Starting a rusty old drag engine-think it'll run?

So I've got this old drag 327 thats been sitting all these years, and water has gotten into it. I dont know how bad yet but my take on the engine so far (without doind much digging really) is that it's a little rusty in there and may be stuck (not seized from temp/race damage though). The next step I want to do is pop off the intake manifold and see what things look like in there. Assuming I can squirt the hell out of everything with mystery oil, let it sit and get everything free and moving, is there any chance it might be able to fire up and run in any form of presentable fashion? ....or is it more likely it will start, burn half the cylinder walls out and smoke like hell non-stop. I can't afford another engine re-build right now but things arent looking great with this mill. Any thoughts or ideas? Keep in mind I haven't dug into it too much yet, just going by what little I have seen and what a previous owner said. Thanks,
-Dean

 

You could tear it down and look at everything before doing anything else. That wouldn't cost too much, and it sure beats the hell out of trying to fire it and burning the remaining useful life out of it. Oh, wait. The previous owner said it was ok? Hell, fire it up then. Water and all! That motor's tuff!!!!!!

 

It's hard to say just what will happen. If you get if so it will turn over, I'd try pre lubeing it like a new rebuild, just to make sure you have filled everything with oil. Other than that, it would depend on how worn out it is. I'd also change the oil and filter before I tried to light it off. And if you are planning on driving it I'd replace the fuel pump, and keep an eye on the water pump seals. Good luck!

 

likely do more harm than good. cheaper to do hone and rering now than risk scored cylinders from broken/stuck rings

 

What BigRed said. If you were to break a ring or stick a valve it could mess up the cyl. past the point of usable. JMHO

 

I could pull the engine out, disassemble it myself, and bring the short block to my local speed shop and have them disassemble it, clean/hone it and put new rings in (no new parts or machining), then put the whole mill back together myself. That wouldn't cost too much would it? Normally I would be all over rebuilding it but some of you will remember from previous posts the trouble and expense I just had with that. I just want this thing to run without a smoke screen around it.
-Dean

 

If it has been sitting with water in it, the cyls. could be past the point of just honing and new rings. The only way to know is to take it apart and inspect/measure. If you try to do it half ass and on the cheap, it won't last and you'll just end up doing it again at twice the $. Good money after bad, so to speak.

 

I am way to paranoid and unlucky to not tear any questionable motor down...

I hear all the time about how "it been sitting with no carb, and it had birds living in it, and...."
and somehow it works out for other folks, but me: I've never torn down anything just to "have a look see", that I didn't find something potentially disasterous...

 

Totally agree here with DirtyThirty, it's not too expensive to go through it to see how it is, at least pull the heads and pan.

 

Well if you cant tell what I think from my quote..here it is pour some marvel in her and fire it up straight away then run it at about 6 grand for approximately 60 secs, you know to re break the bearings in. Seriously though I work on alot of old engines, tractors, stationaries and you'd be suprised the abuse an engine can take. So I say, If you don't care about it all that much, Fuck it, Light 'em up

 

It's a SBC !!FFS! you can have the whole thing apart in under an hour and whats the cost of set of rings or bearings? peanuts? don't bother wrecking it ,just pull the sump and heads and do a clean up and/or refresh with rings bearings and gaskets.

 

At least pull the heads and make sure the rings aren't rusted into the bores. If a couple of cylinders have had water in them, drop the sump, pull the pistons out and clean the rings and bores up. If it all looks good and turns over, button her up and fire it!

 

At least pull the heads and make sure the bores aren't rusted to the rings.

Cheers, Glen.

 

I dunno, with proper prep, I've started some pretty old engines.

yank off the valve covers and intake, maybe a head and even the oil pan and see what ya got then make the decision to buy new gaskets or use it as a coffee table.
If you use it, definately soak it up good with a light oil inside the cyinders and pre lube the motor if possible. do everything you can to help it, as in new points, plugs etc etc and then fire it up.

 

You have 3 choices..........

Junk it now.
Fire it up and then junk it
Pull it apart, do what needs to be done and have a good engine.

 

Weird shit happens to me. Due to an idiot previous owner I pumped a beautiful SBC full of water. I was lucky it didn't bend a rod. I had no idea what had happened. The engine sat for almost a year while I built the frame and painted everything. When I went to start it again, it was stuck solid. It took a few weeks of soaking and pulling with a 4 foot pole to finally break it loose. The shit that came out of the spark plug holes would gag a maggot. I was so close to starting it that I said what the hell do I have to lose? I knew it was lunched but I really couldn't hurt it anymore. Long story short...I drove the truck for 3 years before selling it. It never smoked or burned oil.

I too thought that I MUST rebuild it. It couldn't possibly be a usable decent engine after that. I was wrong. I am talking about a street application here.

 

As cheap as SBC gaskets are, I'd at least put it on a stand, tear it apart, and inspect everything. I know a guy that ruined a perfectly good 330 DeSoto hemi because he just had to try to run it as is after sitting for many years.

 

SBC gaskets are dirt cheap. I'd pull it out take it apart myself and clean it up. You can use scotchbrite to clean up most things and some 600 grit to clean up journals. Check all the bearings, if they look bad replace them... if you have spare pocket change replace them. Rings too.

Might be worth it to get quite a few thousand more miles out of it rather than a couple hundered.

 

For well under $100 you can ring and bearing the engine yourself and not worry.

I personally would soak it with MMO or diesel and try to get it to break free. Its much easier to get the pistons out that way.

If it has had water in it, I bet it won't break free though. Usually it seems to weld the friggin pistons to the walls.

 

man, we really need pics of this old rusty drag engine.

 

If it's an old "drag engine" like you say, it might have some valuable internals... worth looking over before ruining. That said, here's my advice.

Soak the thing in your voodoo oil of choice, including the spark plug holes. Pay attention to what comes out of the cylinders when you top them off (water? rust particles? vermin?)

Pull the valve covers and loosen the rockers. Pay attention to the loaded valves, and also watch to see if the lifters pump back up. Clean and soak everything.

If you haven't found any rusty particles or junk, you might not have to pull the intake and heads. At this point (with lifters off) VERY LIGHTLY see if you can turn the motor over by hand. If it moves and it doesn't sound like holy hell, you might be ok to fire her. The only other precaution is to lean on the valves and make sure they aren't locked in.

If you have the time, I would fill it with oil and spin the pump for a while, then drain and refill.

There is some great advice on here about reviving dead motors, anyone bookmark that thread?

 

Now there's a recipe for disaster. And I learned something new. Before this post I never knew you had to "break in" bearings.

 

I agree with Alaskanrocket, if you don't care that much about it go for it-live dangerously! Let it soak for a couple days, get it to turn over, throw some new lightweight oil in it and try it. SBCs are a dime a dozen. If this was some rare engine, I would think twice about doing this. Let us know what you do!

 

I would pull the intake, pan & valve covers, shoot some PB blaster everywhere, and start turning it over by hand. Make sure none of the lifters or valves hang up. Make sure there's no real hard spots. Then run the bitch. SBCs are tough ole dogs.

If there are hard spots or scary rust under one of the tins, pull it down and throw a $150 rebuild kit at it, and rent a bottle brush hone from your local parts store. Good luck

 

i have a little snake light/flash light i can slip into the cylinders through the sparkplug holes, if i see rust on the walls then i wouldn't even try rolling it over, pull it apart, be carefull when pulling the heads and you could reuse the old gaskets by just spray bomb painting them, this can work for longer then most people think, this can be done with intake gaskets as well but you would need to toss the rubber end gaskets and use a fat bead of silicon. if once you get the heads off you think you can clean up the bores and get the rings freed up on the pistons then you can bolt it back togather and fire it up, wont cost you more then $10.

 

Alright I should probably tear it down then. It's a special mill, a 331ci 327 drag engine made to turn 10,000rpm's in it's day. I'm calling the original builder in about an hour to find out what it's got in it. Do you think I should try to do the whole entire thing myself, or have a speed shop do the short block freshening? This will be the first mill I've really dug into, but I can't spend too much...
-Dean

 

pick up one of those "how to build a sbc" books at barnes and noble and have at it! just be sure to keep everything labeled and in order(ie dont mix up lifters, rockers etc)give things a good cleaning and visual insp. any problems should be obvious. besides with the 10% sound advice and 90% bs youll find here how can you go wrong? do it yourself and save$

 

Ok guys I have the specs just for the hell of it. I just got off the phone with him. It's a 327 bored .030 over to 331ci, fully balanced and blueprinted to within half a gram. TRW 12:1 pop-up pistons, with overall compression around 13:1. Decked heads and block, Edelbrock Victor intake with 750 Holley carb. Huge lift and duration Sig Erson solid lifter cam, designed to have the exhaust pull the intake in as it exits at high RPM. 1.94 Fuelie heads, and Corvette Hooker headers. .10 over crank bearings and BBC stamped rocker arms for additional lift. It ran up to 10,000RPM and on a mixture of Sunoco 260 and Moroso octane booster.....with the occasional hit of some form of jet fuel...it didn't run an alternator, and the fuel and water pumps were electric. So I guess I have my work cut out for me...
-Dean

 

10,000 rpms ? Maybe on a missed shift but not on a regular basis I don't think. Irregardless, sounds like a real decent motor so build it right. At the very least, take the block, crank, and rods to a mach. shop and have them checked for cracks, straightness, machinability etc. With 13:1 compression you're gonna need a solid bottom end or you'll just end up ventilating the oil pan. Your $, your motor, JMHO.

 

Awesome man...
You'll be happier if you take the time and do it right.

Do you need a motor for a project or did you just happen upon it? You can probably find a running smallblock for peanuts if you want to take you time with this one.