Bias plys on modern suspension w/disc brakes

Just curious if anybody is running old-style bias ply tires on a more modern suspension/disc brake set-up? I have a '54 chevrolet bel-air with a mid 1970's Monte Carlo front end and disc brakes. I recently aquired a set of 15x6 steelies that I want to mount some Denman wide-whites on, but was curious how the combination of new and old would come together? My guess is that as long as the brakes clear the steelies then all should be fine?? Many thanks in advance for any and all info.

Adios,

Scott

 

I've got a similar set up on my 52. Holden (Aussie GM) clip with discs and power steering and Remingtin WWs. It's OK. Stops really well. Understeers if you overcook it in the turns. I don't think the modern suspension really has much impact on that.

Next set of tyres will probably be radials just for easy driving but I'll keep the bias plys on my Hot rod.

Pete

 

got a '60 f-100 with a caddy 500/th400 amd MII ifs. i'm planning on swithing to 15-16" steelies with WWW rags also. the only experience i've had with doing this is it makes the car feel a bit loosie in the front end--they sure look better than the WWW radials though.

 

I've driven those montes with all different rims and tires. Observations, a 14x7 might not clear the brakes, otherwise everything else in the world will. The bias plys will be a little squirmy, but that's just how they are, the tighter the car is the more you notice it. If you've never driven that car with radials, you may never notice it. Good luck!

 

I've heard that bias plys work better with drums than discs. As discs will lock more easily with bias plys. This seems likely. But it may hold more true with a hotrod, than a larger car. I have no actualy experience with this so I could be completely wrong.

 

Funny thing. I hadn't ever heard the "squirmy" phrase until just now, but I think that perfectly describes a truck I drove back in September. It was definitely not HAMB material (big jacked up 4x4) but it had semi-truck wheels and (radial) semi tires. It too was "squirmy." I thought it was the suspension, but when I talked to the owner about it, he told me it was the tires. They were probably close to 90-series and looked a lot like a bias ply. I'm wondering if the complaints with bias plies really come from the aspect ratio more often than the actual tire construction. Therefore, something like a Coker 16" piecrust radial, which shares that design for style reasons, wouldn't really handle much better at all. Anybody have a thought on this?

-Dave

 

The sidewalls aren't stiff to begin with. Couple that with the tall aspect ratios and you get alot of sidewall deflection. I'm sure a lower profile bias ply would feel less squirmy. It wouldn't look as good though.

 

I ran a mix of bias (front) and radial (rear) on my 54 Chebbie and it felt like the rear was on it's own program but the bias knew where they were going. Drivable but strange feeling.

 

I' ve run just about all the coupled applications on my 54 and they all seem to have their pro-and-cons about them. My 54 sets on a 76 Full frame El Camino chasis. When I got the car it had a set of 14s on them so I ordered a set of Denmans for it. My first lesson was make sure that you take all your steel rims dowm and have them spun to see how far out of balance they really are, now new set of 14's. second lesson, Bias-plys have the potential for very large casting flashes, this attributed to a nasty vibration between 60 and 70 mph.

Now at some point I decided I wanted to run 15s and some tall bias-plys. First lesson here is that most ch***is are way to ****ing wide for shoe-box chevys, so I cheated and found a set of 86 S-10 Blazer 4x4 wheels and installed a set of B.F.Goodrich 7.10 x 15 on there. Looks great and then WHOA! Feels like your driving a bar-stool down the highway. Rides smooth but the side-wall deflection coupled with what I thought was a worn out front-end led to some serious wandering and following grooves in the road.

Rebuilt the front-end! All new bushings and new brakes for good measure......WORSE! Now I have a really tight front end but it feels like the rear is trying to come around on me, so I re-bushing the rear all 8 with neoprine bushings.......BETTER! ah finally we are getting some where

Go for a trip down to the coast and I am all over the road about half way down there and I've decided Im going to sell this P.O.S. Come back get really drunk and do a burn out and grenade the rear tires.. This time I get a set of Goodyears and what do you know it solves the problem (to a degree, they are still bias-plys!) Now when I go to mount a set of tires on anything I have a system of checking I go through before Going through all that hell again.

Was it worth all that to attain the look I was going for???????.......Of course!

 

Everytime I see the name Denman I cringe. I have had nothing but bad luck with those tires. They ride like **** and don't last very long. Not to mention wander all over the road. If you use them, good luck. I would try another tire. The Firestones seem to work great.

 

I appreciate everybody's input. It sounds like I will definitely expect some "wander" with the bias-plys. From what I hear though it seems like the modern suspension and disc brake set-up won't make it any better or worse. It seems like there is a big variance between other car owners as to how much "wander" or "squirm" they get out of their vehicles. It sounds like it can be traced back to the specific set of tires...not necessarily the brand. Could two sets of the same brand of tire be that different from each other? From what I am hearing it seems like some are really happy with their ride and others are VERY unimpressed. Just trying to figure out what makes for such a difference in public opinion.

Adios,

Scott

 

FWIW, I had a 1976 Nova (originally my GrandFathers), it came from the factory with Bias Ply tires and (manual) disc/drum brakes. It did not behave, to my perception at the time, any worse than other vehicles I drove. I put radials on it sometime in the late '80's. The ride got better, but thats about the only thing the **** dyno registered.
For comparison to a '73 Nova with the same size and brand bias plys but drum/drum brakes, the '76 stopped better and more consistantly (no brake fade). To me, discs are an improovement regardless of tire type.

Alex.

 

The rear was telling the front end where to go.

Put the radials on the front, bias on the rear and the front will tell the rear where to go.

Mixing is a no, no.

 

If ya' think it drives nice now, imagine how much more pleasant it would be to drive if ya' had radials on it.

 

I don't necessarily think radials are a "cop out"...as I have them on the car now. I just don't think that the radial whites look quite the same as the bias plys. I just think that the look comes with a price that you have to be willing to pay. I want to achieve the happy middle-ground of a relatively well handling tire that has a good look, dig? The weight and height of my '54 sedan pretty much keep it from being a corner-hugging, streamlined hot rod. I won't be expecting it to corner like it was on rails or ride smoothly at speeds over 100mph (i wish), etc...so as long as I can drive it around and not have a totally unbearable "squirm" factor I will be happy. My main concern was just the mixture of a post bias-ply-era suspension up front w/disc brakes yet rolling the older style tires. Y'all have been a big help. Keep up the good work!

Adios,

Scott

 

Modern suspensions were designed for just that.... Modern tires. I'm just saying with a little time and a little figuring out you can find an application that will work for you. Im happy with the set up I am running now, it just took a little while to find out what it was