Finally ready to strip the whole car down to bare metal to get ready for body work. But cant seem to get rid of some of the surface rust in areas. I have tried a DA with 80grit, Wire wheel on a grinder, 36 grit on a grinder, nothing really seams to work. Whats out there besides paying some one to sandblast and warp the metal? Here are some pics. Sorry for the size. http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u308/gasoline50/Car stuff/P1030940.jpg http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u308/gasoline50/Car stuff/P1030934.jpg http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u308/gasoline50/Car stuff/P1030933.jpg
Hey, For quick rust removal of surface rust I like a 24 grit disc on a 7'' or 9'' grinder. This is followed with a 36 and than a 50 grit closed coat disc. What rust, that remains in the pits of the metal will have to be "converted" with any of the rust removal/treatment products. A product with phosph- oric will etch the metal and remove what's left. Be sure to ware goggles when using these products, and sand the treated areas well, prior to spraying any primer or using any plastic filler over the treated areas. S****ey Devils C.C. "Meanwhile, back aboard The Tainted Pork"
I did a little write-up on this some time back. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=263091 Rey
53choptop...excellent writeup. i know you mention you were able to paint effectively after use - but others seemed to imply issues. i get that impression that there is no way fully neutralize phosphoric acid after use. is this true? i've had really good luck in some places with just angle grinder and pads...areas where i have good access and whatnot, but i'm going to need something much stronger for the crevices that i can't get into. the phosporic acid looks good, i just want to make sure i can neutralize it and paint. you can see the good and the bad below.
The roof on my 50 Pontiac was really badly rusted, and I tried all sorts of stuff, then hit on the answer. I used Naval Jelly, left it on around an hour, then scrubbed it with Scotchbrite. It took all the rust off, right down to bare metal, though it took a while. BTW, there's a lot of sheet metal on a 50 Pontiac (or Chev or Olds) sedan roof. Good luck
i know i'm really new at this but i'll put in my 2 cents...just because that looks exactly like my project! i am having really good results using a wire wheel on a hefty electric grinder, then going back over it with 80 grit sanding disc, or if i run out of those i've been using a paint stripper disc...naval jelly the pits (if you have any), wash, then bare metal conditioner before primer...been workn pretty good for me.
i sandblasted my dash and it did not warp the metal!! or you can soda blast it that works really good to !! -BEAR!
Be really careful using a wire wheel, as you can easily begin working the metal with it. Of course everything can be worked out with a little filler, but it's better if you don't have to.
After it dries it becomes a powdery residue, it really difficult to remove when it gets into crev***es, just because you cant reach em, in those cases, all you need to do is get the loose residue off. Once the acid dries and turns into "powder" it is neutralized, on the exposed surfaces you can use mild soapy water to neutralize it if its still wet. If you want really clean metal in those corners that you can paint, sandblasting would be your only option, but sometimes getting epoxy into those corners can be a b****, so the ospho kinda offers extra protection, besides these parts are never seen by anyone and as long as you dont have any powder or scaling, you can primer it. What I do when I leave the Ospho on for too long and it turns white and is really stuck on to the metal, and need to get the metal nice shiny and clean, say for example a door, I brush the panel with ospho, wait about 20 minutes, then with mild soapy water start to scrub with the stainless steel pad and the white residue starts to come off and leave shiny metal. By this point the metal has already been treated. Then I hit the metal with a 120 grit sandpaper and epoxy.
sandblasting warps the metal, sodablasting only removes paint and primers,it does not clean up the rust. Plastic media blasting is the only solution i've found to work. It does not warp the steel and it cleans up the rust. Your just spinning your wheels with the wire wheels, hand grinders and neutralizers.
Sandblasting doesn't warp metal, the person doing the sandblasting does... Believe it or not, there are sandblasters out there that care about customer projects and don't warp everything they touch. The trick is finding one. Gasoline50, Call your local sandblasters (if you're even interested in sandblasting your project) and see if any of them will give you a written and signed guarantee they won't warp your project. If they'll agree to that, you'll know they know what they're talking about. I own a sandblasting service and tell people right off the bat if it's a good idea to sandblast something or not. I have given extremely nervous cl***ic car guys written and signed guarantees that I will not warp their project. All I see is smiling faces when they come to pick up their projects. I'm sure I can't be the only sandblaster that is on the "up and up". Call around if that's an avenue you're entertaining. Best of luck with your project and FYI... I wouldn't hesitate to put a signed guarantee on your project. It looks really solid and the curvature would make it very hard to warp. Not only that... there isn't enough rust to hold sand to it long enough to warp.
not to hijack the thread but i've been using por 15 metal treatment and that stuff is kinda pricey and doesn't seem to work very well....i've heard of ospho before...is it basically the same stuff or does it do a better job ?
I can vouch for Chris and his services, 150% satisfied customer. He blasted my 53 Olds hood and he kicked a** on it, this thing is about 4 feet of straight panels on top, it was like the paint just magically disappeared, no signs of even distortion. AA+++
I have never used POR 15 stuff, so it all comes down to the numbers. I looked at the POR 15 site for the MSDS sheet and yes its pretty much the same thing: Ingediants in POR 15 metal treatment: Octylphenoxy Polyethanol Ethanol Triphenol Methane Phosphoric Acid Zinc Phosphate However it does not give percentage as to how much "Phosphoric Acid" is in it Phosphoric Acid = Ospho In my research and what I use, depending on the brand: PH-OSPHO-RIC PLUS+ (85% concentration according to its MSDS) is sold at home depot Ospho (75% concentration according to its MSDS) is sold at Ace Harware, Tru Value According to the instructions you have to dilute the Phosphoric Acid you buy at the home centers with water, POR 15 seem like it is already diluted with other ingredients. More bang for your buck with the home center stuff in my opinion.
Now if you really want to get technical about the issue, this website does a great comparison, it does not cover the 2 brands I mention but some are pretty close: http://ecologicarchitecture.com/SoloHobbit/rust/index.htm
I'll jump in, but.. just so you know why I think I have anything to add...rust forms VERY quickly around here so we have some experience getting rid of it. You can't get any further "East" in North America than Nova Scotia, PEI or Newfoundland and Lab. The salt air is amazingly good at killin' our metal. I have used a bunch of different methods; converters, electrolysis(love it), phosphoric acids, blasting, mol***es(don't laugh, it works), vinegar and "safe" liquids such as Evaporust (like Safest Rust Remove) and CLR. They all have their places with advantages and disadvantage. I like the safe liquids (but can't get Safest Rust Remover locally). I even use them after blasting. They get in cracks that blasting won't. They are biodegradable and work really well. The old tin that I have to work with is too thin to blast normally so I usually sand, flap-wheel or whatever and then setup a "shower" for the part with Evaporust. You can go to www.safestrustremover.com or www.evaporust.com to see how they suggest doing it. I soaked a pair of vise-grips that had been outside for 5 years, in the stuff. They had been sandblasted but were still majorly stuck. After 20 minutes I could turn the adjuster. After another 20 they were completely usable. NO worries about dumping the stuff, no blasting media everywhere, no bad fumes, no gloves needed. Just clean up with a metal wash, prime and paint. I'm getting lazy in my old age. Or is that efficient? Fine line between lazy and efficient. Sorry for being so long winded.
Hey Gizmo Can we get the ospho or other stuff around here?? I got a 47 Ford more door "project year round beater " that I dont wanna have to do a **** load of blasting on, if I can get at most of it chemically, what have you been able to find here in NS?? Steve
Hey Steve... I've never seen "ospho" around my end of the province (Yarmouth) but the Dupont 5717S is available from some auto-parts store like UAP. I've had great results with that stuff. Nasty strong though. I really do like the Evaporust. It works and is very safe. The only source here is Home Hardware and it's a 1 litre container . The company does sell 4l. amounts but our Home Hardware doesn't carry that size. I've also bought some Rust Check rust converter from Nova Welding. Let me know if you find a bigger size of Evaporust. Maybe the new building supplies store in New Minas. That's gonna be a big ****er! Joe
I will look and see what I can find,Joe, I am in Halifax everyday for work so I will do some looking around there, the Home Depot in New Minus is open now, but I havent stopped in,I will next time we are there and let you know what I can find. Steve
Thanks Steve. I drove in the parking lot a few weeks ago before it was open. Quite the sight. On the weekend of the 22 I'll be going near Mulgrave (just about to Cape Breton.. 7 hour drive from here) to get a 49 flathead that's been rebuilt and supposedly the back end of a 30-ish sedan. Normally I'd stop in to Princess Auto to see what new toys that are there but I'll have a trailer in tow with my little "car" (94 Tercel, don't laugh.. 47 mpg) and won't dare to stray to far afield. How's the job? PM me if you have any good stories. So.. gasoline 50.. any progress?
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