RE: Removing Original Firewall - for a setback *****en one. I"m on a roll . . . just trying to get all my ducks in a row for the ch***is, engine setback and body work on my 34 5-window. 1) Engine: 392 Hemi, blower, 3" belts . . . need about 8 inches of room from the block face to the end of the lower blower pulley. Obviously the enigne needs to be set back - about 5" is my best guess at this point. 2) Firewall: I'm thinking of using the *****en Products big-block firewall -- as I've seen it used on other setups like mine - looks like a good starting point. 3) Old Firewall Removal: The original firewall has a rolled "lip" that is typically tack welded to the body with a couple rivits in certain locations. If you're going to install a new firewall, do you use an Oxy/Act torch to heat up the spot-weld sections and break them loose -- so that you can remove the original firewall in one piece? Any good tips on how to do this? I'd like to preserve the original (not in too bad of shape) -- and replace it with the new one. I'd hate to cut it up and destroy it . . . so I'm looking for the best way to "gracefully" remove the original, prep for the new one and install the new one. I'll probably TIG/spot the new one in. If you've done this before . . . share your experiences . . . especially how you'd do it a second time! All ideas and experience welcome! I'd rather think about how to do it right and preserve what I can, than grab a sawsall or flamewrench and wish I hadn't!.
First of all, I used a "big block" 5" recessed firewall on my '35 sedan. To get the old one out I used a common spot-weld cutter. It looks like a little holesaw. I just cut all the spot welds and the old panel fell out. I spent a fair amount of time with the dolly and hammer all the way around the opening to make it straight and true. Then when fitting the new sheet metal it lined up real well with just a tiny bit of fiddlin' around. When I went back in with the new piece I carefully welded through my cut out spot weld holes with rosette welds, then ground them a bit. It looks very much like the original installation, of course if you are looking for that "smoothie" look you'll need to do a little more finishing.
I did three 34 firewalls a couple of years ago. I sanded the flange to find the spot welds and drilled them out with a 5/16 drill bit. There are a couple of arc welds towards the bottom of the firewall that will need to be ground off. The spot welds can be separated with a chisel. Sometimes the firewall just drops out sometimes the spot welds have alot of penetration and take more force to get it out. I found if you finish weld the way the *****in directions describe by welding the perimeter solid, it works better with a tig welder because the welds are smoother and more consistent. You can also leave the edge long and roll it over like ford did. Dave
I'm planning on keeping the original (as it is in pretty good shape) -- just in case I decide to run this body with a flathead later on. Best of luck fnding one. Dale
What tools did you use (or can you recommand) to roll the edge over? Seems like it would be quite difficult to do (especially around the curved areas). I've done lots of panel body work, but never attemted to form something like this. Thanks!
Not sure how you want the car to appear finished, I would say dont remove the original, make it work with your set up. If you must remove it, do not put a torch on that body.
i use a spot weld cutter i got from www.daggertools.com . i cut a few welds than use a thin wedge to pop them loose as i work around the cowl
You've given me some good ideas - thanks! I like the original X-style stiffeners -- they are much better looking than what *****en or anybody else does. What I may try to do is use as much of the original as possible (at least the top portion - then "graft" the parts of the *****en firewall into it. My TIG welder does a fantastic job on sheet metal -- so I don't think doing it "Frankenstein" style will be too difficult - just takes more time. I really like your firewall - great job on keeping things as original as possible! Dale
Dale drill out the spot welds on your original and remove it in one piece. Keep it for later use. I got rid of mine before thinking(My Dumb &*^). If you use a ***** in or even direct sheet metal you can bead roll the x design into there firewall. A friend of mine did this with his 39 ford after installing a non original firewall. Good luck and would love to come by sometime to see that 34 ?
Hey Jim: Thanks! I'd prefer to NOT cut-up the original - who knows, may want to re-use it some day. I've heard of bead-rollers before - but never used one, you wouldn't happen to know anybody who can do this would yah? Obviously it would need to be done before I weld the *****en one back in. I like the idea of making the new one look more similar to the original . . . looks better to me than a smooth aftermarket one. Car Status: I'm just now getting all the pieces and parts together. I'll have the main engine completed in the next few weeks - will probably build a test stand to fire it up on. I need to see if it will cool with those Donovan heads and the "plumbing" that we've had to do (these heads were never designed to run on the street). I don't want to go through all the pain and agony making the stainless headers -- only to find that I've got problems cooling the beast! The ****** is ready and I hope to have the Q.C. rear ready in a month or so. Just ordered the material to make a frame jig --as I'm going to fab my own frame (couldn't stand to pay $3000 for a basic perimeter frame), would rather do it my way. Just got the DOM tubing last week to make the hairpins and the rear ladder-style bars. Hopefully it will be in a somewhat ***embled state in the next few months. How is your car coming? Have you done any more work since I saw it? Dale
I Know someone that could do it and has done it in the past for someone else on a 39 Ford. I will PM you his info and you can talk to him directly. Tell him what you are building and you can mention my name as well. I have got the interior done and the car is in black primer. I need to adjust/tweak a few things other than that I am enjoying it alot. If you want some help with those rear ladder bars or front hairpins you should call Bill Metz Hot Rod Shop in Springfield he already has the jigs for those and I am sure that he would bend your tubing if you wanted him to ! Just a thought and is not that far for you to go.
For what it's worth, the firewall on the coupe that I featured in my how-to was original when the guy before the previous owner got it. That guy then added some kinda cheapo aftermarket lower-half recessed firewall. When I got the car, I too needed more space and cut out most of that guy's work and added a new piece of 16 Ga steel, bent how it needed to be to fit. I like how this all worked out because neither one of us touched the top section and it still has Henry's lines. Vance
Direct Sheetmetal Versus *****en Products: These two companies cost about the same -- anybody used both? Any Pros/Cons of one versus the other? I'm leaning toward buying a complete firewall - then having it bead rolled to mimic Henry's real deal. Are both 16 gauge? Thanks!
I have used a *****in firewall in my coupe and know someone that used direct sheetmetal in there 34. The only difference is in how each company beads there firewall. the reason the other person went with direct sheet metal instead of *****-in Products was because of the wait time. I cannot remember the thickness but 16 gauge sounds right. Good luck with your choice!!!!
Update: I talked to 'Ed' at *****en Products yesterday -- the set-back area width in their Big-Block firewall is about 30" . . . which is not enough for my early Hemi setup (I need about 32"). Ed was cool, he is willing to pull a firewall out of production BEFORE they weld the set-back piece to the rest of the firewall. This makes it much easier to make the mods I need, then weld it up with TIG when I'm done. Just wanted to p*** this along - to anybody who is pondering elephant motors and new firewalls. Give 'El' a call. Dale
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