Ok,,jumping in the deep end here.Going to be starting my own lil venture and well I'm gonna need a Bridgeport,yes I know they ain't cheap. Any advice on what to look out for ,check over etc? Ay help would be great Thanx.
Main thing is check to make sure the ways and quill are fairly tight. On a budget your not gonna get a primo machine but if you know whats worn and whats not you can work around it. If your going variable speed check the **** out close. they are nice but can be a pain in the *** and a money pit. If i ever get my roadster done and sell it im gonna add on to the garage and get a lathe and a mill and then look out.. Dave
Try the mermac.com website they have a how to inspect lathes and milling machines post thats been helpful to me. I've used brand new machinery and sloppy worn 40 year old junk to turn out within tolerance work. The most costly thing to look at are the ways, wear usually occurs in the middle where it is used more often than the outer ends of the table. Other cheaper to fix items I look at are power downfeed, spindlebearings and powerfeed operation. As for power remember most are all three phase. Good luck, there are some good deals to be had shop around.
"own little venture" is the HEART of America! I wish you the very best of luck!!! I don't know what your needs are, and how big you'll be working on, etc., but you might want to check into Smithy Milling machines. I'm sure somebody here will throw in a ***** about them, but they're very good machines, held to decent tolerances, and aren't anywhere near the same ballpark as similar combination machines from Grizzly, Harbor Freight, etc. While the machines are made over-seas, they have an engineer on-staff full-time that functions as the go-between between Smithy and the manufacturer. He told me they once refused delivery of an entire shipping container full of machines because they quality wasn't what they wanted. Their manufacturer got the message. When I did a story with them a couple years ago, they were working on CNC options that run on government-sponsored FreeWare programs that will write the program for you with simple dimensional inputs. That might be damn handy for a new venture. Factory support, warranty, and the ability to grow the machine with their options. They're located in Ann Arbor, Michigan. -Brad
check the "Ways" i believe they are called... for slop. and gear lash, and the locks, and the motor. hmmm thats it maybe?
i dont know what the main opp your are going to do is so here is what i would look for how sloppy are the way's and screws in x and y. are there tight spots in the travel. how loose/sloppy is the quil. is the draw bar beat to snot. is the table full of mill marks and drill points? if posible ,i would take an indicator and see how "flat" the table is in x and y. i would try to get one with digital read out. i am a machinist by trade and primaraly deal with cnc machines so i like the sharp that we have with a limited nc/cnc computer set up. i'll tell you straight up that you get what you pay for and depending on the scale and repe***iveness of the jobs you do, a simple cnc control or a hurco makes life a lot easer.90% of the work done in our shop today is done by cnc. hope this helps. Trout
I bought a late 50's/early 60's Southbend, not quite as heavy as the same Bridgeport...but just for you to compare.. Bridgeports sell for about 3-3500 here (California) with minimal tooling, my SB has like a near new table on it (9x42), came with a Kurt vise (big one, about 50/60 pounds) full set of collets (I have an odd taper though) about a dozen different bits and cutters, a right angle head attachment, also had a 3phase coverter built in with a motor, not a "box", that a bit more efficient, it has power table in X, and hydrualic power down feed....for 1500, for me, it's twice the machine I'll ever need.
Also...as mentioned before, head to the mermac site...he'll tell you how to check runout and backlash, etc. Daves a good guy, I've bought some lathe stuff from him in the past. He's over on the east coast too, if I recall.
I've called it lots of names, especially when I banged my self on it trying to walk around it. Seriously the table could be refered to as work surface, clamping table or X axis. One thing about a bridgeport is they have a lot of ways to take up slop in lead screws,ways,etc. As for styles you might run across the following; M-head, J-head and variable speed head. The only ones to mess with are the J and variable as most M's don't have an R-8 spindle taper. If I were just starting out I probably would look for the J-head. The J is belt driven and if you stick it the only thing you'll deal with is a broken end mill and little burnt rubber smell. Variable speed heads are nice but you pay more for them and they get louder the older they are. Variable frequency boxes are a cheaper alternative for 3phase power and variable speed on a J in my book. Don't let tooling bother you R-8 is cheap and everybody uses it. Pool.
Bridgeports are the Small Block Chevy of vertical milling machines - as such you can get ANY PART - everything is available and the after market is huge. Yes you can get the table - but fitting it is another proposition alll together - these are precise components - personally if it were me I would p*** on any machine missing a major component - hints at too many other unforeseen problems - especially where you live - you are close enough to a major manufacturing area - a decent amount of machines cannot be difficult to find. What I would avoid - Round Ram - dinky head - flimsey machine 1/2" endmill is pushing it's limits. A "V" ram is a much better choice - chrome ways are even better IF the chrome is in good shape - if the chrome is worn out then as far as I'm concerned it's a liability. 1J aka "Step Pulley" machine is by far more common and desired by some for it's simplicity. These are work horses - good machines to say the least. 2J head is the Vari Speed head - frowned on by some but adored by others. I LOVE mine. Digital Readouts willl often breath new life into an otherwise tired machine. Trav-a-dials are the poor man's version - Readouts can be $$$$$$ Tables came in various lengths be sure you have a good understanding of the job you intend to run to make sure your table is long enough. My table is 42" - and I can just get by resplining an axle - so personally I wouldn't want a table any shorter. So all this rambling is kinda just covering the tip of the iceburg as they say - my advice to you would be to go to your nearest friendly machine shop - possibly bring a box of doughnuts as a peace offereing and ask the HMFIC to give you a 50 cent tour - explain your goals and get his take on things. He/she can show you in person how to evaluate a machine and exactly where to look for critical wear. When I bought mine I brought a dial indicator with me and I checked every machine they had - I made some checklists to remind me of things and to allow a fair comparison before I tossed down my hard earned cash. Around here 5-6k will get you a near mint machine. 1/2 that will get you a nice machine . 2k and under will get you a fair to decent machine - these are for 1J or 2J machines - generally speaking. Check prices at www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com they get some good ones in from time to time. Matter of fact I believe they are having their monthly "sidewalk" sale this saturday (day after tomorrow) - might be worth a lookie see depending on how far you are from Cleveland - just a thought. OTOH - you can also buy a "bunch of machine" by looking at some of the "other" vertical mills. Wells - comes to mind - not sure I'd be real fired up to get a "sum flung dung" bridgeport knockoff (parts availability), but what I am suggesting is that there are LOTS of other vertical mills out there - often cheaper than a Bridgeport. Food for thought maybe.
Bridgeports have really been cheap here in Central PA. since Amp sold out to Tyco. At one time Cent. PA. had about 200 little shops doing Amp work. I've seen plenty in the newspaper for $2K or $3K, as most of us had to get real jobs. That looks to be a 1970's or 80's model. It's not a variable speed. Nothing wrong with that, just not variable. You will only use about 3 of those speeds anyway, the 2 lower on the high range and the highest of the low range. Make sure you get a KurtLock vise, not a cheap look-a-like, good Albrecht drill chuck and boring bar. MSC and McMaster-Carr will be your best friends! Good luck.
like i said i believe its called a "Way" or something, ithink that swhat the machinist told me at work when i called it a table.
Just a thought, depending on what your budget is like, you can search for industrial or commercial auctions in your area. Sometimes you can get lucky.
The table is called exactly that.. the 'table' ..for a Bridgeport Series 1 machine: Part#2060021 ..36" Part#2060022 ..42" Part#2060023 ..48"
check to see what all comes with it for tooling , that will effect the value of your deal..stuff like a Kurt vice can be expensive to buy if you go off brand , check to see what the spindle is and if it is R8..a buddy got a super deal on one , but has some odd spindle that is hard/expensive to find tooling for
here's a cheaper one off of the philly craigs list for $1400 , might be good for starters or for what your going to do. http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/tls/278440221.html
Once you have one set up you will wonder how you got along without it. Old used machines will usually have slop in the lead screws. Those are the screws that you turn with the handles to move the table. No big deal, and with proper technique you will take up the slop when you are cutting. You want to see if the gibs can still be adjusted to take out most of the slop on the ways. Ways are the precision surfaces that the table and knee slide on. Gibs are the metal pcs. that can be moved with an adjustment screw to take up the slop. You usually have to comprimise on an older machine 'cause the ways will not wear evenly...they wear more towards the center of their travel since most of the work was done in that position over the years. Also want to check for slop in the quill and spindle. Hopefully you can hear it run to see if there is any noise in the head under power. Check low and backgear operation for noise. As for power, you will probably have to deal with 3 phase. Not a problem...I would suggest a VFD-variable frequency drive. It will convert 220v single phase to balanced 3 phase up to a couple of H.P.-enough to run a Brideport. You can program into these drives the startup speed, slow down or stopping speed and a host of other variables. You can use it within reason to change speeds too, but for big changes you still need to reposition the belts on a J-head with belt drive. Respect the mill...even a 1-1/2 H.P. Brideport has more than enough power to mess you up if you get tangled in it. I paid under a grand for mine and it is a sloppy old dog. Even so, I have been able to make some neat stuff for the hot rod, and it's very convenient to have around when you need to tweak something. Tooling will get to be expensive, but there is all kinds of tooling and accessories for the BP. Go for it! -Scott
No one has brought it up yet, but one place you may look to find them are school auctions. A lot of high schools that had shop cl***es have discontinued their programs for lack of interest or liability. I've seen some decent ones go for some good prices.
I work for Lie-Nielsen toolworks (http://lie-nielsen.com/) and we use mostly the "J" models. There are cheaper and much easier to use. If fact they make an amazing woodworking tool. I use them in my department to build custom woodworking benches. http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?cat=535
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