to be out there driving on public streets or its not.

Again, I state, the real issue is a lack of consistant guidelines of which to build a rod to in Victoria. If build safety is paramount to you, surely a consistant set of guidliness would only enhance the quality of cars being produced? Stop the unsafe practises from falling through the cracks and p***ing on the whim or interpretation of an engineer?

Danny

 

Because in my personal experience, it has been hard to get a consistant, straight story from the man regarding this issue. I've called him on maybe three differing occasions and received a different answer to the same question every time. Also, his singular focus on SR at the expense of open and honest discussion on registration options lends me to think he is a pretty unreliable source of information. Again, only my personal experience.

Danny

 

So tell me, how can an cobled together sheet metal body, which needs only p*** 1928 ADRS, sitting on top on 80 year old rails be possible safer then a moden steel stamped and boxed ch***is with a high quality 2006 ADR p***ing gl*** body? It cant possibly be, yet that is what you're advocating. You wave the flag for safety on one hand, yet support the use of componants that can be much unsafer then the modern replacements. So which is it, safety or authenticity? Imagine if you could go get a ch***is shop to build you a ch***is using all brand new hgih quality steel componentry and sit a fully steeled out gl*** body on it, complete with three point belt mounts etc etc and go get it fully registered. Now that must be safer then some of the rods that are on the road.

Danny

 

These are good points Danny. My own engineer suggested talking to Con to avoid some of the '********' requirements he was imposing upon me. He has to sign his name to parts and workmanship on a car that is capable of being driven day in day out for a lifetime (just like a showroom Commodore). Therefore it is understandable that the expectations and requirements of the enginneer are extremely high. I fully support him in that. It is the lack of a more consistent and suitable set of guidelines that forces him to ***ess to this level.

By his own admission many of the requirements are superflous for my situation but I could sell the car to someone who drives the ring off it on a daily basis and does zero maintenance on it. It would be a registered car just like that VE Commodore.

The engineer knows we are enthusiasts who maintain our cars to a higher level than most and that given the usage, the safety requirements of the SR system are adequate. Strangely the SR manual is very similar to the proposed DOTARS guidelines.

So the main arguement seems to be a consistent set of guidelines is required. As far as I can see they exist in Victoria under the SR banner and everywhere else under DOTARS.

 

Hi Mate,

A friend of mine recently said to me, arguing with someone on the internet is like the special olympics. Actually never mind, that joke will probably spark a whole nother debate lol. What I wanted to say is, everything I post is done with a certain respect to you and your opinion. I'm totally comfortable with arguing the issue and not the person if that makes any sense.

I dont think you could possibly make that statement with a working knowledge of the situation in Vic. By you own admission you had three engineers with three opinions. This is the very point I'm trying to make. It shouldn't come down to engineer opinion, it should come down to whether or not a car meets certain guidelines, just like a roadworthy inspection.

I think you missunderstand me. I agree, fully engineered cars may on average be safe built. But again, thats my poinnt, if they let "unsafe" cars on the road with SR, then the whole issue is not about "safety". Why let unsafe cars on the road fullstop if safety is the driving issue. If it's unsafe its unsafe end of story.

well yes and no. perhapes i should have said, how many accidents involve hot rods and are caused by engineering issues. compared to say, how many are cause by speed, fatigue, inexperience etc.

a whole dozen? how many "safe" modern cars on full reg suffer parts failure, either through insuffecient maintenance or parts defect? whole series of cars have been recalled for parts defects. I dont need an engineers certificate to drive my 30 year old toyota wagon with 465,000 kms on the clock and I bet it has more fatigued parts then most rods?

four bars are not as safe as a 7 air bag equiped volvo. four bars are safer then driving at excessive speeds or drunk. you see my point? why are we quibbling over issues that have no real affect on road safety? my thoughts are four bars, wishbones, hair pins can all be engineered to the point of being safe. as safe as abs equiped traction control modern front ends? no. safe enough to not be the cause of an accident. yes.

i

im not arguing for national guidelines. i'm arguing for the ability to know in advance how i can build my hot rod and not be at the mercy of the interpretation of an engineer. im arguing for the ability to not gamble 20k on the ability to drive it at the end of the day on full rego.

you would have to be a brave man to argue drink driving, driver fatigue or driver inexperience statistics are invalid.

just becuase you have tasted success, doesnt mean ****. ask around and i bet the number who havent been ****ed over are far outweighed by the number who have.

Danny

 

Thanks for your insight on how SR rego works for you. Its great to hear a positive story, given the other stories I've heard. It flies against the stories I've heard from others.

SR is "Special Registration" not Street Rod rego, it is open to all clubs that wish to apply to be a member of the scheme - according to a lengthy conversation I recently had with a member of the RTA. So as the scheme stands now - as the ASRF has taken up the offer to manage this restrictive registration scheme, you have to be a member of the ASRF to gain access to this scheme. It is not restricted to just the ASRF. Remember I got all of this from a guy at the RTA.

I raised these concerns as I fear for the long term viability of the scheme as it stands at the moment, and this is echoed by others I have spoken to. All its going to take is one FW, and the house of cards could tumble, then we'd all be up **** creek, me included!

 

You tell 'em Psycho....., you got the nail on the head champ.

Hilbilly Jim, youre forgetting one thing - you live in NSW, NOT Vic mate. Go back and re read my post and pay particular attention to what I said about Vic once being the leader in this dept and now being the last and I think you'll find that Vic Rds (under the tutelage of our "fiscally responsible" State Govt has become the all time double dipper/revenue raiser for them..

Ive been thru the "system" recently in Vic....its a FARCE and yes it NOT the first car I've had engineered either. So pls don't go comparing apples to bananas man - it simply doent work that way.

I you can't get a safe, well engineered, road proven ride with std early Ford running gear registered, you then have no hope with a real rat rod or a compe***ion inspired ride. And if you do, either your engineer likes you or you've greased him in some way.

Why?

B/C in their infinite wisdom **** Rds have made the ENGINEER accountable for any further probs down the track. Their public liablity insurance has gone thru the roof and there are still engineers on the V*** list that wont TOUCH a rod, even ones ive dealt with in the past, others have dropped put of the system all together. They all want to keep their ***es clean simple as that?....and who can blame them, thanx to the ****heads in our rego offices....

The fish rots at the head boys....it IS WHAT IT IS.

That being said, there are other ways....

Rat

 

Frank!!!! He says in his sternest voice!

 

Hilbilly I hear ya, and I pushed mate and like I said, there are other ways.

The reality is that the current system in Vic doesnt really work.....safety never was, is or will be the REAL issue for an engineer to rubber stamp the car as it NEVER is with speed cameras, fines, red lite cameras and all the ******** measures the Govt has introduced to balance the states coffers/books more easily.

Anyone who thinks the Govt gives a rats *** about people killing themsleves has a misguided view on how the world really works.

This is nothing new...goes back many, many years - if you tell the m***es hard enough and long enough, eventually the MUST believe you. "Safety" has become a multi BILLION dollar industry and whilst no one can argue that it is important to protect people - the point I am making is that it is no PROFITABLE to do so....wonder what think tanks came up with this one? History is just repeating itself with newer tech thats all.....

All in the name of Safety ?

********......