To bad you’re not a few hundred miles closer I’m sure I could find a center for you with a 3.0 or even a 3.25 witch is my favorite street gear. One thing I would look at is the pinion nut and see if it has come loose or backed off.
Atch....I'll have to rummage through my shop to check if I still have a 8" Ford 3.00 ring and pinion. If I do and you need it it's yours for the price of shipping a USPS flat rate box. Lynn
Jack it up and get the load off the drive line then see if you can wiggle the yoke, sounds like a loose pinion bearing. It's not a bad job the remove the pinion support and rebuild it and stick it back in. Reuse the same pinion shim and bolt it back in no need to check back lash. On a running used gear set you do not want to change the back lash as that is the wear into the gear set and changing that will change the pattern worn and cause the gears to wear.
Gear ratio wise it is all about how you drive the car/truck and how you use it. 3.0 gears with a 28 inch tall tire and a 1 to 1 trans ratio in theory do 2520 rpm at 70 and 2880 at 80. Every engine that gets serous road use has it's happy spot where it just runs right and gets the most reasonable gas mileage on the long roads. My OT 2K Cad DTS would cruise at 90 all day long but on 80 mph highways had a 7 mpg difference between 75 and 80 cruising down the road.
Speaking of wear patterns, you also have to be aware of what type ring and pinion set you have. There are three kinds; hunting, partial hunting, and non-hunting. This has to do with the respective tooth counts on each gear and ratio. An example of a non-hunting set would be a 3.00 ratio with a 13T pinion and 39T ring gear. During one full revolution of the ring gear, each pinion tooth will contact only three ring teeth, no others. This will repeat at each ring gear revolution and develop a specific wear pattern. A partial hunting set is similar but the individual pinion teeth will engage more of the ring gear teeth. As an example, a 3.25 set with a 12T pinion and 39T ring gear will contact different ring teeth during each revolution but after four revolutions the pattern will repeat. Again, you'll get a specific wear pattern. So with the hunting sets, every pinion tooth contacts every ring gear tooth sooner or later. The partial and non-hunting sets should be marked on one tooth on each gear so they can be 'clocked' correctly. Usually done with paint, don't assume it's a hunting set if you don't see any marks. The OEMs prefer partial or non-hunting sets as they wear better and are generally quieter. Failure to clock them on reassembly will accelerate wear.
What I do is create a file folder on my computer and store that type of info. Then when I get ready to do something I haven't done in a while, I look in the folder and refresh my memory bank.........
Thanks man. I've always wondered about the same teeth contacting each other and what effect that would have on the wear pattern(s). In my computer that folder is called ...car parts/misc/information. That's where this info will be going.
Thanks man. I've wondered for years about what, if any, wear pattern(s) would be created with the same teeth contacting each other.
@ekimneirbo @atch , along those lines, often I search for data and technical information and find it on forums, and rather than bookmark or Favorite them, I'll just cut and paste only the info I need on to a simple text document. File the pages in the pertinent folders, real easy to read, and print, if required for garage use.
All the OEMs except Ford...they're the only ones with non-hunting ratios! usually a yellow paint dab, often with a matching grinding mark on end of the teeth. I wonder if anyone can ever hear any noise if it's installed wrong?
Just adding a bit of information if you get a used 8 inch center section. All 8-inch have the same 28 spline axles, which are also the same size as the 9 inch 28 spline axles. So as long as the used center section you get is from an 8 inch, it will fit your rearend. Well assuming the pinion flange has the same dimensions, but I have not had any issues with that being different in the few 8 inch rears I have dealt with.
@atch 15 mpg isn't bad like others have said, There are afew that know me & seen My 30 A , all steel with fenders No chop I was running a stock 2 w d S-10 rear 2002 $75 from pick a part . Posi , 3:42 gear 30 tall tire 350 tight converter ,2,500 ish for close to 10 years with a engine making Over 600 pounds of torque , 100 plus in 1/8th. 10 miles a gallon ,can not use as a reference for mpg, Not for sure if 8 inch weaker or stronger then S-10 rear , You mention you wanted to up Grade in future to 4 speed , how about a 4 sd I Call a over drive , 4 th gear's 1,2,3 kind of close ratio , 4 O-D I think started in 70s 3:00 gear not bad , I never got around to try a 2:70ish gear to see how it would do , but my combos Over 600 Hp & Tq thoe
Okay, I have a warmed over 327, TH350 and an 8" out of a Maverick. Rear had 2.79 gears and I left them in while finishing the car with plans to go to 3.55's. The 2.79's are perfect for what I do. Around town is good and engine is happy at 2200 cruising on the freeway. If you have 3.00's, I'd say like others, run them. EDIT: Oops forgot to say '34 pickup.
Doesn't matter how much power you're making , it's only important if you can apply it . Spinning your tires is reasonably stress free on the driveline . Hook up 250 HP. & You run the risk of breaking things .
Some great info on this thread! Saved some of it to the PC for future reference. I'm running an 8 Inch 3.0 behind a 350 Turbo 383 stroker at 365HP/ 400+ torque. Limited slip from Yukon. Fun to drive mileage is okay. I don't worry about how many gallons per mile I get, I enjoy the smiles per mile I have. It's held up well for sever years now under my frequent abuse.
The MPG is important when you have a limited tank and/or drive long distances.Deep 3 something gears or 4s are fun around town if you can modulate traction, but suck at speed for long stretches. I'm not there yet, but hope that changes some. I've got 3.42s and will tame them some with tall tires. Currently have short tires and it's like cruising in second. Haven't taken it out on the open highway yet.
I agree that for mpg and highway cruising comfort, an engine running at 2200-2500 rpm is a lot better than one running at 3000 or more. The 3000 rpms don't hurt the engine, but it does reduce mpg and makes for more noise inside on extended highway drives. Not that our old cars are exactly quiet from wind noise. If you have an OD trans, you can run the 3.55 or higher numerically gears and still have lower rpm for highway. If a straight 1 to 1 high gear non-OD trans, then a 3.0 is a good choice of gear for a less performance oriented car. It's getting hard to find 8 inch in the junkyards, and the 3.55 factory gear are even more scarce. Some Pintos and Must II had the 3.55 gears. Most 8 inch you find are 2.80 or 3.00 gears; and almost guaranteed open diff. The 8 inch is a good design, basically similar to a scaled down 9 inch, with the third small pinion nose bearing support. As I said previous post, the axles are 28 spline and are the same diam as 9 inch 28 spline axles. Strength wise, Ford used 8 inch behind regular small blocks. They knew it wasn't good use with big block or high performance small blocks, those got the 9 inch.
We think similarly apparently. I do that as well. I got an old laminator years ago when I retired. It was in a cabinet not working and I got it to work again. Laminators are cheap now. Anyway, I laminate things like that and put them in the drawer with certain things that I only use occasionally.....or I make reference charts and put them on walls or cabinets. That way when I do something the info is right there and the lamination keeps it from greasy fingers and normal deterioration. Great for saving instructions, data, cross refs,charts.
200R4. 3.70-ish R&P It'll accelerate easier (less throttle needed) and in overdrive cut the revs to less than you currently see. Combined may improve mileage and definitely reduce wear and tear. 200R4 should be an almost bolt in.
@38Chevy454 , I concur. When I first put my 47 coupe on the road, it had a 351W, c4 and Ford 8" with 3.00. I recently installed a 700R4 using an adapter from Advance, and am currently putting another center section together for it, with 3.55. Car was great driving with the 3.00, but should work out better all around with the lower first gear effect, and the overdriven 3.55. Win/win.
Mike, in my 36 tudor, I ran a 3.55 in the 8" behind a 350/4speed with 28" tall skins. It would pull around 15-16 mpg around 60-65 mph turning +/- 3000 rpm(if memory serves!). I realize the weight difference between a 36 Ford and your panel. Happy hunting. Mitch
I mentioned that Clarence weights 3,500# (+/-). It's been weighed at least three times so that's pretty accurate. IIRC 3,500# is about what most of the muscle cars of the late 60's weighed. Since most (actually ALL) of them had a LOT more hp than Clarence I realize that acceleration won't live up to my memories of those days. I'll just have to keep dreaming of the day when I'll be able to drive my nailhead Model A. I know it won't make hp like Tommy Ivo/Tony Nancy but it should be a ton-of-fun; 400hp in a 3,000# car (both estimated). THANKS EVERYONE for all of your comments, suggestions, and advice. If it ever warms up enough to work in my drafty uninsulated shop I'll use some of this newfound knowledge.
Hello, The gear ratio for your sedan delivery is good. Enough power from the 327 to get where you are going. The power is there, but for getting 15 mpg, to me that is good. We had two 327 powered cars. One was my 327 four barrel in the 65 El Camino. For flat out empty bed with the tail gate down, it got 18 mpg. Going to San Jose from Long Beach and back several times had the tailgate down for better air flow and help in MPG. The racers at the drags, for whatever short time the runs were, also left the tailgate down for smoother air flow. Through time trials, they figured out that the rear gate needed to be down for air flow. So, for open highways like the road to the local deserts for motorcycle racing, the back had to be up and so, the mpg was not 18 mpg. Our 327 powered El Camino normally got 15 mpg. Later on for normal around town driving in the 327 powered 1940 Ford Sedan Delivery, we also got 15 mpg. We were comfortable with that. When we used the A/C during the summer road trips, it was a little less. So, for your sedan delivery with similar power, it is/was a nice road worthy, reliable cruiser, no need to worry about amount of teeth in a new gear ratio, charts or anything else. You set it up with a good combination. Get a similar new set of gears and be done with it. Sure it is nice to have all of the charts, thinking about getting better gas mileage, but for the small increment, it is not worth the trouble. Current gears are 3.0 to 1… That is a good ratio, so keep it. Enough HP to do the job. The dinky increments, with 2.8 or that range, if any, won’t make much difference with the loss of power when the back of the cave is loaded with stuff and a steep hill climb, grade is up ahead. Jnaki Your decision to make the running gear was your choice and a good one it was. So, just get a new set of gears (3.0) and your problem is solved. No fuss, no bother, YRMV
Driving with the tailgate down generally HURTS the mileage , see consumer reports . ( Even the myth busters proved it )
Hello, Well, consumer reports did not own a 65 El Camino traveling from Long Beach to San Jose on several types of highways. Almost 400 miles one way, in very early morning drives or 9 am traffic after the rush hour crazies. It was a regular thing going up with tailgate down, coming home was usually tail gate up with the back loaded with stuff heading home for the holidays or family gatherings. It was a straight through drive with the tail gate down and empty bed, normal air in the air shocks. No stop and go driving as long as I stayed on the three different highways or freeways. 101, I-5/99 or a leisurely cruise down 395 for a dry desert highway most of the time. The air flight took only one hour, but it was costly for a round trip fare. Jnaki In real life situations provided plenty of real life driving averages. Tailgate down, smoother air flow in the El Camino. Tail gate up, air circulates and gets a blockage to try and get over the tailgate to freedom. Then it curls again to finally straighten out and flow back. Blockage creates a lower gas mileage as it hinders air flow. If the tail gate was down, which is an odd feeling to drive with it down, the air is simply flowing over the cab and down into the flat area without any other blockages. A smooth flow out and no curling after going over the tailgate up. Real life testing, as it was a long drive and every penny was useful for a college student. YRMV When I got the last ride home with the bed full of college apartment stuff, my surfboard, small barbecue grill, tools, school boxes of stuff, all packed into the rear bed, tied down, even with a canvas tarp covering the stuff, the gas mileage was not the highest going down those highways/freeways. Any impediment to smooth air flow caused a ripple to lower the overall gas mileage. Note: not a drag race car, so the rear gears were below 3.50 or stock as it came from the Fremont, CA factory. Once I just had a longboard tied down and it, too caused more swirls, as I could see the old leaves and stuff swirling around with the tailgate up. Wind path blockage was definitely noted, but there was no other way to bring my surfboard with me to check out the various coastal waves on known stopping points along the southerly route back to Long Beach. To me, the long drives always had a different purpose, than just step on the gas and go North or South. The 65 El Camino ran fine all of the time and was a fun car to drive everywhere. My wife and I drove the El Camino along the coastal route North/South plenty of times and it created lower gas mileage due to the short blasts to get over the coastal, curvy road angles and short hill climbs. After knowing the gas mileage, it was noted that the full tank was the only other impediment to lower gas mileage.
The 8" rear was used in some Mustangs and possibly other cars with the 351W-2V and 351C-2V engine. As for some gears containing recycled steel, that is not at all a necessarily bad thing. So long as the proper chemistry is maintained, whether all of the iron and other alloying metals come from scrap or virgin rust doesn't matter.
( Juuuust a little off topic) but.... Although it makes sense to me to drive with the tailgate DOWN for better MPG Although I have read/"heard" that is NOT true! Although.....big Mickey Mouse 'ears' outside mirrors DO hurt MPG ! Although...driving with the windows UP improve MPG Anybody have any definite info on the subject ? (Atch...I would replace your gear with an 8.8. Stronger/cheaper/better ratios available FROM the junkyards) 6sally6
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