I get a note on eBay the other day on a '38 Chevy 1 1/2 ton flatbed asking "Where the Vin number for this truck? Can you send me a picture of it OR can you post it on this site?" and I write back and explain the serial number can be found on the cowl or firewall, and that it's no one's business what that number is unless they're buying the vehicle because too many people are after numbers to put on scratchbuilt or kit cars. I didn't even mention guys with hot rods that need a clean number to stamp on it someplace. It's a big problem and one of the reasons it's been hard to sell my Willys sedan - too many guys buy steel cars to find the tag gone, or someone using the number already on a 'glass car. So I kinda think I was right about this guy... here's his response to me - "First-I already have a 1938 saden panel! Second- I was asking about the vin number beacuse I was interested in picking up a 1938 flat bed or truck. So the only reason I was asking is so that I can run a car fax to make sure that I was not STOLEN. I was just a friendly question. BUT thanks for your SMART ASS comment I WILL not be BUYING your truck. YOU can leave any comment you want on my E-bay page. " It was kind of funny... Nothing I said to him was smart ass, for one thing... and bingo! he has either a panel truck or a sedan delivery, so he probably needs a tag or at least a number for it. But carfax? Come on, it says right on their page that it doesn't work on vehicles older than 1981. There just aren't many people stealing 70 year old project trucks to then turn around and try to sell them whole; given how long this truck's been here it would be pretty dumb to try it. This particular truck is about as solid as when new, though, the parts from it would sell in a hurry. And as close as I can tell the last thing refers to eBay feedback comments... okay, fine, but you can't leave them unless they're related to a transaction. The guy's account's been around long enough to know that. It just seems to me that I hit the nail on the head, he needs a tag number, and the rest is just bullshit to try to make me think he was a for real buyer. Either that or the guy is an idiot. Carfax... sheesh. Anyone who's selling a car online probably should look out for this kind of thing - you hand out the serial number, guys can stamp it in another car, or had I posted a photo of it he could take that photo, go down and actually register it, then claim we stole it - a lot of work, to be sure, but people are still running that Nigeria scam that everyone over the age of 8 knows is a load of crap too. If they can fake up cashier's checks, or steal them, they could probably phony up a title too. As for the truck, if it doesn't sell, it doesn't sell. It wouldn't be a big deal to throw that cab on a half-ton frame or even an S10 frame and build something with it, it barely even needs paint. I see a lot of guys commented on this, don't want to bump it up, but in the cases of early car serial numbers - most of them into the 1930s only tell you the year, and sometimes you need a book to look that much up - they ended at say 1236005 and the next model year started 1236006. Eventually codes were added for build plant, sometimes transmission, digits specific to the model year, make or some engine codes - but none I'm aware of are super specific before 1968 or so when they went to an actual VIN number. So there isn't much to decode on a lot of them - you need a body tag to really tell you about the car.
I think you hit the nail on the head, here's what happens when devious amateurs get caught out. First they feel embarrased, that leads to feeling guilty (for being caught), that leads to shame and shame leads to anger or defensive behaviour, that causes them to mouth off. And that's the differance between an amateur and a pro.
great post!!!! I never thought of that, and that is probably why only about 25% post thier vin on the auction. ebay shouldn't even offer a place to post the vin unless the car is new enough to be in the carfax.
I didnt even think about that but it makes perfect sense seeing as I JUST ordered a repop Blank VIN tag for my 49 (FYI I have a clear title with a clear VIN but took the VIN tag off to do extensive metal work and lost the thing in a move) Heck a valid VIN with a repop tag hand stamped (HAMB alliance tag style) would get you a legal (alibiet, not honest) ride...
There are already several stories floating around on the internet about vintage auto identity theft. Most of them surface when a new car owner is told by their DVM that their car is registered to someone else. The laws vary considerably between states about how a title for a vintage car can be obtained but the problem is that cars are mobile. Bottom line-- Keep your numbers to yourself-it's private information.
I sold a clear California title for a Model A with a certificate of non operation to a guy who's original model A numbers were already in use! he had the whole car! I had the same thing that happened to you happen to me with a 65 mustang I sold on ebay. guy wanted the vin. I told him this car had a legit California registration in my name, and the numbers on the car matched the number on the title and I could not see how him having the vin would do any good. got a pissed off email in return. this is why I laugh at the posts where some numbnut here has a wrinkled up 50 year old title for a car he doesn't own and is bitching about the DMV not registering the car he built from spare parts and square tubing using the numbers on the title.
If he was I think he'd say it, or atleast if he was smart he would have rather than sayin carfax and blaming people. Smart move, I forgot how easy it is w/ old cars to do all of that stuff w/ the VIN numbers.
Reproduction and sales of blank VIN tags is way up there in the scale of illegal things to make and sell.
Look at it this way. You wouldn't give out the social security number of one of your kids, would you? People have been stealing vin#s for a long time. Back in the old days a person would come to look at a car you had for sale just to get the vin. There are stories of guys making numerous trips getting a few numbers at a time! The internet has saved these buttholes the leg work. So, yea, be careful and think.
Good Post. Dont give out VIN #'s and Title info until you get your money. No questions asked. Be aware of tire kickers with the same intent looking at local cars personally pretending purchase. I normally cover the stamped numbers on the car with electrical tape when someone comes over to look at a car I am selling.
If a potential buyer is legitimate and wants to decode the vin, tell him the first part of the vin and x out some of the numbers, such as VC55K12XXXX and he can decode the car from that. If you're the buyer, you have to be careful also....don't hand over your $$$ until you have a chance to carefully examine the vin tag and the title, and make sure they match and look right. Do this as if you were the DMV guy or a cop....if it looks fishy, don't pay. it works both ways
squirrel has a good point. 567 chevs used the v in the vin# if they were a v8, a numbers matching buyer might want to know that info.
i must have been lucky with all my car purchases over the years as i have never had a problem, and as for selling then, well that hasnt happened yet as everything i have gotten rid off went straight into a dumpster after cutting them into really small pieces. (dont worry none of those were anything you guys would like, they were all newer vw's)
"YOU can leave any comment you want on my E-bay page. " If you figure out how to leave feedback for someone who is an asshole but, didn't buy something from you, please be sure to let me know how.
This subject actually can go TWO ways! I bought an complete "A" Tudor from a friend; but he kept the engine. I had the original VIN - actually a serial #; VIN's weren't around yet - that came off the frame. (Canadian "A's" DID have the serial # stamped on the frame - left side - which was the same as the engine number when it came from the factory/assembly plant) He finds another Tudor body; rebuilds it, and registers it using the engine serial. (I can't really bitch, he owned the number on the engine!) Now I go to register MY "A" using the frame serial, and ... oh, oh; we have a duplicate serial number!! Fortunately I was able to buy ANOTHER engine; take the serial number from it, and the problem was solved. My frame had been changed anyway, so the use of the motor serial was allowed. Our DMV (Department of Motor Vehicles) allows this kind of "switch"; or I would have been "up the creek without a paddle!!"
Agreed, I'm on the up and up....I was the third owner and I have a complete non-molested history of the truck (and have owned it over 10 yrs) therefore it really didnt tug any of my ethical strings to do what I did....I just wanted to cover my bases and be "legal" again and have the correct tag....thing is if i can do it....many others can as well...
On a Mustang (or most 60's-70's Fords) all you need to give the prospective resto freak is the first five digits of the VIN. It tells you the year(first digit), the assembly plant(second digit), the body code (third and fourth digit) and the engine code (fifth digit).....all they really need at first. The numbers after the engine code are the consecutive unit number and unless you've got the first of or the last of something you don't need it for decoding purposes. -Bigchief.
i am looking for an el camino for my brother i saw one on ebay that said the car had a 400... I asked the vin number and if it was the original motor. He said yes the VIN said it was a 305. I don't need the whole thing but if i want to verify something like that and someone says no you can't have it i am not buying it.
In NY state (I can't speak for others) your VIN# is right on the registration sticker in your windshield. What's to keep someone from taking down the number while you're parked somewhere?
There is absolutely no such thing as being too safe on this topic! There's a scam out there for every hour of the day! If you're dealing straight up with someone, you shouldn't be offended if he or she requires caution during a transaction! Be careful out there!
Oh yeah. What a great forum to sell a STOLEN vehicle, but on Ebay for the whole world to see. You did the right thing. I've been asked that before.
I had a friend that had the original title to his 1932 3 window, last registered in the 50's. He went to register it, and was told the vin was already being used by another plastic 32....Needless to say, it was a nasty drawn out ordeal dealing with the dmv....and the knucklehead who had the number said that he went digit by digit until he found a vin number that was not in the system...and used it and applied for title...He ended up with his title being stripped from the glass 32, and a "special construction" title and new vin issued. My friend kept the original vin with the original car in the end.
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