1.5" x 3" Frame Tube Strong Enough?

Okay guys. Just pulled the Body off my Frame of my 30-31 A Coupe for some mods including Body Mount Rubbers and a 4 link.
The frame is 1.5" x 3" .120 thickness.
This is the same material used by Total Perfomance.
Now I have driven my coupe to Paso/Vegas/Primer Nats and Drive it Everyday to work since I only work 10 Mins from home. Again, Never had any issues.
It sports a 289 SBF / C4 / and Ford 8" Rear.

Not the most Trad Setup I know but it takes me where I want to go and I DRIVE IT which is to me more important.
I am not to happy with the looks of the frame as far as its appearance. It looks To Skinny to me and I am considering either using a Model A frame I have or making one from 2 x 4
Again, never had any problems with the current frame setup but whant some opinions since I already pulled the body off.

Also is this Frame Material Strong Enough. I did not build the frame but the welds are solid. What do you guys think?
Here is a pic of the coupe before I pulled the body off and as it sits in its home in my garage now.
thanks.


Also planning on changing current smooth firewall back to original and divorcing the Coil Overs for a Leaf Spring setup out back
Oh Yeah and a three inch chop

 

check it over and if nothing is bent or cracked it should be fine. with all the liability involved in selling a frame and yours is the same as total performance go with it.

 

Very Good Points.
Did not think it was an issue ever except everyone on here always recommends 2 x 4 Tubing.
Any other opinions would be great
I guess I could just reinforce the **** out of it since I already have the body off
Its just the skinnyness of it that urkes me
I love the look of Original frames. My Frame Rails dont look bad since they have A frame horns welded at the front just a 1/2" to skinny on the width and 1" skinny on the Height.
Any other opinions?

 

As long as your existing frame is good, why not just modify the areas that you don't like? Fr'instance, if you wish to give the frame a beefier look, add on to the bottom. Just add to what you have 'til you like the frame.

 

I've used 2X3 in the past, for my roadster, 1.5"X3" seems a little small, but it should work.

 

if you dont see any problems with cracking or bending then its sounds like the frame is safe.how long has this frame been under the car without any problems?

now as far as looks if your not happy,then you may as well change it out now.

.02

 

Since your coupe is chaneled not that much of the frame is visable anyway.
Have you thought of finding an original frame and grafting on the front frame rails from the firewall forward?

 

the frame has obviously been under the car for a bit as you have been driving it and you say it drives ok? why change it if its not damaged? do you not think its up to the job or is it only appearance? think about it this way, old henry built his frames out of C section, not box section - this will still be way stronger than the original frame as long as the welds are OK.

from the pics i think it looks OK, only thing i dont like is the lack of xmembers in the middle part of the frame to give it strength longways, not sure if you have taken them out though?

 

Okay---You asked!!! Having been active in hotrodding for over 40 years, and being a design engineer, my answer is no. It is not strong enough for anything heavier than a gl*** T-Bucket. I firmly believe that a frame for any car with a V8 engine should be at the very least 4" x 2" x 1/8" wall rectangular tubing, and preferably 6" x 2"" x 1/8" wall rectangular tubing.

 

Oh yeah, I wouldn't even think of chopin that car. It looks great as is.

 

I have replaced four 1 1/2 x 3 from under light t buckets cause they have been bent. the long side is wat gives the box tube its stregnth in a frame.

 

I don't like it and wouldn't think to use it on any V8 build...my kids Honda Odyssey go-cart has a frame that size!!!
but...you could reinforce it and use some sheetmetal covers to add shape to the front section...like Norm did with the Kookie car.
My biggest concern would be where the firewall attaches. With the body supporting all the back section, thats where a load of force is concentrated.

 

You might want to build a 2 x 4 copy as Brian suggests, and if you have a saws-all and a simple Lincoln welder, it will take you all of 2+ days. If you want to beef up what you've got, I'm tempted to look into increasing the depth, from 3 to 4" by adding top rail tube of correct width and thickness, the weld would easily blend in to the existing radius. (ask Brian, but spacing of welds runs something like 1" every 6 inches)
On a new frame, the front frame horns are easy to cut out the ~pie shape on either side, and hammer and tack down to define the horn shape.

 

Why not add a X-member out of 1.5x3 with a bolt in structure in the bottom of the middle of the X and welded in tunnel above that(in the middle of the X). 54chop

 

It sounds like you would rather have 4" tall tubing..........so do it.

 

I have a Total Performance Model A frame. It was intened by them to be used as a full fenederd Model A frame with a SBC. I have logged 12,000 miles on it with no problems with a mild SBC.

I dont think it is a problem myself.

 

Good welds are not always the most important thing. The weak point is out about an inch from the weld. The good weld will always hold but the weak or thin sidewall gives way from stress. Give yourself a safety factor, gusseting is the answer.

 

If you intend to run a basicly stock engine and trans, the frame you have should be OK. I would suggest a well designed center cross member though. As for looks, the frame covers mensioned woud be much cheaper to do than a complete frame.

If you are going to build a high HP, high torque engine, then a 2x4x.120 wall tube would be a good idea. I too have seen T's with bent frames. But this car had a built BBC in it. It was just too much motor for the design.

I'd think twice about switching from the coil overs to a leaf spring. The coil overs will give you a much better ride and you also get the big plus of having adjustability.

On the chop...the car looks great with the stck top, but it would look good chopped too. May be it would be a good idea to ride/drive a chopped one before you cut yours.

Basicly it's your car to do with what you want to. Have fun with it and follow your own idea of what you want it to become.

Youngster

 

My son's '27 roadster was built (by me) with 1-1/2" X 3" .120" wall. It has held up fine, with a 350-350 standard hot rod combination eng/trans. I too think the frame looks too skinny and all frames that I've built since are either 2X4 or a boxed car frame. On one project I used boxed Model A frame rails from the firewall forward and 2" X 4" box tubing the rest of the way. (I only had that much Model A frame available to use). In a Model A, there's nothing like a Model A frame, unless you use a '32 frame.

 

Excellent Responses
And I must say Thank You for your input.

Now! My only question is why would a company like Total Performance use 1.5" x 3" on there A Frames if they were not up to the test?

I also forgot to mention that The Trans Cross member was removed from the frame when pic was taken. Guess Tman hit it on the head . I just dont like the damn frame and the look is to skinny and weak to me.
Lets face it guys we all care about how are cars look. I was more curious on the strength of it and you guys have all answered my question.
Only thing now is should I go A frame Boxed/ 32 Rails boxed with 40 k member/ Or Custom 2 x 4
Damn this is gonna be a brain fryer as I tend to over ****yze everything
Yeah I know "lighten up" , But this is MY MODEL A and I love this pup!

 

Do what you need to, but ****canning a frame that shows no symptoms of inadequacy, that the car is channelled over, and that seemed perfectly ok until you pulled the body off seems silly to me.

If you are really concerned about the overall stiffness and strength, consider gussets and a X member to beef it up.

 

You make a good argument and valid points.

what frame are you running?

 

This is just my opinion .......

But a Factory frame Beats a 2x4 tube frame anyday of the week..

The "A" Frame or the '32 Frame will make the car look better & be worth more in the long run.

I just HATE the look of a Tube frame... they ALL look Cheesy.

I used a '26 Chrysler Frame On my Sports Coupe, An "A" frame on my Daughters '27 "T", Have a '25 Dodge frame for my '27 Nash roadtser.....

Nothing Looks Better than a FACTORY Early frame under a Hot Rod

 

Desoto first of all tell your daughter she is the luckiest girl in the world. Pretty cool on you to do that for her!

Second I agree that Early Frames look good under an Old Hot Rod although I have seem some pretty damn amazing Custom Creations.

I only question using an Original A Frame as they are all mostly tweaked at least the ones I have seen. Guess I could go aftermarket Original style.

I will make my own just trying to see what direction to go in specifically!
Maybe Original A Firewall forward and 2x4 all the way back?

 

Could an A Frame Be as Safe if boxed properly as 2 x 4 steel?

 

Box the "A" rails and run them !!

How many Hot Rods you think have been built over the years with boxed "A" rails ?

Hemis, S/B Chevys, Flatheads, Olds, Pontiac, Buick ETC.... They have all been in there........ They are strong when Boxed & "K" membered.. They are 2x4 in stock form.

I dunno Man, But if ya got one use it ..... If ya think they are junk..
I'll buy it from ya

 

Good Stuff
I do have one and Leaning towards it
Any good leads for boxing plates
Im gonna scratch the A on 32 Rails as I Want My A to be that an A
Not that I have anything against them.

 

My roadster has an early (as in early 80s) Deuce factory frame, boxed, with a pretty substantial K-member. It has over 130,000 miles on it, and looks like it is ready for another 130,000 as soon as I get the motor back together.

 

****it Im gonna use My A Frame
Admins you can close this thread! to save bandwidth

 

I made my own Boxing plate for the "A" & the Chrysler frames.

Made Paper templates, Cut the plates on a Band Saw, cleaned & fit them on the BURR~KING so they taped INSIDE the frame with a small hammer.. set them back INSIDE the frame about an 1/8th inch so the weld was set back a bit....

This way is much STRONGER than setting the plate AGAINST the edge of the frame rail.

I also box the front & rear & leave the frame open under the the body from the front of the "K" to the back of the "K" (if that makes sense)

This lets the frame flex a lil like they are designed to.. Makes the car ride a bit better also