331 Hemi Extended Block Modification

I was wondering if anyone has instructions on how to machine off the extended bell of my 331 Hemi? I would like to shorten it up so it fits in my Hudson Hot Rod along with an automatic (preferably w/overdrive). I am going to tear it down and put in new rings and bearings anyway, so I thought I might be better served by doing that than purchasing and adapter.

I just need to figure out what I should tell the machine shop to do and my best bet. Any thoughts you might have is appreciated!

Jere

 

If you cut off the bellhousing, how do you intend to mount and attach the transmission????

 

Do a search, there's a bunch of Hemi Tech threads, one of them covers the bellhousing issue...another way to do it is have your bellhousing removed from the trans and adapt it to the stock hemi bellhousing...

 

Drill and tap to the block.

 

It's doable but it requires some very close tolerances, getting the locating pins at exactly the right place. Are you a machinist?

 

My understanding is...you can cut off the extension & there's supposed to be a couple bolt holes that will bolt up to the adaptor, after you bolt the adaptor on, you then weld it to the block.

 

LOL, thanks for trying to help but....

It has been done, there are threads concerning this already. But to cut to the chase here if you really intend on cutting the bell housing off you really need some experience with your transmission, torque converter clearances, flywheel set ups and such. This is not a novice manuver acomplished in a few hours by yourself.

Your best honest chance of getting an overdrive transmission is to use the adaptor offered by Wilcap/Bendstens/Hot Heads that converts a Torqueflight trans. It requires you cut the bell housing off the transmission and then bolts to the pump housing. This will work on the 518 over drive trans as well.



http://www.hothemiheads.com/transmission_adapters/chrysler_to_727.518.html

 

I don't recall saying you could do it with a Sawzall, just covering one way of doing it. The post above mine mentioned a machinist doing the work. Below the extension is supposed to be the same as the later blocks, if so & you were using a 727...You could run machine screws in at the bottom through the block-adaptor & into the ****** to hold it in place while you mark & tap the upper holes or weld it on.

 

Please stop posting suggestions George. Have you ever seen an extended bell housing HEMI in person? You obvioulsy have not tried this and are making suggestions based on rumor and inuendo. It seems apparant you do not have a long bell HEMI at your disposal or have any experience with them. If you did you would not be suggesting this.

Instead, posting real experience or articles covering such a conversion would be much more usefull.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=118607

http://www.streetrodderweb.com/tech/0705sr_chrysler_331_hemi_motor/index.html

http://www.streetrodderweb.com/tech/0704sr_hemi_engine_build/index.html


There is no welding involved. There are no secret pockets to run machine screws through or what ever you are suggesting. Mis-information is worse than no information...


I do have one of these engines and did do my research before purchasing and making decisions on my build. I have talked to people in person with real world experience doing such a conversion and I can tell you that none of the people who have done it want to do it again. There is a ton of machine work and you still need the adapter to locate the starter. Anyone would be much better off building a 54 and later engine if you do not want the extended bell housing.

 

All of my hemis are short tails. Just going from recollection of photos where it had been done, seemed easier than messing with the ****** bell.

 

I have two long bells. What's the problem with leaving it the way it is? Wilcap and Hot Hemi Heads sell adapters to bolt up an automatic transmission of various makes with no issues.

I was going to run a 727 behind mine. Went with the T-56 instead.

Specialitat71, check out my signature line for the links to the HEMI Tech section.

 

Thanks for your help Elpolako:
I really appreciate it! I have been thinking of cutting off the bell because when I bought the engine I did not get the bottom part of the bell that the starter attaches to. The kid promised it to me, but never delivered...so being the trusting fool that I am I paid him and picked up the engine and he never came through.

Now I am not a machinest, but I have friends who are. I know I read an article somewhere on machinists that do this work, but I can't seem to find them. There was a post a long time ago that showed it, but the links are gone. I have seen what happens to flywheels when they go through a floor, so I know how important it is to get this right....and I will definately have a blanket on it anyways.....There is no real easy way to resolve my dilema, but I guess that goes back to the first rule of hot rodding. Nothing will fit without modification.

 

One of mine was missing one as well. I bought one off ebay for $22 plus shipping.

 

Preach it Steve!!!

 

Yes you can cut off your extended bellhousing and weld an adapter on, but why would you? There is a short article about just such a mod in Tex Smith's complete hemi giude. There was even a picture of one compleated. Alignment of the adapter would be a pain in the ***, not to mention welding on a cast iron block is no walk in the park. Machining the bell off the trans is much easier, and the alignment issue is a non factor with the adapter bolting to the front pump and the extended bell the block. Good luck what ever route you decide to go.

 

If you DO decide to cut it off... PLEASE do a step by step of what you do. Would make fantastic tech for those willing to go that route. Pretty please? Sprinkles on top? Seems like a lot of extra work to cut it off though...

 

I called the guy from the book. He said he would sell me the plate but it wouldn't do me any good. He has a special fixture to line everything up which means you have to ship him the block. Lots of money for not much result.

 

I have a question?

Does the extended bellhouseing on the early 331 act like a ****tershield?

It seems the flywheel being inside the block would add some safety??

 

I may get some arguements on this, but wrapping your flywheel in cast iron - sounds more like a false sense of security to me.

Cast iron has very low tensile strength - approximately 1/3 of "mild" steel - sounds like a formula for a good grenade to me.

 

That's a good question actually. It's a pretty solid bell, but honesly, I think even if you gave it a good whack with a big hammer you could probably crack it. The strength is mostly radial, so the entire thing is put into a hoop stress scenario. A perpendicular strike to the bell might be enough to shatter it. My first thought is it wouldn't be strong enough under a severe failure at high rpm. Not sure though.

Anyone ever seen one blown out??

 

Kerry, didn't you have a flywheel come apart?

If I remember the cast bellhousing didn't do much of anything. Everyone running a flywheel should have it checked out for cracks and balance. Same goes with your choice of pressure plate and clutch disc. I have always used SFI rated gear on my green truck and have a Lakewood SFI rated ****tershield with the enclosure plate for my sense of security.

If I run the clutch on my 331 I will invest in a saftey blanket like they run on automatics.

I got a few pictures of my second engine, it is a 52 331 Imperial engine that was reworked as an industrial. The numbers are all mashed up but you can still make them out. Very unusual engine, it has adjustable LIFTERS that almost look like Flathead Ford gear...

 

It was the pressure plate. Blew right through the cast bell like it wasn't there. The hat on the clutch lost one of the bolts letting one piece through. A real flywheel explosion would have been a lot worse but I'm running an aluminum flywheel so I don't need to worry about that.

Read about it here... with pics.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36919&highlight=pressure+plate

 

I should add that I didn't go back together with a ****tershield, instead using another old bell but making my own ****ter shield band around it.

 

Kerry... can you please post up some pictures of this. I guess we're sort getting off the initial subject, but I would like to see what you've done sometime, somewhere, in some thread. I interested...

 

try giving hot hemi heads 1 336 352 3892 someone makes a kit where you cut off the bacl of the motor extended bell and weld on a new one for mounting the trans

 

I don't think I have any pics but I'll take some for you.

 

GREAT! Post up some pics Kerry!

 

The big question here is simply, how much money can you afford to spend on this modification??? Your friends might be machinists but are they willing to work for free??? At last check this mod can easily cost upwards of $1k which is twice the value of the engine. Save your money and find a 54 or later engine. You'll be much happier.

 

So do they make a adp that will take a 700r4?
Dave

 

Here are all the adapters that Wilcap sells:

http://www.wilcap.com/Hemi.html#Hemi%20Adapters

7. 331-318AT - 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Chrysler 727 or 904 automatic. Includes flexplate. Uses stock or aftermarket starter.
8. 331-FTL 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Ford "Top Loader" 1964-1978. Uses Stock flywheel.Uses stock or aftermarket starter.
9. 331-FT5 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Ford T5 1979-1992. Uses Stock flywheel. Uses stock or aftermarket starter.
10. 331-318MT 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Chrysler A833. Uses Stock flywheel. Uses stock or aftermarket starter.
11. 331-CADLA 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Cadillac/Lasalle Manual Trans. Uses Stock flywheel. Uses stock or aftermarket starter.
12.331-350MT 1951-1953 331 Chrysler ( Extended Block or Bellhousing) to Chevrolet Manual Trans. Uses Stock flywheel. Uses stock or aftermarket starter.

Here's what Hot Hemi Heads Sells

'51 - '53 Chrysler to Chevy Manual
'51 - '53 Chrysler to 727 / 518

Keep in mind, you can use these adapters with other adapters to get what you need. I'm using a GM T5 adapter behind mind to mount up a T56 from RS Gear. I'm guessing that adapter works for Muncie, T10, and S-T10 as well.