What's the best primer-surfacer these days?

Paint-work used to be my bread and ****er about a decade ago, but I switched "careers" so I've been out of the game for awhile. I'm getting to the point on my project(s) where a good primer-surfacer is needed, so I'm wondering what you painters out there are using these days. I used to LOVE PPG K-36... good-build, dries flat, and sands nice with little "clogging". I think PPG still makes K36, but maybe there's better products available now. Have things changed much in the last 10 years?

Keep in mind I'm in California and don't know how bad compliance laws are anymore. We all know that can dictate what we can get our hands on! I've used water-bourne primers before and they ****ED compared to urethane.

Thanks in advance,
-ns

 

K36 is nice, I use it often. However my go-to primer is House of Kolor KP2CF Epoxy. Plenty of build, adhesion to damn near anything, and no clogging. Reduce it 10% and use it as a surfacer. Plus its an ugly mint green that inspires you to get your project done quicker.

 

K36 is a great surfacer. I have used it for years. But lately I have been using PPG's NCP271. It has great filling capabilities, powders up really nice when sanding. But to me it's biggest strength is the fact that it is a corrosion resistent surfacer. You can prime over damn near anything without having to worry about putting down any sort of an etch or epoxy first.

I know most guys don't worry about that much, but when using most sufacers, any bare metal spots should have an etch put down first. Otherwise you run a big risk of corrosion somewhere down the road.

Biggest down fall........ NCP stinks like a *****!

 

What's the difference price-wise between K36 and that stanky ****? The NCP stuff sounds right up my alley! Thanks for the tip!

 

They are very close in price. You will like the product. It is the corrosion protection that makes it smell so bad. Whatever they use to make it do that really smells.

 

Yeah man, it seems anything that etches and/or is epoxy smells FUNKY! It's just letting you know how bad it is for you... of course, the sweet smelling stuff will kill you too.

-ns

 

I metal prep, then shoot with MarHyde's Ultimate Primer. 2-6 coats, depending..then guide coat, block with 360, touch up with 2-part glaze, block the glaze, then a coat of colored sealer, then base coat.

Been using this process for about 12-15 years with zero problems.

 

I only use HOK kp2cf. Shoot it over bare metal. Then block& shoot more,.

 

That NCP271 has crazy strong adhesion.
It sands real nice too... I used it for a few years real nice stuff.

I use this stuff now in the shop for all our interior restorations.
http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/Our Goal.htm

Jdee

 

you should check out the Sherwin Williams P30 SpectraPrime

 

Don't know about the VOC for california, but I'm a fan of fibergl***-evercoat featherfill. It's a polyester based high build, direct to metal. uses the same hardener as fibergl***. Use it at work for all of our hot rod stuff as the first prime. has killer build (i've primed out dents... sshhhh!) holds down really well and sands nicely. best part is we can get it for about $55 a gallon. reduce w/ a little acetone to kill texture and use at least a 1.8 tip. I normally seal or reprime w/ a urethane, but have used it direct to base without problems. also killer when working over fibergl***.

jon

 

I use a poly prime also the build is really good and sands real easy with no clogging.Plus you can get on it in about an hour at 75*.

 

I'm running my buick in that primer this summer. Bright as hell. Sprays really good.

 

Can you apply filler over the top of the NCP?

 

i've recently used Xtreme 2k High Build Primer/Filler/Surfacer. This is a two part primer w/ an activator and it worked well for me. It has options to mix with reducer to be a sealer as well.

-scott noteboom

 

NCP shrinks and swells under custom finishes. K-36 does also. It takes a while to do, usually just about when the car's near done. The body work needs to be absolute perfection with these. Too much filler and you're gonna see it no matter how good it is. Poly-primes are ok but more of a sprayable "bondo" than a surfacer. Poly-primers also give the surface a sponge to soak up all the solvents. Again more shriking and extended dry times even out to the final clear. I've found that PPG's "Velocity" line, DPS 3055, is as good as it gets. High build, fast dry, easy sand wet or dry, little to zero shrinkage/swelling. K-36 and it's cousin, K-38 are old news. They work but so do you. NCP is ancient history. Worked with a guy who'd only use NCP and I did a f'gl*** conv boot with it. A new part, filled in some pinholes, did all the right things. Every repair came back the next day even before paint. Hated it. Too "soft" maybe.

For price, Transtar K-2 grey is hard to beat. Head and antlers above K-36. They offer a "QWIK-SAND" line that needs no sealer and no base prime. Prime your panel block it out and straight to paint with no sealer needed. It does sand harder than 3055 but color and gloss hold out are worth the effort. May be hard to get out west, I don't know their distribution.

 

I agree, I started using featherfill a couple years ago, love it if you're blocking something rough like sandblasted sheetmetal. I lay down a good coat of DP40 for corrosion before the featherfill ( it adhears to bear metal but is poris like bondo), 3 coats of fiberfill, block with 180 dry, top with urathane to fill 180 skatches and go, real quick and easy. Less prone to cracking the urathanes if you need high build IMHO.

 

the best primer surfacer is actually a polyester primer/filler, such as Claussens All U Need and Featherfill Slicksand. These products will fill up to .012" voids, and actually fill better than urethane primers. Urethane may fill up to .002-003" at best.

with the new polyester spray fillers, you can wipe a panel with bondo, air board sand it with 40 grit, and shoot it with 2 coats of filler, and fill in 40 grit sandscratches. Then sand that with 220 and 400, and you're ready for topcoat. You can also spray it over bare metal, epoxy, or self etch.

the trick to doing bodywork is knowing the shortcuts to make the job go faster and easier, and polyester spray filler is one of the "tricks"

 

I would like to know more about it....

 

Has anyone tried this stuff?

https://www.squeegskustoms.com/squeegs-orderform.html

I have 2 gallons of it, but have not tried it. It's supposed to work on bare metal, and has virtually no shrinkage. The only drawback is it takes a while to cure.

 

Shrinkage is a *****. Stopped using K36 and NCP217 because of this(and the smell of NCP will make you hurl). DPS 3055 is a great product but pricy. I usually hit everything with dp epoxy and let it kick for a day. Then do any fillers and go over it with two good coats of poly. Hit it with 80 and 180. Two coats of DPS 3055 and 180-320-600 wet. Been burned with sealers too many times, so I have been going right over the 3055 with top coats.

Would be intrested to hear about Squeegs primer.

 

i have used the evercoat feather fill and like it alot. good build and sandable, but i have limited experiance. my .02

 

K-36 I like to let it sit for about a week though, perfer it to sit in sun

 

I like to use dupont 250S epoxy primer over bare metal and the use the URO 1380S has great fill and sands easy. check it out at www.performancecoatings.dupont.com its in the commercial coatings section. Most automotive paint products are for sopt repair on new cars not restorations, but if you consider the commercial coatings its a lot better.

 

i work for squeegs haven't used anything but there primer since great stuff!! great over metal/ super build O srinkage!!!!!!!!! step 1: prep over bare metal with da 80 36 grind seems body lines wipe with acetone 2 coats primer step 2: da with 80 appley filler block with 36 step 3:4-6 coats of primer block with 80 $2 coats primer block with 400 wet. paint its on the web site squeeg'scustoms

 

Shrinkage is do to to much product to fast.. it traps all the Solvents and stays soft underneath.. even after you have sanded it.. it will still be soft.

Let it flash between coats.. if you put 4 coats on back to back.. it will sink every time.. base and clear are way more agressive .. same with enamels, or acrylics..it could also mean a adhesion problem..

 

The question is , who's doing the private label for Squeege , since they're a paint shop and not a paint manufacturer ?

 

I belive its valspar(hok) not 100% about it. and no its not the same as any other products they have. The squeegs stuff is f$**ing awsome. plus u get 2 gallons for around $200, thats pretty good deal. With some hok and ppg stuff at 150-up a gallon plus hardner at 50-75 a QT. Squeegs uses only this primer and if u ever seen any of there work u whould understand!

 

Been using xtreme 2k for quite a few years now. Very happy with it maybee it's the name !!!!! and it's resonable priced $80ga . It's thick 1ga will easily make 2 spayable.
Sands fast with little clogging. Have mixed this primer with a urathane reducer for a satin finish that has held up very good

HOC kp2 is over rated and over priced

Evercoat featerfill is great if you are on a tight buget

 

No question about the quality of their work , they did a Merc for a friend ,and it;s very nice . As far as Valspar is concerned , I've used their Direct to metal primer for several years with no bad results . I sure what Squeege is selling is good , or he would'nt put his name on it .