My dad and I are putting together a 34 pickup for him and originally we were going with a budget/boring bowtie 350, well the more he reads here the more he wants a period powerplant. We started looking at flatheads but he lives in Seattle with the hills and the rain, my old man needs an automatic. By the time we buy, rebuild the flathead add on an adapter and a C4 we are looking at $5000. I have a local ford guy who will give me my pick of his stash of several mid/late 50's 292 Y-blocks and set me up with his machinist for square deal on the rebuild. Who is running one of these? Any problems? What are my choices for ******'s? Hop up parts? Same as a 312? Thanks guys. s.
my brother had a early 60's galaxie with a 292 automatic in it. good engine. ran real smooth and the car drove nice. Im not a ford man and never will be but i would use a 292 any day. if i had to have a ford motor.
I'm not a ford guy either but the truck isn't for me its his call. I've done a few searches here but haven't come up with the budget recipe. s
High milage engines can have wore out rockers from lube problems. If you do some research you'll find numerous factory parts from the interceptor models that will make nice upgrades. I ran these engines all through my early years and had few problems. There are many different heads, manifolds, and exhaust manifolds from the factory.
To be perfectly honest, none of the first gen OHV V-8s are exactly budget, unless you consider the SBC. Rebuild parts are higher & transmission options are limited, often needing an adapter to get a modern automatic. The Y blocks are no exception...& anyone who's seen my posts knows I likes me my Y blocks. However, to answer your questions, as brief as I can make it ... The 292 is the cheapest Y to rebuild, being the most common. A lot of basic parts are avaialble from NAPA or any of the chains. Depending on what he wants, a nice, fairly strong 292 can be put together from factory parts. A lot of speed equipment is now available, though not the cheapest. There are a few quirks to building a Y, but a lot of them are solved during a normal, CAREFUL rebuild. The old ones have a tendency to have rocker oiling problems. The p***ages to the rockers are small & could get clogged with sludge, with old oils. The current detergent packages in oil make this a dead issue. If you mill the heads, you need to make sure the oil p***age is still deep enough to flow oil (it goes horizontally along the head surface for about 1"). You may find that the rocker ***emblies are worn because of the oil issues, but new/rebuilt parts are available. The other major issue, performance wise, is that the Load-O-Matic double vacuum distributors used on '56 & earlier Ys are ****. They must have the correct carb used in conjunction with them, & even then the advance curve is sluggish. Use a '57-up distributor (similar to any points Ford dizzy); they are available rebuilt for under $100, usually much less. Advance Auto had them the cheapest, last I checked. You can convert them to electronic using a Pertronix or Crane kit if you want. A Ford "recurve" kit will fit if you want to go even further. There's a lot more to say about the engines, but it might be easier to see what other questions you have first. So far as automatic transmissions, you have the following seven options: 1) Use a Ford-O-Matic/Merc-O-Matic as originally fitted. There are both good & bad points to these, but it's generally the cheapest/easiest route. The later Cruise-O-Matic can be found as well but it is nearly always a two-speed trans when found behind a late 292. The Ford-O is a two-speed pattern but can be shifted as a three speed if you are willing to do some finagling with the shifter. 2) Convert the Ford-O-Matic bell to an FMX trans. 3) Use the Flat-O Products kit to convert to a C4. 4) Use the Bendtsen kit to convert to several different Ford transmissions. 5,6) Use the Hollywood Automotive or Bristol Services kits to convert to an AOD. 7) Use the Wilcap kit to convert to a TH-350/400/700R4/200R4. There are advantages & disadvantages to each option, so ask about the one/ones you like. Last, a mild build for you: a 292 + .030; slightly ported C heads; a 9425-B late 4bbl intake, or late truck intake; a Holley 390 or 450 vacuum secondary carb, or E-brock 500; a Mummert Y-265S cam or Isky 301444 cam; 1.54 rockers; the Rollmaster timing set; a late dizzy with the Crane conversion; & dual manifolds or small tube headers. If you want more radical, we can go there, too.
Wow homespun a lot to digest. I definitely want a 3 speed, what years of ford-o/merc-o are preferred. Expensive to rebuild? The flat o option looks pricey for our budget, we looked at them for the flathead adapter. I'm inclined to look into the wilcap to chevy, couldn't find the bristol kit but an AOD may be out of budget. thanks. s.
Personally, I would go with the C4. Light, strong, doesn't rob a lot of power to run them. Easy to get fixed if any problems.
Its just a matter of dropping $700 on the adapter and starter, I can get my hands on a few C4's sitting under a bench in a friends garage but they may be from early stang sixes. I'll have to see if they work with the adapter. s.
You've got a couple of things to consider with the Ford-O-Matics. Early ones through '56 are air-cooled, not the hot setup. Bad pun. Later ones are water-cooled. Eventually the Ford-O evolved into the Cruise-O-Matic...which is a true three speed, with a conventional three-speed pattern...however, when used behind a 292 or six, they were usually two speed. However, they do have aluminum bells, saving some weight. One other thing to note is that they clunk when shifting into gear- can be annoying. The car & truck bells are different because of the side mounts on the truck bells; since it's going into a '34 you may as well look for a car setup, which are more common, & skip the h***le of fighting the truck bell bosses. The Ford-Os are three speeds...but have a two speed pattern, Drive & Low. You can shift them as a three speed by putting the shifter in Low; to shift into Second, you move the shifter to Drive & immediately back to Low. It will go to Second; then you move the shifter to Drive & the trans goes into high gear. You get used to it but it is a little Mickey Mouse. Normally the trans starts in Second gear. It is possible to convert the Ford-O to a true three speed trans with some work & later parts...or you can adapt a FMX to the Ford-O bell. The FMX is a direct descendant of the Ford-O & later Cruise-O & the internals will swap. That's handy if you have it in a certain ch***is & need the Ford-O's tail housing; otherwise it may be easier to use the FMX. The Ford-o-Matic has a cast iron case and is fairly heavy. They are not too expensive to rebuild, but the parts are not easily available, i.e. you have to order the kit rather than it being stocked locally (probably). The process is pretty much like any other automatic. You may want to find an older trans guy, as a young one may be a little gun-shy about working on it. They are no big deal to work with, though. The Flat-O C4 car adapter is about $450 last I looked, plus a FE starter. They recommend a '71-up case fill C4. I honestly have to say that by the time you mess around with the Ford-O, if you don't already have one...rebuild it...or modify it to gain the better shifting pattern...you can probably buy the adapter & a locally rebuilt C4 (or do it yourself, or buy a decent boneyard C4 for $100) & get a lot more value for the buck. You've got no ch***is mounts to worry about, so no particular reason to "keep the original trans".
So far as using the 312 crank/rods, it's certainly an option...but it may exceed the budget. It may cost more to turn, depending on the machine shop doing the work...& 312 cranks are getting harder to find & more expensive, as are the rods. There are still deals out there if you look. Good 312 pistons are more expensive too. My personal take on things is that at the present time, unless you get a 312 crank/rods at a cheap price, it's not really worth it to gain a relatively small CI increase. If you are willing to pay to have the crank offset ground, run aftermarket rods, sonic-test the block, & heavily bore the block in order to go to a 320-330 CI engine, it's a different story. I'm in the process of doing this, & I can say that it's NOT cheap...just IMHO.
Just a couple of things to add. The Load-A-Matic dizzy is operated completely by engine va***n.....no weights. Besides having to use a specific carb, it ****s as a performance distributor. For the money, I'd run a standard ****** behind it. I'm fairly certain that Y-Block and 223 6 cyl bellhousings have the same bolt pattern. For even more info on the Y's and another parts source , check out http://www.ford-y-block.com/ John Mummert is perhaps the leading Y-Block expert in the world..... Jan
Even if those c4's are from mustang sixes, they have a changable bellhousing. Worse comes to worst you can change the bell from your friends c4 to whatever works with the adapter. I'm guessing a late 6-bolt?
i run a 312 y-block in my 58 ford with a auto trans car runs great been up and down the east coast with it since the 80,s with few problems but you will be in the same price range as a flat head to redo or hop up a y- block
I have a adaptor to mate a C4 to my 292 and it came from Gene at Flat O Products, I can highly recommend Gene and he's a nice helpful guy as well. Steve.
I have thought of a SBF, it would be cheaper in the long run. I'm building it for my dad and he is dead set on a period mill. Thanks, s.
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