i recently removed my trans from the motor (302/c4) and in the process i obviously removed the starter, but when putting it back on i had the worst time ever getting the autozone **** shim to fit over the bellhousing bolt holes. So i said **** it and grabbed two washers approximately the same thickness and shimmed the starter that way. Now im charging the battery and decided to try cranking the motor over, but all i get is a "click" and nothing else. The fan turns a little but nothing else, just a click...is my starter shimmed wrong or should i just charge the battery longer? sorry if this seems like a stupid question but i couldn't find anything close to this in the search bob
sounds as if you are not getting enough current to the starter. the "click" is probably from the starter solenoid. the starter should "whirr" or make some sort of gawd awful noise when you hit the key. Vance
Fords don't use shims on the OEM/stock starters. If the starter is good and you actually have the correct starter properly installed in the motor then one or more of the following could be causing you problems. The battery could still be dead. Your starter solenoid (mounted on an inner fender panel in an OEM application) may be shot. You have a bad connection on the main wires going to the starter and/or to ground. Make sure you have ground wires going directly to a clean spot on the engine block and to the vehicle ch***is and body. Ford starter/flywheel/bellhousing combinations are specfic to application and are precision fit meaning that when properly matched up required nothing more than bolts to hold them in place with proper alignment. Keep looking. -Bigchief.
the starter and motor cranked fine before pulling everything but im starting to think that the battery is on the last leg of its life, just wanted to see what everyone else was thinking...since i **** at these things lol thanks all
Yes--fords do not use shims--are you sure you stabed the touqe converter correctly--,If you have never done a c/4 it is an easy mistake to make.Usualy takes out the pump.
my 2 cents: check all your connections to the solenoid and battery and make sure they're clean and tight. Ive had a prob with my new starter and it always comes down to that. I always freak out though until it hits me what the real cause probably is. You can always take your starter to autozone to test it. Goood luck I know its frustrating
He meant: "Stabbed", as in, inserted and seated the torque converter correctly onto the end of the splined output shaft of the C4.
Well, you didn't have to "force" anything back together, did you? I don't know about a 3 click rule, since I've never messed with a C4...maybe someone else will chime in...
I shouldn't admit this, but it 30 years of swapping 1.5 billion starters, I have never shimmed a single one and never had a problem. Im pretty sure that shimming is not your problem.
Do you own a battery charger, tester, voltmeter, or jumper cables? Can you borrow a good battery from a known running car? Take out the shims in the starter, you don't need them. If you don't have a ground or don't know where that would be, use the jumper cables as ground wires. Does the engine turn over by hand? If so, the torque converter is in all the way. Buy or borrow a voltmeter, and a battery charger. those clamp on testers are handy as well. One or all will make your diagnosis alot easier.
Actually.....there is a 'band-aid' shim made for the Ford starters that were used when the crankshaft thrust bearing surface goes away and allows the crank/flywheel to "float" and chew up the starter. The general rule is that you do not have to shim a Ford starter unless you have the symptoms below....and if you have the symtoms below you've got more issues than a mis-aligned starter. In all my years of playing with high mileage Fords I've ever had to shim a starter. Here's a snip I robbed from a Bronco site about it. News to me! Sounds like this would cause more problems than it solved...... TECHNICAL BULLETIN: Ford Starter Shims ALERT: FORD STARTER DRIVE FAILURES APPLICATION: All Ford Inline 6 & V-8 Engines, 1963 thru 1991 PROBLEM: Ford starters come in (either a core or alleged defective) with the clutch retaining cap on the drive cut off on the front side, or worn from running against the flywheel. REASON: The engine flywheel is floating. The crankshaft thrust bearing that keeps the crankshaft centered wears after about 60,000 miles, allowing the whole crankshaft and flywheel ***embly to move toward the front of the engine. THIS IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE STARTER: **REFER TO FIGURE 1 AND FIGURE 2 BELOW** SOLUTION: Ford Motor Company has made a shim to correct this problem. The part number was D6TZ-11N004. It was .090 thick and fit between the starter nose housing and the bell housing. Thus backing the starter away from the ring gear. Ford has discontinued this shim. **THE SHIMS ARE NOW AVAILABLE THRU H. M. C.** HOPPER MANUFACTURING COMPANY INC. 8500 Carbide Cr., STE 3 Sacramento, Ca. 95828 (916) 688-8960 -Bigchief.
does anyone know if it will destroy the converter by bolting the bellhousing down and not having the converter seated all the way?
Talking about tearing up the teeth, correct? You can destroy a flex plate (or equivalent) pretty quick by not seating a starter.
The converter might not mind it as much as the front pump in the transmission..... which would be toast if you had it running that way. An easy way to tell if you have it seated properly is if you undo the converter to flywheel bolts....you should be able to rotate the converter a bit (until the drain plug - if equipped- - hits its hole in the flywheel) and maybe slide the converter back a little bit from the flywheel. Think 'wiggle room' type clearances. -Bigchief.
He PM'd me and said the engine does not turn over by hand, so I am figuring he stacked the pump, or did not click the converter in all the way. I could not tell him if it would trash the pump by simply bolting it all together. I did it once, and I loosened up the bellhousing bolts until it started and ran. Bad idea. Had to replace the pump. Will it bend anything in there by bolting it up, or is he OK as long as he does not start it?
ok so it hasn't ran yet with this problem, before i pulled it i had it running and everything was fine except the trans was acting funny (reason for repull)...so hopefully im ok, im gonna tear into it tomorrow and see if i cant reseat the converter and bolt everything back up and try again
you did not click the converter in all the way. The trans shop term is stacking the pump. Each step in the pump clicks in to those two notches in the end of the converter. Each time, the converter goes in a little bit more. Picture it as flat plates that need to line up. If you get one engaged, but not the others, you will basically be forcing the trans and engine together as you bolt it up. Those other two pieces of the puzzle need to be engaged as well. If you force it, you are basically pressing the pump pieces together so they do not turn. That is why the engine won't rotate. Loosen the bellhousing bolts about a 1/4 inch and I bet it will turn. Make sense?
you didn't by chance change out the flexplate when you did this? i recently had to go thru 3 flexplates from autozone before I got one from somewhere else that worked, the ring gear around it wasnt machined right or something, starter would hang up and not crank.
man you have been SOOO much help i can't even tell you how much i appreciate it, do you think i have to pull the entire trans or is there some way i can loosen the bellhousing and push the torque converter down all the way? like i said i **** at these things lol
Best bet is to pull the trans back enough to play with the converter. Better to be safe than sorry. You should have to pull the converter forward to meet up with the flexplate when all is said and done.
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