Vega box in a traditional rod

OK guys i'm sure this has been asked a thousand times but I have to know. I am building a traditional 30' coupe (flathead, 3 speed, 36' rear, unsplit front wishbone), would a vega steering box ruin this car or are they considered ok? Thanks for the input.

 

They're not traditional, but I don't think they "ruin" the car. If you want to stay more traditional and have cross steer try lookin at the 36-41 boxes. jmho.

 

They look fine to me. It's not like it's a part that's going to jump out at you as looking way out of place.

 

It's the only "Modern part" on my coupe and you really don't notice it... I figured when
it comes to steering i'll stick with something a bit newer...

 

Only to the people that care about it. What do you feel about it. It's one of the first things that I notice with the Borgeson U joints. It's all up to you as to how authentic YOU want it to be. If it makes a difference to you then you will grow to dislike your choice. More than one hotrod has been retro graded because the owner wasn't satisfied. I built a traditional-ish hotrod that I wanted to used on a daily basis and made concessions that I was content with including a Vega box. I'd personally never put one on my roadster. Build what you will be comfortable. Nothing is cast in stone.

 

I put one on my sedan, one of less than 18 parts total that are post '48. Had lots of misgivings at first, but damn.... that sum***** steers nice! I still don't like the looks of it but nobody seems to notice but me. The lakes style headers tend to hide it from view.
There are a few concessions that seem practical and chasing bias ply tires down the grooves in the hi-way is, I believe, a little less strenuous than with an early ford box

 

damb well put....case closed

 

Your ok in my book....

 

I have one on an A because it came with the frame. Not traditional but it sure steers nice and not too many others know that it is there. (fendered A sedan)

Neal

 

Hey man, Hot Rodding is all about progress. More power(Flattie speed parts, or a Caddy/Olds in an "A"), better steering(Vega), better brakes(juice instead of cable), etc

 

Its your car . . . and sometimes a few upgrades will work out just fine.

Okay . . . in the interest of a solid verbal HAMB beating . . . here I go

One side of me is all traditional (39 box, early juice brakes, peg-leg banjo rear), but the other side competes with the traditional side. I've had both . . . and there is a place for both . . . its your choice. Will you probably enjoy a Vega box more than an original, 32 - 40, or an F1 . . . most likely . . . are you going to second guess yourself or do you care what others think - those are more serious questions?

Having driven the heck out of a 34 steering box, 39 Zephyr ******, with a 12 lb Schiefer flywheel and a couple different flatheads (big cubes, 3 carbs, blower, etc), I now think more about how to actually make a flathead a better engine for a variety of situations. I'd have been a bunch better off with a 25 lb steel flywheel and a Muncie . . . or better yet a 5 speed Tremec, than the old and totally rebuilt 39 box that I ran or the POS 34 steering box I put up with. (Had to slip the clutch to start out from most stop lights . . . or dump it and burn rubber. One big PITA if you ask me).

Do I like the looks of a Vega steering box, or a Tremec or another type of top-loader modern transmission behind a flathead . . . well NO, but drive one for more than a few miles and from hundreds of stop lights and tell me the old worm and sector or the 39 Zephyr box is better . . . the only way they are close to better is that is that they were made 65+ years ago and look the part. Just cause I could brag that I "did 60 in low" with a 39 Zephyr box doesn't make it **** for getting away from a stop light . . . even though it is totally "cool" and one of the "hot setups" back in the day. Bragging rights are bragging rights - just know that many of the traditional "must haves" have nothing to do with performance or actual driveability. Rodders back in the day would have gladly thrown some of their traditional parts away - for parts that were more reliable and better performers. It is a fine line to walk . . . staying totally traditional . . . and being happy with the resulting ride. I say an appropriate "mix" is okay . . . just be sensible (and a Vega box is in my mind).

A couple of years ago I drove Flat32's 32 coupe with a hot flathead and a modern top-loader 4 speed . . . what a fun car to drive and it is a very traditional car and he drives and lives the life of a hot-rodder. He drove a couple thousand miles from the West Coast to Ohio to see family . . . slept in the car along the way. He's designed and cast his own flathead ram-runner manifold - just to see if he could go a bit faster in his flathead . . . imagineers many parts and innovative things. So his ****** wasn't traditional -- well, he was and is . . . so I'm not going to judge him in the least. His car hauled *** for a flathead and at the time he had let over 50+ people drive it . . . just to see what they thought -- I can guarantee that every one of us loved it!

Do what works for you . . . screw anybody who doesn't like it. They can bulid their cars their way . . .

Man . . . must have been a long day at work . . . I need to shut the hell up . . .

 

The 37-48 boxes are worm and roller same as mustang . About 4 turns lock to lock . Cheap and pretty easy to find with all thr fat fenders getting M2 stuff.

 

Evil hit it right on the head and my car has the same thing. What you should be more worried about is what YOU want. Its your car and you should build it for you and no one else.

Just my two cents.

 

Guys thanks for the great replies, your input has helped me make up my mind. Function over looks on this one.

 

If you're talking about those late sixties boxes used often in hot rods, you are incorrect.

Mustang boxes are recirculating ball bearing in the worm block and turn MUCH easier than the plain worm and rolling sector like old Fords (up to the F trucks) used.

 

I thought the general idea of hot rodding was to use newer or better parts, to improve the performance of old cars.

 

Use it....who cares about every part having to be period correct. No one told guys in the early 60s that sticking nailheads in coupes wasn't "traditional" enough. Go with whatever works for you.

 

On the looks...my take is that the thing that marks steering visually as "streetrod" versus "hotrod" is actually the shaft...older rods generally had a straight jacketed shaft, streerods have open shaft with lots of U-joints, sometimes even where a straight shaft would fit. I do grant that the U joints can solve otherwise unsolveable problems!
A Vega box with a real or visually approximated '40 Ford type column will look old...and a '39 Ford box with U-joints will look new. And there are about three people on the planet that could reliably distinguish the two boxes otherwise.

 

I've got a vega in my Model A coupe... and I LOVE it. It feels like it has power steering in it. And it's so hidden by the motor and headers, you cant even see it.

 

go for it,you dont notice it on most cars anyway if everything else is fairly traditional

 

I have one on my 36, and the funny thing is I can't see it from behind the steering wheel looking through the windshield.

 

Nice.

 

Good replies to questions that worry some.

Vega boxes have been used in hot rods, probably from day 2 of the Vega's existence and maybe before that since Vega wasn't the only car they were used in.

I bought my first one summer of 1985.
There were 25 Vegas in the junkyard and I only found one steering box.

23 years ago if I did the math right and I'd still be running it if a friend hadn't given me another one that was slightly better.
He tossed it cuz the adjuster screw had stripped out the threads in the aluminum top cover.
Took about an hour to make a stainless threaded repair piece and JB Weld it in place.

Still got the original Vega box though, it's in the 31 on 32 rails project roadster.
After adjusting it to specs, it works fine.

I dunno if it's Ford cast or stamped into the gennie part that makes it trad.
Probably so, but you'd think that after 25 years plus of hot rodders using Vega boxes that they would have achieved some kind of a trad rating.

Especially so since they'e repopping them and not the Ford boxes.

Cest' la vie...

 

safety is the most overlooked tradition. a new box is always better than a hit or miss junk yard find. Things can happen and if you have luck like mine it all happens at once.

 

The choices on that still require caution...letters posted on the HAMB seem to suggest that one brand of repro Vega has an exceedingly low mileage til worn sloppy...
I've always been a fan of actual OEM parts on things that can kill me. Aftermarket stuff varies from really superior to dangerous, and it takes a while to learn which is which.
OEM steering components seem to wear slowly and be pretty bulletproof on actual failure--maybe that's an actual benefit of having too many hungry lawyers around.
Around here, though, there aren't any Vegas to pillage. I think it's been at least 15 years since I've seen one in use (not counting tube frame drag cars), and they've been gone from the junkyards nearly as wrong. I bet there are more Duesenbergs left in NJ than Vegas.

 

I dunno about the Duesies.

I forget the name, but the Las Vegas casino across the street from Caesers Palace has quite a car museum.

Many, many Duesies are shown along with a lot of other historically important and interesting cars.

I think it's free as well.


Down the hill at Lauglin, the Riverside Casino - first one downstream from the bridge over the river - has a great car museum as well.
Also free.

The display at the Riverside changes fairly often and what they're featuring now are several dirt bikes from the 50's.
The AJS' and BSAs will create lust in your heart if not elsewhere....

 

Please leave the vega steering boxes for the other guys, there are LOTS of more traditionally appropriate options available if you do a little leg work...

 

I personally don't see anything wrong with using one, however if you are trying to go COMPLETELY traditional I would advise using a different one.

1shot

 

IMHO - I personally think people are using Vega boxes because.....(Ryan, I won't say, I'm holding back) It's too easy to just put in a Vega box and add all those U-joints to clear things where needed. When people see a Vega box, they just see someone who took a short cut in builing.

It's much more painful and techincally challenging to install an early Ford box with a pitman arm, get all the angles just right, grind and weld in that mounting plate and then make your exhaust bend around it with style.......

Be traditional, take on the challenge and throw away that 1-800 catalog full of vega boxes.... get up early, find a Ford F1 or F100 box at a swap meet, rebuild it yourself and be on your way........

Some people say that there is less "bump steer" with a Vega box...I say bulk up and hold on to that wheel !!!

my .02