Hoping by posting this I could get an answer from those who have been there. Subject is a Nova subframe, 350 with power steering, vehicle is late 40's with the large original steering wheel. Problem is that the steering is just a tad quick I think due to the wheel size. Is there an adjustable/replacable orifice or restrictor on the Nova sector? Second if the sector is not adjustable, is the proprtioning valve I have seen on the net the correct answer here. This is my buds car and he called me. As I really have never messed much with GM I had nothing to base an answer on..I did suggest the portortioning valve. What is the best route? Thanks..
do you mean the flow control valve in the power steering pump? proportioning valves are used in brake systems....
No, this unit I saw on the net, forget the site, is an inline device for adusting the flow of the fluid from the pump to the sector..is is listed as a porportioning valve for power steering. Just a bit larger than the porportioning valve for brakes similar to operation as it allows you to control the flow...excess pressure is diverted back to the return line.. I was wondering if this was my only answer or if the pump pressure is controlled by an orifice in the sector.
the large steering wheel would cause slower feel. you should try shorter pitman arm or check the wheel offset. too much will cause heavy/fast steering
just guessing here: power steering pump PULLY SIZE? (did he change / swap something around?) (i doubt this could be it.. but?? who knows) my better guess is alignment.. I had a similar situation.. it turned out my alignment was NOT where I thought it was..
I don't know of anything in the steering gearbox that you could change....maybe adding longer steering arms, or a shorter pitman arm. There is a valve in the pump, hiding under the pressure hose fitting nut, that controls the flow from the pump. Check that alignment, usually the caster is way off on subframe swaps
I have not personally seen the car yet, nor have driven it, going on his observations only...he is some 60 miles from me..as the subframe is stock and one of the more common setups..I did not think caster to be a factor nor the pitman arm as all was transfererd with the clip including the engine. Could be something was altered. Will send him a message to see if the engine was shifted on the donor clip for firewall clearance etc. This may have forced the builder to alter the steering. He recently purchased this car in this condition.
Thanks for all the input here..I may have to drive over and check the caster..other than quick to steer he says it handles nicely...I asked him and he said no road walking which is usually hand in hand with too negative a caster..I requested that he remove the power steering belt and get a feel for the steering without any ***ist..take it from there...no report back on that... Most power pumps I think are not regulated..that is a function of the steering unit..that is why I am pinging you folks..lots of experience on this board. The car was aligned after he got it and was given a clean bill of health not only on components but frame welds etc. Would aslo think if the caster were off the alignment man would have made mention of it...
In VW's you can buy a quick steer kit which is just extending the pitman arm a bit. So in your case could you find a shorter pitman arm from some other model?
is it possible he has a quick steer box from like a t/a or z-28(iroc,etc)?how many turns lock to lock?
(Most power pumps I think are not regulated..that is a function of the steering unit..that is why I am pinging you folks..lots of experience on this board.) Actually, the pressure port has a large hex fitting that the hose screws into, unscrewing this fitting exposes a spring that applies a resistance against the backside of a slide valve. This is the pressure regulator. I have seen an article on shimming this to make a pressure adjustment when using GM pumps on M2 front ends, seems funny, but maybe this has been tampered with. At any rate, I think adding shims(washer?) decreased the nervousness of the damned thing. LEE
Hey how's my fellow mopar brotha doin? I swear we're gonna meet up one of these days. Maybe at run what ya brung? Some one on the HAMB point me towards these. I haven't setup my steering but since I have a cav quick steer R & P and the stock late forties wheel I planning on needing it. It's a steering quickener but can be mounted backwards to slow steering down. http://www.stockcarproducts.com/steer4.htm
Unclee.....thanks for that information...I have since done a search and found a kit as pictured..looks like this is the animal..be worth a try. I could not find this earlier as I was look for the wrong item..was mis-informed on the sector having the regualtor. Will p*** this on to the owner..will post feedback on this when tested... link to company offering kit: http://www.marchperf.com/pg52.html
is that universal? That seams a hell of alot cheaper, easier, and cleaner looking that putting the steering ratio reducer inline.
Hey dvanecek.....how are things in Hot-lanta...the Dodge coming along ok? As for the kit being universal..can't answer..just got familar with this myself...I looked it up as for a GM pump...so that is this particular application. A certian large company sells steering kits and thus misinformed me on pressure regualation being external to the pump. Live and learn, 'bout all you can do...I have not had my hands on the car in question...I had ruled out caster based on the mechanic aligning the car did not point out it being questionalbe. He was made aware of the quick steer prior to alignment. I am very courious if this fixes the problem..I was hoping that the belt would have been removed, test driven to see how it steers un***isted (ie..road walk etc) to make sure we heading in the right direction by addressing the pressure/flow of fluid. As for the inline flow control regualtor..could be a nice device if you like different feel of steeering verus the way the car will be driven..downtown traffic as opposed to a long distance trip/higher speeds.
I can't see how doing anything with the hydraulics is going to affect the steering quickness.....only the effort required to turn the wheel.
yeah, no ****. lets straighten this our. is it too easy to steer(effort) or is it too quick as in like 2 turns lock to lock as opposed to 4 turns?
The pressure reducing devices are to lower the GM pump output to be compatible with the MII rack. You need to do something "mechanical", i.e., change steering box ratio, shorten pitman arm, quickener used backwards, etc., to slow down the steering speed. Find a similar box with more turns lock-to-lock is probably easiest; sounds like this one is 12:1.
Guys based on what the owner told me it is not so that it has bad road manners..just that the effort to steer is very minimal..I have not driven the car..wish I had so I could be a bit better explaining the condition. I would like very much to see how this car is on the road with ***isted steering and then un-***isted..(belt off)...so I could have a better overall understanding of "quick" myself. All your questions and answers will be addressed either by the guy when I tell him what you folks have said or myself should I have to drive over for a look see/road test. Verbal explainations of problems, sounds etc get confusing in translation. I do appreciate any and all commments...you never know where the silver bullet may come from. Based on all information gathered here I will hopefully be more able to pinpoint just what is going on... I have no idea who did the clip or if any steering mods were done..it was my basic understanding that all the componets were just transferred to the vehicle via the clip.. I first thought caster but alignment man say OK.. I would have thought that the original pump, pulleys, sector, pitman arm, steering links were stock..how could this condition exist..unless it was there in the donor car prior to clipping. This again would throw another wrench in the work..this is why I was asking for advice and things to check..for real, all you input is greatly appreciated. Basically I fear we still looking at to negative a caster...I hope he has an alignment printout....
Going from a 70s size steering wheel to a 50s size steering wheel will give the driver more torque to turn the steering gear. This alone could account for the "too much power" feeling. As I understand it, steering effort on the GM power steering gears is mainly controlled by the diamter of the torsional shaft in the spool valve. Maybe there's a steering gear from a more sporty car that could be installed to make the steering effort a little bit higher. There are some companies that specialize in power steering gears, might want to put in a call to one of them? a few show up in google when you search for power steering
I'd check the lock-to-lock turns and compare to different GM applications. Someone previously said something about a box off of an Iroc or Z28, which could be an issue. If the ratio to turn the wheel from lock to lock is small, this'd help cause the steering to be a bit too responsive. Another idea, and one that I'm experiencing on my fullsize Chevy truck, is that I have a worn spot in the box and it is causing my steering to feel what I consider to be "sloppy." It almost seems that it is overly responsive - or could be construed to feel this way.
Most of the replys are somewhat correct. Pump flow will only change ***ist or "feel". Caster will change feel and positive caster will slow down steering somewhat and make harder to steer,but much more stable at speed. Quick,easy,cheep solution would be a box out of a GM luxo barge (Caddy,big Olds,Pontiac,Buick<Chevy).Most will bolt right up to the Nova clip.If you pay attention when you pull, you can even find the right one with same spline count on the input and output shafts.
Here is the latest from the phone call I got tonight. The sector is 3 turns lock to lock..with belt off the pump the car drove like a dream only that there was an increased effort to turn the wheel. The owner want to try the shim kit first..surely appreciate everyones help. If this is the fix I will again post to let you know.
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