I was reading the responses on the thread asking about porcelain coating headers and there seemed to be some confusion about what is what - much of it my own. So I would like to open this up for questions and hopefully get some clarification on a few things. Should help work out some ideas for my car and I'm sure will help others. Like what is "jet hot"? How thick are these ceramic coatings generally? What colors are available? Is cad plating still available? What about zinc plating something - is that commercially available? If you have a bolt chromed will you need to chase the threads? Stuff like this. I think everyone has a basic understanding of what it takes to chrome something, but what is expected - on both sides - when you drop off something to be ceramic coated? Could you get a pile of hardware and a few select suspension parts jet hot coated in leu of cad plating? Would that hardware still be usable or would the threads need to be chased? Cost differences? And the last and most important thing. This seems to be an area with a lot of misnomers. So it would be most useful if everyone who responds to this could do it with first hand knowledge. If that isn't possible could you please qualify your statement with something so we know? Like "I have heard that..." Thanks.
I have limited experience with chrome plating and ceramic coating. I have only had headers ceramic coated by both Jet Hot and HPC with very good results. The headers on my race car were coated over 15 years ago and are just now starting to have rust issues, Keep in mind that this car has sat as much as 4 years without being run. The coating did not change the tolerences much as far as bolt holes and pipe to pipe fit, but I dont know how it would affect nut and bolt threads. One thing to be said about ceramic coating, it should only be applied to FINISHED parts, if you have to make any bending or welds the coating will be ruined. Chrome plating can have a big effect on bolt threads, the place that did the chrome plating on all of the nuts and bolts for a show car that I built had us mask off all of the threads before plating, even then the acids used in the plating process did nasty things to the threads underneath the tape. Even with the threads masked off almost all of the nuts and bolts had to have the threads chased. You have to be VERY careful when ***embling plated nuts and bolts as it is easy to flake the plating off with tools. Plating also will change the wrench flat sizing in varying degrees depending on how thick the plating ended up on the particular fastener. Another thing to keep in mind with plating and coating, make sure that your parts have the surface that you want on them because plating, and to some degree coating, will magnify any imperfections on the surface of the metal. Much of the same rules apply to powdercoating as well concerning surface finish and threads. I am sure that there were other issues I ran into that I dont recall, is has been over 10 years since I built a show car and many brain cells have died a horrible death since then.
First hand knowledge? OK. I've used Jet-hot twice, each time giving them a batch of parts. (headers, misc. parts...) Both times excellent service, followed by a $20 gift card in the mail for next time. All parts lifetime warranty, including headers. There were some parts, like the trans dipstick tube, where I wanted the finish, without overdone chrome. And it doesn't leak. Had my three intakes done, just a little thread chasing is all. No worries. If I were building a "show car", I'd use the Jet-hot on driveshaft, etc.... with no concerns of wear.
I have used these guys http://www.barrettplating.com/index.htm for clear zinc plating recently. They can barrel plate (a bunch of small parts rolling around in a barrel) up to 250 pounds for $65. Gave a nice, semi-shiney silver plating like a new bolt from the hardware store. Must send them bare and clean steel parts. I did a bunch of odd Ford bolts, Stromberg linkages, Stewart Warner gauge buckets, and other vintage hardware. I'll use them again. Opening that tub after getting it back from them was like Christmas. Neat shiney parts!
The ceramic coatings are basically liquid aluminum. They are a sacrificial metal so they are not maint free. They will start to oxidize over time, but polishing is not a big deal. The actual trade name is Cermatel which has been used in aviation for many years. They will have to blast them to remove any residue of oil etc so just drop them off and let them handle it. The thread will probably have to be chased. Most times they tape them off before spraying.
Use & maintain more coatings systems daily than most even heard of dealing with military aircraft. Have used Jet Hot coatings on many off road quads, bikes, long travel rails, cl*** 8 trucks, even farm equipment. Simple it works, and does come in a varitey of colors, also if you pony up a little extra denero they can mix colors for you. The thickness is of coating is determind by what tempurtures it has to endure,ei: thermal expansion, retraction, temp range, asorbtion rates, and conduction "cooling". You can mix coating systems get the optimal performance you need or look you desire.
This is an insignificant detail, but may be useful to some: When I had a car pinstriped recently, the striper strongly advised me not to stripe any parts that had been powder coated. He said that the striping will scuff off easily, and that the only way around it is to (1) scuff the surface of the coating beforehand and (2) to clear coat it over the striping. Who knew?
Also, how about some info on what type of coating was available when, and if it was used by hot rodders and customizers, and during what years/era?
i dont know if they still do it, i suppose they still do, is coat manifolds in porcelain. they can do it in numerous colors and the finish last forever almost. i used to be in the resto crowd years ago (still am but im in the closet) a lot of the higher end cars had their manifolds done in porcelain like the Buicks, Olds, Packards, ect. and some of the br*** era Fords, White, Reo, ect.. if you look in the Old Cars Weekly or Hemmings Motor News their should be someone that still does this. they look really neat and they are slick like a coffee mug!!
I have noticed that there can be a lot of difference between Powdercoats. I had all the suspension parts Powdercoated on a Car I built 20/25 years ago, and i needed to get some of that off to press in bushings etc. Sandpaper wouldnt touch it. I had to take a File to it. Couple of years ago the Shop I worked at had some Suspension Parts Powdercoated, and it was about as soft as Rattle Can Paint...
Sinticket here on the HAMB has (from what I have been told) a really ****ing sweet model a sedan. His lakes pipes are copper coated, and when I heard that I almost lost my mind. What a cool idea. Anyone have pics of Copper plated anything?
Simple...look at a penny, has a thin copper plating on over a zinc base. Some condinser coils are copper plated also.
Yeah, I guess if you asked what chrome exhaust pipes look like I could tell you to look at you kitchen sink but it really does not do it justice huh? I know that all chrome is copper plated and I have seen it before it was dipped into the Chromium bath. I just was wondering if anybody else used copper on their car and what they used it on. A couple examples would be cool.
I would have given the same response to myself more then likely. Jesse James had a copper plated bike once but I can't remember if the pipes were also. And in that picture I can't focus on anything but the copper skinned model. Damn you!!! You know my weakness.
Removing ceramic coatings from the surfaces of turbine airfoils uses an organic caustic solution, comprising: a storage tank for the organic caustic solution; a pre-heater to preheat the organic caustic solution to a first preselected temperature; a high pressure pump to provide pressurized organic caustic solution at a first preselected pressure to the pre-heater; an autoclave capable of holding the organic caustic solution and a plurality of turbine airfoils at a second elevated preselected pressure; a first pipe connecting the pre-heater to the autoclave having a first control valve selectable between providing a variable communication between the pre-heater and the autoclave and isolating the autoclave; a heating source for heating the autoclave to a second preselected temperature; a cooler for cooling the organic caustic solution upon removal of the organic caustic solution from the pressure vessel; and a second pipe connecting the autoclave to the cooler having a second valve selectable between isolating the autoclave and providing communication from the autoclave to the cooler so that the organic caustic solution can be removed from the autoclave upon completion of the ceramic coating removal. = A lot of **** Same as headers...hope not??
Aero engine manufacturers use that process cause it also goes into the part's cooling p***ages to clean the inside. Google the Kolene process and you'll see, just a hot salt bath to dissolve the coating's bonding agents. (coincidentally why coated headers and road salt don't mix). The pressurized autoclave/Kolene process is not that commonly used, expensive and dangerous. Exterior removal (like headers) can be done with a sandblaster.
Unless your plater has heartburn with whatever may remain inside the tubes, there's no metallurgical reason why they can't be plated. The coatings used on headers are really mechanical bond, they're not diffusing anything into the base metal. If the header stuff acts anything like aero stuff it'll be kinda gummy and clump in the sandblaster's return screen.
If I'm not mistaken, Jesse's bike was copper, as in hand formed by him with master metal guru Faye Butler watching over his shoulder. Not plated. It was the OCC boys who plated their bike. Let's not get Jesse started on that one. Vance
No pix, but an experience: I had the shift lever of my LaSalle transmission copper plated, to kinda match the car's paint color. The plater tried to talk me out of it, saying that it would tarnish rapidly and require frequent polishing unless I clear coated it. True that; it did tarnish, but it looked neat when it was polished up.
Who me.. Hey know my **** but I dont know it all, hence the HAMB. Bring together degenerate, warped, and just plan wierd minds alike to one happy place.
heres the statue of liberty bike that OCC had Advanced Plating in Nashville to do the plating. its all copper plating...........
Copper plating...it tarnishes VERY quickly, though, so if you like "shiny" you need to polish and wax it often, or clear powdercoat it, or spray clear Imron on it, like I did.
The OCC bike, while hideous and vile, is also plated in copper that was melted from old wiring in the Statue of Liberty. Neat idea at the heart of it all IMO.
Personal experience...This is Eastwood's cast aluminum powder coat done by me in my garage. The thermostat housing is cast iron and looks weird to me if it is painted. The carb bases were PCed in a black wrinkle finish. Not too shiny and it retains the cast iron texture. I like contrasts in texture. A completely chromed engine is not appealing to me. This is their new reflective chrome PC. I've had mixed results. Most likely operator error. I can tell you it's a ***** to bead blast off. One caution Carb cleaner will dull it in a heart beat. A 19 dollar bottle will probably do 15 or 20 VCs. As to the original question I wouldn't pay the extra price to have a specialized high temp exhaust coating like Jet Hot put on a run of the mill ch***is part. It's over kill to me. I got a bottle of the semi-flat black to use on engine compartment items and I am pleased with those results. I'll use it on anything that will fit in my oven. The rest will get the Krylon 1613 Semi-flat black rattle can finish. It is amazing what it can do to a lower control arm to make it look clean and neat, not "put mirrors under me" show stuff but I'm not embarr***ed if anyone looks under my cars. Will it last for eternity? Nope, but it will out last me.
Anyone ever have a Grille done with the Chrome Look or Jet-Hot ? .I have a 34 grille I am prepping, but curious if that would be a good alternative to Chrome Plate. ]
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