Running a Ford 8.8 upside down AND BACKWARDS, pinion in rear ??

Im up late and that is because the mind or what is left of it, has been conjuring a mechancial nightmare.

I have a hot rod application that requires a rear mounted engine, a full length auto trans, a ford 8.8 rear. It is a SBF engine so there really are no OEM junkyard transverse solutions, nor are there any quality or affordable transaxle solutions.

The vehicle is supremely short in the rear and rear axle cant move backwards. So I have a very limited longitudinal space to fit those parts together. I could move a cab wall forward with a big recess, lots of body work, like a pantera, and have my back against a harmonic balancer. Even then, likely not enough length even with a pair of 1350 u joints welded together as a driveshaft, would the end to end fit. Even a powerglide shorty wont fix this short space.

Ok next idea was to use a transfer case of some kind with a gear direction reverser. Point the tailshaft at the front bumper, flip the power back like an old Casale V-Drive system and feed the rear end like God intended it. I dont like it..... but I ended up with an SCS gearbox, 1:1, 3000hp capable, 12.2 inch offset between I and O shafts, I and O on same side. Its a V-Drive without the Casale name on it and without the V and quite robust. SCS makes monster truck and tractor puller gearboxes (dropbox) for driveshaft to output shaft height corrections.

I have been contemplating another option to keep the engine further forward in ch***is, keep it pointed as God intended----- tailshaft to rear bumper---- and utilize the SCS gearbox as God intended it to be.

I would like to INVERT the 8.8 (not flip, I mean pinion flange aiming at the car behind me!) which will give me Clockwise rotation on the pinion ensuring the standard ge****t is loaded on the DRIVE side of the ge****t, not the coast side. This corrects the first major defect called out for all "junkyard axle direction reversal" attempts.
To resolve the second conflict, axle shaft wrong direction----
I would further like to flip the axle upside down to correct the AXLE DIRECTION back to forward (while maintaining ge****t load on drive side).

The SCS gearbox would be behind the rear end, input shaft driven by a relatively short shaft OR potentially just a slip yoke to 1 9/16-24 spline gear shaft. The output would be a u-jointed shorty driveshaft, really short, but likely in the 12 inch range.

The housing will become high pinion which causes concern with oiling, I believe it may lose strength to some extent but I am already confused on strengths and weakenesses of HIGH and LOW pinion housings so....

Normally the ring gear is driven DOWN in CW rotation. If altered as described the ring gear will now be driven UP. Is this a concern?

I have quick performance torino big bearing ends and will have appropriate 9 inch axles for narrowing the housing. SO brake backing plate geometry will be corrected back to stock format with disc. Perches, etc all get remedied specifc to ch***is.

This is NOT a drag racing ch***is or car. It will not be launched, dead hook, etc. Worst case it smokes some undersized tires for the HP available.

So in summary the questions are:
Feasibility, contradictions, missed thoughts, oiling, venting, strength loss.
procedure:
Upside down, then backwards 180 degrees, Clockwise input rotation.
Essentially turn this "rear end" into a pseudo IRS/IFS Ford front end.

I appreciate the input an help folks. The gearbox was had for a song, by luck, and I should have purchased a lottery ticket with it..... thats how much a smoking deal it was. Without it, this is a dead issue.

WHY?? Someone will ask... weight over rear axle to provide improved traction on drive tires at high speed, mitigate the difficulty in fitment of engine, trans, exhaust and replacement front end into spaces not fit for the parts needing a home. And its rat rod level cool. Engine can hide behind the frontal area of the p***enger compartment (aero improvement).

 

Castle V drive. Only have to look to the wheel standers to see what to do.

 

No help , I would think able to flip
Up side down & add more lube & vent
Different.
Do not know for sure, Curious to know
If there is weakness / disadvantage
Maybe the gear teeth root the way they are cut, weaker in that Direction ?

 

60s Toronado/Eldorado transaxle?

 

I spent a few more hours scouring tidbits from Currie and a few other sources. Doesnt appear to be any complications SANS LUBRICATION. Currie has a solution for a Ford 9 pinion to lubricate correct, naturally, with splash oiling. It is a modified chunk they build, a new part, not an OEM that was adapted. Nothing like it for the 8.8.

High9 is a company doing something similar and also has a solution for the Ford 9, again new chunk. Their deal is raise oil level as half of the cure. Lots of mud truckers raise the oil level as a cure but they also burn up an equal nuber of pinions. From the True High9 company, the other 50% of the cure is a steel scoop/s****er welded to a part of the housing and it grabs oil, directing it towards the pinion bearings. Again----- Ford 9, not 8.8

I would like longevity and safety to not have a rear end lock up. A $200 pump and a few fittings, electric, would circulate the oil and potentially spray/flow oil up into the bearing area. Saw a few videos from Gale Banks regarding diff oil dynamics and I am pretty sure w/o some intervention, the pinion bearings will starve and in short order. Has anyone seen a rear end drilled and tapped to feed oil to a pinion bearing? I cant even find a nascar example and they do this sort of thing, or at least did as I understand.

 

I know you asked above, but I have to ask again: WHY?

What is the intended use for this vehicle?

We already have tractor pullers. They are hot rods, but are not streetable.

 

I would think you could tap in a port
To oil pinion Bearing or others bearings ,
Race might need a hole , like cam bearing.
Fuel car rears & other Hight Torque
Applications have pumps also
I would think all cars @ Lemans do.

 

As long as you are turning the diff the correct direction, there should be no problem, aside from venting and oiling. What if you put seals on the inner ends of the axle shafts and filled the carrier almost full of oil?

 

Its a slow land speed truck. 500hp, all small block ford. For Blytheville mile.

I believe the resolution for oiling is a pump. There is a port that feeds the outer pinion bearing between the seal and bearing cup. Usually is is in the bottom position, simply occupied with oil by gravity and oil level. If the pinion is high, the port is then on top, allowing for a top fed port to be drilled in and flow 2 gpm or so of oil to the bearing. Its discharge/return appears to be through the inner bearing itself back to the main oil volume. I dont have an open 8.8 (or an open 7.5 for that matter) till I get time off this week. Cant visualize in hand.... but I did some searches on the tube and sure enough the oil ports were clearly visualized. The Outer bearing slinger handles distribution inside the pinion bore, just ahve to feed the oil into the area.

Im doing it!

I had posted some time back about a ford ranger, 80s, std bed/cab with a blower frankensteined into service, all JYD parts. A Jag Eaton blower on top of some manifold, draw through carb. I was asking about intake manifolds and in a quandary about a universal manifold that could have a non-conforming blower installed. Someone may remember the questions, regarding a holley high ram and a Speedway china junk blower manifold. You folks helped out with the concerns, I ended up with the Holley. Well I have a pair of Eaton M112's, a holley high ram, some aluminum plate, some oring gaskets. The intention of the car started as a pure garbage pile for a street only Sunday grocery car. Do a burn out, go home. Then I got the idea why not beef it a bit for an 1/8 mile trip infrequently. That led to cobbling parts from junk that work well together. Well its been in pieces since Covid and I have had too much time to think. Then I was made aware of ECTA and went to an event. Wife signed on immediately for the project shift. Then I talked to Steve (ECTA) and he indicated that I didnt need a cl***, didnt need to conform, I could run what I brung so to speak, as long as it is safe. My sons could drive it, wife can ride in it if I pay the antes for extra people, it again becomes a family affair--- not that my sons have any interest! If it goes 150, they will gain interest, they are boys after all. Noisy, stinky, crazy looking.... it kind of what many boys like including me. And if it goes somewhere it is sure to draw a conversation, weird rude looks, anger, etc. Like an M80 going off in the neighborhood NOT on a holiday.... some are angry, some said, "good one".

One may ask also why not leave engine up front, which has been done on rangers thousands of times with v8 swaps... its tight, a PITA, header clearance ****s, traction ****s, accessoriy drives ****, etc. I have to install my Horton Welder series MII crossmember with a power rack with a Volvo 2** series Electric PS pump. All fuel, PS, electric, would normally have to go to the back of the car. Now I get the abilty to place the engine relatively precise both longitudinally and horizontally for weight bias, to acquire high traction, high clearance for anything to happen in and around the engine, short driveshafts, spinning parts away from driver position, ease of a 1/4 inch shield on the TC bell housing, ease of trans blanket install and all the extraneous weight moves to the front where it can be ballasted and controlled. Coil overs in rear are easier to define an operating point, the MII coil springs less so. I can adjust ballast for front tracton and ride height easier. Not having fenders to avoid with an engine install is amazing. 23 T bucket amazing. No firewall mods, heck I get more legroom if I delete the trans tunnel.

Its a frankenstein, truly a work of junk, not art. It has to go fast, no records will be set and that is ok by me. Ive never been 150 mph in a car at age 55, been 125 on a motorcycle and 120 on four wheels thats it.
When I die my sons and wife can say, "he was nuts, look at this **** he stuck us with." But in the true sense of the hot rod, I built that **** on a tight budget, safely and "uniquely".

See pic I added of an SCS gearbox, except mine has only one in, one out, same side of case. A four gear reverser rather than a load splitter as pictured. It should end up in the position of approximatey a winters QC differential gearbox and at a glance might be mistaken, at least thats what I envision for placement.

Thumbnail is an 8.8 as it should be installed. Really easy to flood that port with oil by pump once gallery is tapped. Gravity will do the rest.

 

Have you looked at marine V-Drives? Come in different sizes, capable of handling a lot of power.

 

I believe there are some 4x4 trucks that run the front gears on the opposite side: coast is now drive. So I don't think the issue is pure gear strength.

Why not use the already designed 9-inch stuff for high pinion? Why so set on 8.8?

 

I have a set of reverse rotation 3.73 gears for an 8.8...

Grant

 

Looks like a modified TH 425 set up with an upside down Dana 60. Definetly Olds powered.

 

Is there no gearbox with a transfer case (for the front wheel drive part of a 4x4) that would fit your engine?

 

Folks it's been quite a long while since last post. I spent money, accomplishing only making a bigger pile of parts. I have lost heart, gained it back about 300x. But I am not out of this project.

Ideas have marinated for a long time and I believe I have some answers that are good

So I bumped into an SCS gearbox, a 12.2 inch drop box. This is for monster trucks, tractor pullers, etc. This was a very expensive custom piece, same side in/out, reversing rotation. Good for 600-1000hp. Was used for a water bike? Like a 1200 cc watercraft on actual skis, with 200 plus HP of 4 cyclinde grunt for lord knows what purpose. I paid pennies for it, a few hours at best on it. Four internal gears, extreme robust device. This is the V-drive replacement for the project, except only 500.00!, 3000 new.

Alright, I have measured and done geometry and measured and more geometry, fitted in theory a powerglide shorty, a NP435, a 4r70, and at least one more transmission. Tailshaft back to rear bumper, forward to seating area, etc.

In finality, the engine of 30 inches max, with a 31 inch 4r70, will reside about 2-3 inches from the forward bed wall of the 1987 for ranger, std cab, short bed.
The engine will decline, ala a Don Garlits dragster with crank pulley below level, at 5 degrees. That decline, or rather a tailshatlft incline, puts the Tailshaft seal at about 26 inches above ground with a 28 inch tire. At a complimentary 5 degrees, minus a half degree for lubrication, the SCS box will transmit power to the backwards and upside down diff (high pinion). The pinion angle will also be inclined at 5 degrees with the required half degree for lube in the joints.

That puts the whole eng/trans at an exaggerated 65 inch length, clearly inside the bed. Oil pan is, with a huge pan, 10 inches above ground. Tailshaft at 26 above ground. One short joint/shaft with 4r70 slip yoke and a flang for SCS input on top, 12.2 inches below is the output, splines, 1350 joint and a very short shaft to pinion flange.
Total travel limited to plus/minus 2 inch.
The oiling, as mentioned prior, will be forced to the diff pinion bearings with an electric pump.

It appears from math and measurements the bellhousing will live directly in front of the diff cover (cover facing forward now) and the diff has about 3 inches before it slams the bellhousing so positive over travel limiters will be needed.

It seems like an answer looking for a problem, right? The truck is so small, the labor and expenses so high, to use a front engine system, with a roots type blower, fitted with a high performing but low cost exhaust, cooling mods, tunnel cutting, etc... .all to have a garbage weight bias.

What I see now that the math, measurements and gearbox has been obtained.. .. is a rear biased weight distribution with virtually unlimited space of 50 inches wide x 72 inches long, to stuff "stuff", install simple exhaust, etc. Fuel tank up front, cooling up front and piped back, front fan with no limits of grille, depth, etc. Forward batteries, forward remote water pump, plenty of space for ballast over front axle if needed. The front end can have a pan installed for airflow control under car and maybe get a better handle on lift reduction like a modern Audi would have or Marys minivan.

It should like like absolute ****, aero gone from over the top of the cab down through the bed. But... changing plugs should be easy.

My current debate and hopes for some feedback is.. . The 5 degree chosen decline of the drivetrain. The 4r70 will need a pressure line from a port or p***age to the Tailshaft bushing for pressure oiling. No big deal. But, am I missing anything with a 5 degree permanent decline? I don't care about carburetors, floats, etc. the top end geometry of the blower and tunnel ram will be corrected with a carb riser plate milled opposing normal manifold rake to compensate.

But is there any other concern (not fuel, not trans and I guess not oil pan pickup and sump locations) that I am overlooking?

Big long post, lots of words to describe clearly the intended path of destruction. Hope I was able to paint a good picture.

Nobody I can find has done this so I am cutting fresh fabric. Lots of eldorado front ends and transverse mounts, a few long beds with endgins half in the cab, but nothing with a complete bed mounted longitudinal engine driving a solid axle!
Turned 56 this year, I need to get the ball rolling

Mike in West TN

 

Makes sense to me. Small trucks are nothing if not light on the rear and the bed certainly makes for a roomier engine bay than the actual engine bay.

 

I'm struggling to visualise this. The rear axle centreline would be ±8" behind the transmission pump? Would the axle be above or below the transmission? I ***ume the axle's pumpkin would be offset to one side, so you'd only need to deal with the depth of the axle tube? A rough sketch would go a long way!

 

Pictures please to help inquiring minds to understand

 

Flexible buses had a 45*? Gearbox that connects engine to the differential

 

I get it if you wanted to keep it all Ford, but if your willing to use a powerglide, why not the Toro/ Eldo transaxle?

Gary

 

I run a somewhat similar set up in my little truck.

LS3 facing rearward, with 6L80E connected to a Nissan Patrol transfer case.

The driveshaft runs down beside the ch***is rail and goes to a Nissan Patrol diff that has had one side shorted by about 16". The centre is a front high pinion centre running in an inverted position. This now makes it low pinion.

This got it all rotating the correct way and it now runs on the coast side of the gears.

I have around 12,000 miles on it and have had no issues.

The vehicle will lift the front wheels on the street.

I also have Range Rover with a Nissan front centre in the rear and that is high pinion and have had no issues with it.

 

Surely if you've rotated the diff 180° about the pinion axis you're still running on the drive side, even though you've corrected wheel rotation for your installation? I'd love to see pics of your truck.

 

I’m thinking transaxle and IRS and mounting the engine forward of the axle. The Corvette C6 or C7 transmission would work if you can adapt the bell housing.
This would give you a better weight distribution than hanging it out back unless you’re building another Stubby Bob…

 

Ned Ludd, nothing but a cab on a frame to look at and a large, increasing pile of parts. If you have seen a 40+ year old frame, envision that at this point. Wish I had more to show for several years of contemplation (constipation of the project). As well for the rotation correction, yes the reverse rotation requirement is met.
The SCS gearbox is a four gear vertical stack, therefore CW in and CCW out. My original thought (still on table too) was to reproduce the Stubby Bob type deployment with the reverser gearbox up front. Then driveshaft critical speed issues arose as that is a 72 inch(ish) driveline path and no good for a 9000 rpm (OD gear) potential if HP/TQ ever got to the point of 190mph. 190mph is fantasy land, Id be happy with far less but one can dream.
72 inch is done around 2500 rpm in any OD. Then I thought, why not hang the box off the back end? Great; flip and turn axle, voila. Overcome the pinion oil issue with pump..... oopsie.... Im on the coast side of ring gear. I need CW in and CW out to ride the drive side. Dang it. I then reached out to SCS to mill a new gearbox case, with one less idler gear and at this point that is an option available. So Ned, yes if I don't alter the original design of the gearbox, Ill be on coast side. But losing an idler helps me two ways in the project and I would prefer to have little itybity driveshafts, more like couplings, than have a carrier bearing (or two) and attempt to span the 72 inches with many shafts and overcome getting around a drivetrain now blocking my path to the rear end. If SCS decides at time of actual request, not to machine me a new case for one less gear, then I s**** the axle flip plan.

To that end:
If low pinion CW/drive side rotates toward pinion (forward motion), then high pinion CW, coast side rotates toward pinion.

If the axles is backwards (pinion to tailgate), all of those motions are the same, except the tire direction is reversed of what is needed.
Low pinion, CW drive side, equals reverse motion. Likewise high pinion CW coast side, equals reverse motion.

I would need the box drive the pinion CCW, high pinion, to produce drive side loading and cause forward motion. Which means the reverser box must have a CW in, CW out and the mirror of the out is CCW to feed the pinion.
Walked that through in text because I have confused, corrected, forgotten, confused, and corrected again, that theory of operation many times over 2 years. There is a matrix of 8 useful scenarios for the four pinion positions and two gear face options.

I did a drawing on way too much Milos Iced Tea Thursday night, consumed between 8PM and 10. Then drank most of the gallon until about midnight as I woke thirsty. Woke proper at 2 am with no way of sleeping again, drew pic in bed using a phone as a straight edge on graph paper, twice. Up at 4 for work Friday. But, there is now a drawing which tonight I should be able to use a ruler to improve and reduce clutter. I will attach the picture and replace with improved version later.

What I found was at real scale, 5 degrees seemed way to shallow. The slingshots must have been closer to 10 degrees or more. And I deemed it appropriate to calculate on 11 degrees as that got me to a 12.2 inch span of input/output shafts on the SCS gearbox. Still 10ish degrees is quite shallow over a 65 inch length. Initial measurements of the chunk, axle CL, pinion vert offset, etc appear to give me at 11 degrees, enough space to have my two inch of upward axle travel. The drawing also revealed just how much better things would be with a stubby Glide or even a short tailshaft glide vs the 4r70. Six less inches of drivetrain length would mean the world.

Now that raises a different question on a subject I only know basic rules of. That is driveline geometry. I know the rules well and how to meet them. But I am interested in the plan A version of the project as a backup plan. That is gearbox forward and the 72 inch driveshaft. The ranger has a centered (roughly) drivetrain with a gas tank forcing some angles. I no longer have that issue, but others far worse. If I am to center the engine and trans, the reversed driveline will need to travel 72 inches back to a STANDARD FORWARD FACING LOW PINION which is 2 inch offset from center from the factory. IN narrowing the axle I can choose to offset further, a couple of inches, until it interferes with the four link brackets. Having pinion off center horizontally gives me a target I can aim for skirting around the oil pan of the engine, to a degree. See the second drawing I made.

So the rules of drivelines are input and endpoint terminations are equal angles and opposing (parallel planes0 not to exceed 3 degrees or so with a mandatory .5 ish for lube and some debate over those mins and maxes on who published the book. I need to compound those angles like Ford did initially. Ford produced a down pointing trans, up pointing pinion and set to the p***enger side of center by a value. None of those angles were nearly 3 degrees in any plane. But they are compounded due to logistics and at freeway speeds, live for several hundred thou miles just fine.

In my case, I have a pinion that cant go below about 14 inches from the ground, and as high as 16 or so.
I can install a gearbox (the new input device) 72 inches away and at a height that is mostly dead flat to the pinion, or down to 12 inches, or as high as 18 inches. All measurements from flat ground, that takes care of teh vertical plane.

But I need to cir***vent obstacles in the horizontal plane. I have not been engaged with vehicles with carrier bearings and two piece drive shafts. I see an advantage, being a novice in the matter, in that the carrier bearing can delineate the path the driveline takes. Can it???? If my tailshaft down at my feet in the cab, couples directly to the reverser gearbox, can the driveshaft be broken into shorter pieces and delineated AT A GREATER VALUE than 3 or 3.5 degrees?
Say the first shaft moves 2 degrees, hits a carrier bearing, and an added 2 degrees is added for the back half? And as in the Ford (and many others) original plan, be compounded in multiple planes, not exceeding that upper limit of 3 degrees? I am aware the 3 degree limit is a limit and should be steered clear of, less is more.

If that is the case and a carrier bearing can delineate and allow greater than 3 degree driveline OVERALL angle, then in reality maybe there is a case for PLAN A to come to fruition. Id rather have an engine in the bed, a transmission in the tunnel backwards and a gearbox reverser at the firewall. The legroom will be awesome, LOL, Im tall!

 

Could you use the front differential (or R&P) from a 4x4? Then you wouldn't need to flip the rear end.
I can't answer your drive line question, but didn't you already state that it would be too long to handle high RPM/torque? Compounding angles isn't gonna help there either

 

A front diff is a naturally high pinion system but uses a different gear set geometry. Gear cut correct as a reverse pattern but the interface won't fit an 8.8 carrier. The front carrier won't fit the rear housing either. A ton of money and skill I don't have would be needed to turn the whole front chunk into an IRS or solid axle. I'm sure someone has done it but way beyond my skill and funding.
So I have consulted charts and critical speed for a 3.5 inch chromo x 36 inch is about 10000 rpm at 80%. By using a 2 piece, I can safely get to the required rpm and I am conservative at 9000 rpm. That's a fast truck and I will likely expire on earth before the vehicle can go near 200....
But I can dream.
So in reality if I got 7500 rpm from the two piece I would be in the realm of possible and even probable. A mild steel shaft will do 7500 at 36 inch and every few inches shorter will ***ist. I need to crunch real numbers.

So that response makes me consider another idea I have had and would love to get input on. That is installing engine not parallel with frame rails. A degree or two matter in this project, 2 degrees of longitudinal skew will greatly ***ist in shaft alignment. It also makes logistics/space considerations better.
A centered shaft in the car heading to a normal installed rear end, runs into my oil pan at 10 inches above the ground. Therefore the return shaft must live under driver or p***enger seats and not dead center. That statement is an a exaggeration, nothing lives under but call it biased left or right if you will. That "could" cause it to miss the oil pan, especially if the pinion is far left or far right of center, as far as possible.

To reduce ujoint angles, the Tailshaft, reverser gearbox, and pinion need some vertical and horizontal angles added. If the angles are all in parallel and opposing, then things work better, or maybe just work period. By rotating the drivetrain so that the cranks centerline is not parallel but rather at 3-5 degrees, that compensates for some extreme angles that may be there othersise. If the Tailshaft was not centered but pointing to the drivers right foot and the crank pulley was closer to the p***enger rear corner, by say 3 degrees... . Then the reverser can be installed at the opposing 3 degrees. This makes for a near zero angle on the input shaft/gear.

The output shaft is also at 3 degrees in same plane. It is now pointing at, to a degree, the p***enger rear corner of the truck, not the middle of the rear axle. Having to use a carrier bearing in the middle of two shafts, I believe will allow me to apply 1.5 degrees of error to the input side of bearing, the balance to the output half. Unfortunately the pinion is always parallel with the frame so making it happy is the key.

This is the interesting part of the equation. The reverser is say 18 inches tall. If it is clocked, up to 20-30 degrees, acceptable by makers standards, with oil level adjustment, that pivots the output shaft closer to the p***enger seat and upward in space. This would give a more straight path to the pinion, to the tube of 2-4 inches. It shortens the total shaft very slightly. And I am not totally unsure that SCS would disapprove for a totally horizontal install. The vent would need to be plugged and added elsewhere, and a breather added as the oil will likely get to the vent in some liquid form. Even to the end of pressure oiling as the gravity and slingers will not do the job well in the horizontal plane. That would give me up to 12.2 inches of left/right compensation to shift the driveshaft position to the p***enger side and keep it dead straight!

Sketch forthcoming.

Anybody have any input on installing a drivetrain clocked in between the frame rails? I see weight shifting in this case, more leaning on p***enger rear tire as the oil pan moves to that corner. It will look very weird.

The other option along same lines is to bias the drivetrain parallel to frame but left of center, biased to the driver side of car, a few inches. This is normal for p***enger cars with real world requirements. Doesn't make me happy, makes the driver side very heave with my fat **** on that side as well and no p***enger as ballast to help offset.

 

See attached

 

If you went with one of the newer IRS type 8.8" axles could you mount the engine over it and drive off the front of the engine to the forward mounting pinion? Since we don't know what car this is it's tough to give good advice.

 

I bumped into some thread or what not and mentioned winters quick change and being driven in reverse by guys like Mickey Thompson. Then it changed to Hallibrand for him.

Nonetheless, I researched a winter rear and it appears the design does allow for, one come of the company's designs, to have a factory reverse cut gear installed. The champion rear in any form appears to be fixed, no change , (great for me), I a steel housing, good for 1000hp typically. I am not sure if the center can be rotated with a spool in reverse with the reverse gears but there is scant reference to the application and for sure I can buy 8 and 10 inch reverse cut R&P for the winters centers.

Anyone have patent knowledge? If it cost 3000 to buy a complete new rear that could spin backwards as needed with no oiling implications, etc.... I'll spend hand that on new axles for an explorer 8.8, rebuild of the chunk, etc etc.

I'll call them Monday but wow if it could happen.

 

Or he could buy a IRS centre with the bellhousing attached in front and transmission behind [aka Transaxle]
This whole thread concept is idiotic.

If the OP knows where to look a transaxle is cheap.
Audi's ,Subaru's, Lancia's, Alfa's are cars where a donor car is cheaper than the parts in them.

If the OP wanted an auto and would consider east-west layout [like a Ferrari] just hunt down a 2009 Chevrolet Impala SS engine / transaxle combo [5.3 LS engine]

Here is the Impala transaxle