Hi guys, Pretty new to doing body work but I'm starting to get the hang of it. I'm on my third car now. My technique is to get the damaged area as flat as I can with body hammers and then use a skim coat of filler to smooth it out. I've had real good luck doing this And I've turned out some mighty straight bodies. I do have one problem I'd like some advise on though. My filler seems to dry really fast. If I have more than about a 6 inch radius to coat I can't get the filler on fast enough before it's too thick to spread. I end up having to mix two or 3 batches to get full coverage. I've tried putting a little less hardener in it but that didn't seem to help much. I'm using evercoat with the blue hardener from my local paint supply store. Should I be using a different brand? Should I use less hardener? Or should I just work faster? Thanks for any help. MIke
What oldtimer said.Are yu doing this outside in the hot sun? You should be able to do something the size of a small door if needed in say 70 degree weather. Plus too much hardner causes other problems such as bleedthrough in the paint.
Hey, At what tempture are you workin'? Hot shop temps will cause your filler to kick sooner. Go much lighter on your hardner and mix your filler closer to the repair. Have everything planned so you can get the filler onto the job asap. S****ey Devils C.C.
3% to 6% any less than 3% and you'll start having failures. How hot is your shop? Do what you can to keep it cool. The surface temp of the metal is what really counts.
Its probably the temp, but how fast are you actually working? Maybe your just trying to be too perfect? The filler, when mixed, should be a light sky blue colorish. How long is it actaully taking to harden?
You may be mixing it too long. Once the colors are blended you apply it. Takes about 1 minute or less. Hopefully your doing it inside out of the sun with room temp metal. Too much hardner will also bite you so be quick about it. It doesn't matter how pretty your first coat looks along as you fill the low spot. Always put more in the dent then you need so when you sand it back you don't undercut it. Your second coat you fill pinholes and any low spots left if any. Good luck.
Thanks guys. Great info. It seems to me I'm using too much hardener. I'll try cutting back. I thought I was following the directions pretty good but I'll experiment and see what I can do. I'm doing it in my home shop so it's between 85-95 degrees at any given time, this time of year. I'm not mixing until I'm ready to put it on the car and I'm only getting about 30-45 seconds to work with it. If i could double that time I don't think I would have any problems at all. Just about done with this car cand my next project is waiting to be rolled in the shop so I'll be able to hone my skills pretty quick. Thanks again, Mike
I'm sure some will not like my choice, but last time I needed filler, I used some that does not require mixing, it's UV activated. Pretty much no time limit on working with it, and it will not set up in heat in a garage. I tried for 3 days on a fuel tank for my bike, finally left it outside for a few hours and it cured great. Never had any problem with it. http://www.bondo-online.com/catalog_item.asp?itemNbr=696 Local O'Reilly's carries it.
Thats way too hot, and too much hardener. You should have at least 3-4 minutes of perfect spreading time after its been mixed. Figure if its 95 in your shop, the metal is probably some degrees warmer than that, especially if its in the sun at all.
If you have a 4 inch diameter puddle of filler on your mixing board you should run one strand of hardner the width of the puddle. You could get away with less but you definitely don't need any more. The recomended working temp is 70 so as SlowandLow63 said you work environment is pretty hot so you will need to use less hardner.
Its all about the stirring motion.....[thats what a gal said once] You need to stir it up quicker without leaving it unstrirred anywhere...Ha. try this -using a med spatula dip what it will hold out onto your palette. Then add a strip of harderen across its width. stir briskly with the corner of the spatula and then 'turn it over" by using the entire width of the spatula..this insures no filler goes unstrirred..... it should be uniform in color no streaks at all...this should take approximately 10 seconds. then you have an amount you can apply with time to spare and no waste..... I never use the stuff myself...errruhhhh/#*&!cough =well most of the time!
Not to cast doubt on what works for you but most manufactures of body filler do not recommend stirring hardner into filler. That type of motion adds air into the filler which can result in increased pinholes. I realize alot of people mix it this way but for someone who is not experienced it might add another issue (pinholes) into the mix. It is usually recommended to fold the hardner into the filler.
It sounds like folding it in isnt cutting it K13 ....I am not too sure what he needs to do, but stirring hardener into plastic is the end result that makes it evenly distributed....however fast you do it... But you could be right, I dont really have that much experience.....
The way I do it is simple. Add the hardener, scoop the top 2 corners and flip it, scoop the bottom 2 and flip them, back to the top and back to the bottom, done. Gets a god mix quick and doesn't add air. I do agree w/ K13 though, stirring adds small air pockets that you won't see until you spread it if you're lucky and until you sand it if your not. Thats why god made epoxy primers.
The color of your hardner will change the hardening time White - Real real fast Blue - Real fast Red - Fast For a 4 inch glob use about a 2 or 3 inch line of hardner, then fold not stir. And practice, practice, practice.
Now we gotta take into account that Alabama humidity and their heat....Right? Its hot here in Missouri too but these two things will definitely affect the end results...
Watching this thread and "wondering" if you add less hardener (than manufg. recomended) since it is hot out, are you losing the "integrity" of the mix??? I don't know, and thats why I am asking. eventually reducing the amount of hardener to a point where it is not enough to "kick" off the filler is obviously bad, but reducing it to an amount less than what a company says is thier reconmondation wont that make the filler not be completely ratioed properly???? LIKE I SAID, I DON'T know thats why I am asking....Ken
Try this if this makes sence. To fill a small area put a golf ball size of filler on mud board. Using a paint stick form the filler into circle about the size of tennis ball then take the hardner need the tube. Then apply the hardner from the edge of the filler to center and that will give you about 3% hardner. Mix with a paint stick quickly then mix it the rest of way with the spreader. Mixing the filler quickly will give you more time to spread it onto the panel. The key to spreading the filler is to, spread it on, smooth it out, and leave it alone. don't play with it too mutch. I like to use Evercoat rage 108 for filler and Evercoat metal glaze 417 for finish coat. If you have never used 417 try it you will love it. If you have any other questions about body work I'm allways glad to help just PM me.
It depends on your opinion of less. A small amount here or there isn't going to kill you, but purposly trying to slow or advance the cure time will. The different color hardeners pose for different cure times like Terry said. That should be the only way you mess with cure times. A novice or first timer will most definitely be better with a slow cure to allow more time for mixing, spreading, etc.
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