I have a question regarding the Chevy 253 engine that I haven't been able to find by searching HAMB or the web. What was the redline speed for a stock engine? Thanks in advance Harry
red line..stock..well i think the engine would go flat around 4500 or so..it might try to rev higer but its falling on its face and not producing any more power..and that might be a bit over the top..maybe closer to 4200. alot is going to be determined by the condition and miles already on it. my opinion 5Grand out of it..your wating for something bad to happen at any moment...I could be wrong..sure some one will have more info..
Thanks, That's kind'a what I was figuring, I was using 4000 as a guesstimate but I have zero knowledge when it comes to Chevy L6 engines. All my experience is in Ford L6 & V8 or Chevy V8s. I am wanting to stay with the original 6 and do what I can to squeeze performance out of it from there in stages. First step is getting it running I guess.
I think it would also depend on older 'babbit' model 235 versus later model full pressure 235. Determining year which will help determine make will help.
Not sure about redline, but typical peak torque in a stock engine was 1800 rpm and max horsepower was at3500, according to a chart in "How To Hop Up Chevrolet & GMC 6 Cylinder Engines" by Floyd Clymer (1951).
There was a babbit 235? I thought that was just the 216's. Like I said I am ignorant in all things Chevy L6. I have 2 engines, and the one in the car is the original. So that is the 52 version mated to a powerglide. I'll look at the number on the other one later and post what I find. Thanks Harry
Yep babbit engines were up untill 53..after that, say early or maybe some very late 53 's had pressure..but I think it really happened in 54
If your 235 has the tall side cover that partially covers the plugs it is a babbit motor. 235's can float a valve easily especially original motors with weak springs. Dont try to strech it's limits. If keeping the original motor is a factor then go through it sensibly so it will have a longer life.
I guess my dreams of twin turbos has fallen by the wayside. lol So can the babbit motors be beefed up, new springs, full pressure oiling, or is this a case of having to get a later model engine? If I swap out for a later engine, I'll have to swap out the PG also right? What else I guess I am looking for the least expensive way to go about this, and keep the original look. The second engine I have is matched up to a 3 speed. How hard is it to drop that in and add the necessary extra pedal?
A late model motor is almost bolt-in. You'll need a custom water pump, but that's about it. Same bolt-pattern for the trans.
Hmmm, Knowledge is truely a dangerous thing. Now I am wondering if a should trying to trade my 2 engines for a 54 vintage model. When did they make a change to the trans side of the motor? Was that when the aluminium PG came out"
They all have the same bolt-pattern. You don't have to worry about it as long as it is a stovebolt motor. The bolt-pattern didn't change until 61(62? whatever) when they killed off the 235 for the 230/250/292 series motors, which used a standard SBC bolt pattern.
A later motor is generally cheaper than trying to adapt a splash motor to full pressure. The Powerslide should bolt to any 235, since you already have the appropriate flex plate. My understanding is that a '53 car 235 with a Powerglide from the factory would have hydraulic tappets, full pressure oil, and insert bearings (conflicting reports on the last one). In '54 the 235 was full pressure and insert fleet wide (or so I'm told, by people that were there). If your engine has a kidney shaped tin cover held on with 3 screws (on the pasenger side IIRC) you have a splash oil engine (cause someone could have changed it, yes I read where you say it's orriginal). One thing to remember is that any of these are bypass or partial flow filtration. That means the oil comes out of the main galley, goes through the filter (the canister) and dumps back into the pan. The mod to full flow is fairly simple and comparativly cheap (depending on how much of it you do yourself).
I've seen the full flow mod detailed and I'm not squimish about doing it myself. But are there any other benefits to swapping in the later model engines?
Not having to listen to the 'experts' that want to tell you that you don't know what you have. Other than that,
Post the stamped number behind the dizzy, and I can tell you what it is for sure. A 1952 powerglide car would be a babbit 235, Hydraulic lifters and a short side cover, if original. It shouldn't have the oil distribution cover on the drivers side, like other babbit pounders. 1953 PG car was the first full pressure engine. All full pressure 235's are insert bearings. Earlier babbit rod engines can be converted to inserts for around $300 IIRC... I have posted alot of info regarding swapping to the later full pressure engines.
There is a magazine out there called " HOT ROD DELUX" that just did a build up on a 235 stovebolt. They talk about all the changes, and even ran it on a dyno. You shoud definately read this article, if you are thinking about the 235. It's a wealth of info. The stovebolt was built till '64. so you could find some really late motors out there. Especially look in trucks. The '53 to ''64 models have the later bearings and full flow oil, and would be an easy swap. Other than full flow oiling (read longer life), the other benefit to getting a later motor would be the use of bearing inserts instead of babbit. Have you looked into rebuilding your motor yet? I don't know where you would find someone who could re-pour those babbit bearings. To replace the Babbit bearings, like yours, you first have to have the block heated up to melt the old babbit out. The they use some kind of form placed in the saddles and pour in molten metal. Then remove the forms and gradually scrape out the babbit till it has the right amount of clearance. I suspect this would be costly, at modern labor rates.
When referring to a Chevrlet "babbit pounder", the connecting rods had babbit bearings. The mains were the more modern type replaceable shells, although through 1954 they still had shims between the block and main caps to adjust final clearence. Despite speculation to the contrary, ALL 1953 PG engines had aluminum pistons, insert rod bearings, and a fully pressurized oiling system. 1953 standard shift engines were 235s with short side covers, but had babbit rods, cast iron pistons, and "spray nozzle" oiling to the rods. Federal Mogul sold special rods for the babbit engines that were machined to take an aftermarket insert bearing. Honestly, if the insert rods were used in an early engine, it would hold up to modified street duty; the babbit bearings were the weakest point of the lower end, not the oiling system. Later aluminum pistons can be used in the early engines to decrease the load on the rod bearings. If you do rebuild an early engine, there still seems to be lots of N.O.S. babbit rods out there, and they don't bring high $$$.
Thanks Folks, Earlier this morning I had a pretty good idea of how I was about to proceed with this project, and now after all this I am totally clueless! Again I guess the first step is to figure out exactly what I have, then go from there. I'll post the casting #'s later this evening, and I guess I'll go from there. Thanks again to all of you.
The early 235's from the big trucks (41-49) had tall side covers and were splash. So this post was correct. Pretty soon Snarl or Heathen will chime in to verify this fact.
OK folks I grabbed the number off the spare motor. It is: FBM317911 Where can I find a decoder for these?
Found it so it appears that it is a 48 vintage 216 truck engine, so no luck there. Guess I'm now in the market for a "new", post 53 motor. Anyone got one?
If you have the turbo stuff already and you want an "old" 6 cylinder engine to use it on, find a GMC. The stock bottom end is much heavier ... the 4 main Chevys won't take much prolonged high RPM use without a lot of extra work. The GMC is capable of producing much more power as well. It's a bolt-in swap into an early Chevy car or truck
There are some changes in mounting from 52-54 that limit what will bolt in where to some extent. At least in the cars.
#1- if you really want to make power, forget the 235. #2- when my 54 was stock it would die at 3500rpm. this was a powerglide engine w/ hydraulic lifters. #3- My 58 engine, with some mods done to it will run to 6000 with no problems. I drag it some, shift at 5000 works the best and am going thru the lights at about 5200. This engine is real streetable and it feels comfortable going to 4000 to shift just in normal driving. But it is torqy enough to putt around at 1500. I went thru the effort on this one to do a full flow oil filter, I don't know if this is really neccessary. Frank
I was just kidding about the turbos, I want a period correct hotrod. Hell it still has a "HighPerformance Autoparts" sticker in the window, which will be preserved as well.
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