Pictures of a broken cast I-beam axle

I would say that axle is actually a decent quality casting, it deflected quite a bit (for a casting) before fracture. All the picture really shows is how cast steel or irons fail, with a brittle fracture. It's the nature of the material.

FWIW you can take an engine block that's survived 200K miles of piston explosions and drop it 3 feet onto the ground and break a corner off. Does that mean the block was junk because it can't take a hit outside it's design parameters? No.

Many spindles on RWD cars are not forged, including what most of us are using for our disc brake conversions on the ends of these I beam axles

To assume your car will take a hit in "normal use" that will cause catastrophic failure is flawed logic.

I don't care what part of the car you're talking about, you can always find cases where proven parts disentigrated. Gonna chalk this up to another instance of that.

Good discussion though​

 

Best reply here.

Using the logic that some of you use I will not buy a new Chevy pickup now either......WHY? Because a few drunks have rolled them and the cabs got crunched, surely Chevy cabs are inferior to Ford Cabs?!

 

I agree.

In reality, everything brakes. Products are made to do a job, dont ask or expect them to do anything but the job they are made for.

They make warranties against "Manufacturing defects" Not " I was just Riding/Driving along and hit a tree".

If Ford made 1.4 million cast axles, and one tenth of a percent of them broke. Sign me up, thats an incredible failure rate.

On the other hand, some company is selling forged axles and has never had one brake, BUT, and it's a big but, they only have 500 in production. You should think about that.

Stuff brakes,true, but rarely doing it's intended job. Some people are realistic, and undertstand the most misunderstood saying. shit happens.

CHeers and beers
Hodge

 

I think so. If you've had it for 15 years and haven't used it yet, there's a high probablity that you'll have it another 15 and not use it. I don't think it's gonna break sitting in your garage.

As for the broken axle, I don't think that really damns them. He hit the truck hard enough to bend the frame. Obviously, the wheel took most of the force since it hit first. If he had a forged axle and it bent instead of broke it would still be trash and nobodys driving away from a accident with the front wheel pointing 90 degrees off center.

Now, if someone can produce one broken by hitting a curb or a pothole that would be something. I've seen cars that hit curbs get wheels torn off, jammed up into fender and completely undriveable.

And, FWIW I plan on using a forged axle.

 

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!! THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!!!!

Like the media digging up some non-issue on a slow day..................

 

That axle broke where I'd expect it to do so. The longer remaining end acted as a lever and it let loose where it was restrained.

The break was nice and clean, I'd say that there was no latent crack in the section where it broke. That could show as a lighter area of grain separation and would be most evident right after it broke.

Bob

 

I think anyone wth any knowledge of metals at all recognizes that forged is stronger and more dueable than cast, regardless of material.

I have a hard time caring about this report because I don't think collision performance was anywhere in the design criteria for either type of axle. I would be unlikely to reuse any axle after subjecting it to a good hit, regardless of material.

Why don't we save this comparrison for failures under intended conditions?

 

Yes, it broke.
and a forged axle in the same accident may have just bent.
But the point is..there is no point.
The accident happening wasnt effected by the axle, and the axle breaking didnt effect the outcome of the accident.
It seems like Dave is looking to blame someone for something, but from the post, i cant ascertain what ,or who that is..
can anyone else?

Not doubting that Forged axles are better..i think they are,

just looking for the motivation for this whole post, its like Dave just wants to go "see!? I told you cast axles are shit!"
is that all this is?
seems odd to me.

 

Here's one that broke also, but with good reason . BTW he wasn't drunk.

 

Bet if you soaked it with Gibbs it wouldn't have broken...

Brian

 

Back up the tuna boat Hodge,,,Ford make FORGED axles not cast!

This thread was intended to point out the cast verses forged arguement that has been heard on the hamb for years,,,everybody kept asking for proof,,,the cast axle broke.

Had the idiot driving the truck had a forged axle,,would the truck be wrecked ?,,hell yeah,,,would he have pretty much the same damage?,,,I'm sure he would,,would the forged axle been broken?,,,NO!,,and it could be put in a press and brought back into shape and used again! HRP

 

This is about safety, Can anyone here say they wouldnot feel much better knowing that they have a forged axle in the front ,when the chance of hitting a large pothole ,etc at 70 mph, than with a cast one, These hotrods can hurt you, so why not use the parts that are less likely to fail...

 

Your radius rod's ,4-bar's, hair pin's , tie rods or drag links will fail long before you have to worrie about a bent or broken axle.

 

Good Reason? What could be "Good" about this?

Although interesting to see ye broken pieces, I'm sure that the Hairpins, or wishbones or whatever were also totaled, the frame was bent, etc. etc. So even if it had been forged the car was still undriveable and we don't really learn anything here other than it's a picture of a broken axle. I still have to believe that if used well within their intended purpose and design criteria cast axles are plenty strong. These days there are plenty of cars build using cast spindles, which were always forged in the past, and they aren't breaking in millions of miles of everyday use.
I have a forged original Ford axle and do prefer the quality and actually "Metal finish" to cast, and I like the "Theory" that there is some flex built in (not sure I totally buy it but it sounds good) but I would not be afraid to run a cast one and have installed them in many friends cars.
Show me one that broke during a fairly normal driving situation and then i might reconsider my thinking.

 

"and it could be put in a press and brought back into shape and used again!"

your kidding right? you would do that? after a heavy accident?
wow.I think id replace it as a matter of dilligence.

The argument that required proof if i recall was a cast axle failing in service

this thread doesnt really help that argument if that was the intention.

 

Think about it,,does not heating and dropping an axle with a press do the same thing?

For more years than I care to remember the alignment shop down the road from me has been heating and strightning axles on wrecked autos and big trucks with no ill effects,,,I've seen some pretty bent stuff bvrought back.

I guess the arguement continues! HRP

 

For all those who are afraid that their axle will break if they hit a pot hole, stay out of any of the imported economy boxes that knock down all those MPGs. Don't look at any of the modern sheet metal control arms that are holding your wheels on. Se how they would crumple up if they took the same ride.

That doesn't prove anything but I still think there is no need to fear that your axle will snap in two if you hit a bad pot hole. Nothing is fail safe. 2 broken axles after what I perceive to be horrific accidents is not enough proof that there is a problem. JMO

 

Looks like a case for CSI.
Metallurgy.
Speed.
Weight.
Angle of the Dangle.
Phase of the Moon.
Was the Axle cast on a Monday vs a Friday.
What sound does Bullshit make when it hits the ground.

All questions to be considered.

 

While it is generally true that forged steel has a higher impact strength than cast , it would be presumptuous to draw any conclusions as to the quality of that axle until after it has been analyzed by a metallurgical engineer/lab. There are many types of cast iron, each with its own physical characteristics depending on its intended use.

 

yeah, I was makin a "Fer Instance" or a hypotonooos, or a ....I was just using an example to make a point. I have no idea how many or what kind were actually made but was trying to get us to look at it from a failure rate point of view...

You callin my rod a tuna boat?


LOL
Cheers and beers
Hodge

 

I have a superbell.. :O

 

I don't care either way cast or forged. If you get into a accident bad enough to worry about it you got bigger problems...Forged metal will snap, rip, break and buckle with enough impact.(WTC)

ANYTHING will break with enough force its just that simple....Lucky


Leave Dave alone, he's just trying to prove what he's been saying for years.

 

The proof I've asked for is a PICTURE of a Ford dropped axle that has broken durring normal driving conditions. This thread does not contain the proof that I have asked for...

While we are at it, lets see a PICTURE of a cast axle that has broken durring normal driving conditions.

So far no such proof exists.

 

while we are on the subject of cast vs forged axles...what does anyone know about this new axle maker called Lucky 7 ? anyone use one? they were at the street rod nationals and had I-beam axles on display. their brochure says they are cast, but are obviously forged.

http://lucky7ent.com/

 

What indicates they are forged? They are ductile iron.

 

I've seen evidence of cast parts breaking, unnamed manufacturer of aircraft parts, if you cut a cast part up you'll usually see all kinds of voids and small holes, it's the nature of air getting into the mold, it happens to even the best castings. in a forging,the forces placed on the part make the metal denser and help avoid this problem. also with the chromed parts,in the last few years, i've heard of parts breaking from hydrogen embrittlement from the plating process. this is more common in springs but can show up in any heavily stressed plated part. this might be a good thread to start on that.

 

You mean he's trying to prove if you run your rod into a semi truick at a high rate of speed...your axle (if cast) will/might break?


The point of thread is useless, unless you're crash dummy and trynig to figure out what parts may or may not be salvagable after some impact collision.

 

What else can you think of that is cast?

Rotors
Brake drums
Crank shafts

 

camshafts