turbo?

so im building a model a sport coupe, and i got this old turbo charger for a small block chevy, i got it off an old jeep that someone put a 327 vette motor with the turbo on it. in the jeep, wtf i know. so i got the motor and a 5 speed out of a truck so its a toploader. and a turbo charger and a model a. sbc in a model a is nothing new but a turbo? will the boost kicking in through corners make the light rear end want to get out of controll, will the lighter wieght keep the turbo from building up like on big diesel trucks. Well the thing is old and looks cool so that is ok but the single exaust dumbing on passenger side may look dumb but at least it would sound different. whats your 2 cents?

 

You must not know much about turbos huh?

 

no not a lot

 

Learn from your sig. line......

 

i met accerating through corners tho

 

Best performance gain you can ever make. Just take it easy in the corners and you will be fine, as long as you dont floor it and build a ton of boost , you wont even feel it in the corners. It may not be traditional but what the hell, neither are radials and disc brakes, electric wipers, aluminum radiators, etc etc etc. Do it how you want to do it and have fun. Also its a damned Model A, thats the cool factor, a turbo just adds to the fun factor. You are lucky to have a complete set up. USE IT!!!

 

the set up is from the 60's i belive, im worried it will either get out of controll to easy or the motor may accerate the car to fast for the turbo to spool up

 

bolt it in and try it. taking it off after you crap your pants wouldn't be a big task.

 

If the motor accelerates fast, the turbo will spool fast. Its a vicious cycle .

As for tail out action through corners? You'll just have to learn to drive through it or around it. All good fun too.

 

not so true as if you have to shift before the trubo winds up it wont spool right. its like that on some big trucks ive driven there faster when there loaded cause the turbo spools up more. i dont completey know why tho.

true about the cornering but if its too much and comes on unsuspected through a long sweeping turn, ive heard of this phenominion in porches. but i guess itll be fine

im fucking doing it cause like guy said i can take it off easy enough. and i dont i dont want to put the 392 hemi in this pos, but i gotta be different

 

They used to have Ray Jay turbos on tow trucks in the late 70's for chevs, I'd do it it if I had it.

 

LMAO!!

Ahh, it will be fine. Just do some research on the subject. Go buy the books "Maximum Boost" by Corkey Bell and "Turbochargers" by Hugh McCines (sp?) and do some reading on the turboforums.
Just learn about them first and you will love it.

 

Dont you need to retard the timing somewhat as rpm's increase? I dont know much (if anything) about turbos, but I do know that they take a fair bit of know how, and aren't a simple bolt on and smoke the tires thing. The guys I know around here that fab turbo engines like propane, its cooler and has a higher octane rating, to keep the detonation to a minimum. I dont think the power comes on like a switch either, so going around a corner should be normal, just a bit more powerful...

 

If you don't know anything about boost, I suggest you either veer off into another direction, or get ready to learn something that most people don't understand.

Pick yourself up a copy of Corky Bell's book "Maximum Boost". You should be able to find it at your local book store. There's usually another book on the shelf called "Supercharging, Turbocharging, and Nitrous Oxide" which covers both forms of boost, as well as nitrous injection. And also a book by HP Books just called "Turbochargers".

I suggest you start with Corky's book, cause everything is covered in that one. There's alot of math and calculations when properly sizing your turbo to your motor, and setting your motor up to use that boost efficiently and effectively. Some people understand the basics, and bolt together a junkyard system with great results. Some people end up with catastrophic engine failure and a whole lot of money & time thrown in the trash.

I haven't really dug into this site yet, since I haven't played with many turbochargers in a while, but it might have some information you could use...

www.theturboforums.com

 

I think you are over-thinking this turbo situation. Just put it in, if it sucks, take it out. They really aren't that complicated to set up, especially if you're using a setup from a car that was already running it.

 

LOL!!!!!!

 

Sounds like fun! I'm for checking out the turbo to make sure it's ok, make sure the oil supply for it is set up right, and give it a try. Did you get a carb with it? does the turbo go between the carb and engine? that was the most common setup in the old days.

If things don't work out, you can always just run the 327 without the turbo, or swap in a different small block if you blow it up or something.

And you should be able to get sideways in that car with a vette 327 without the turbo

 

That easy huh?

It will suck when you don't have proper fuel enrichment under boost or collapsed carb floats or mixture leaking out everywhere because you didn't modify the carb properly or put holes in pistons because you don't know how to control ignition advance properly.

Not trying to discourage you kid but the best thing you can do is read up on the subject. The other guys have given you some good book titles to check out.

Turbocharging is plenty traditional, just ask Ak Miller..

And yes, I have a few carbed turbo cars under my belt.

Shawn

 

Go here, http://www.theturboforums.com/turbotech/main.htm , you will find out everything that you need to know.

 

I thought the reason we drove hotrods was so hang the arse end out around corners and have too much power....

Keep the boost to a sane level and you will have lots of fun. I like old school turbos set ups with lots of lag, when it comes on it really is a rush!

I had a Ford Capri with a big old t4 bolted onto it, probably the best low cost fun I have ever had.

Do it, working out the wrinkles is half the fun.

P.

 

Nobody's addressed the big huge variable.

What kind of turbo are we talking? One of the 70s setups, or a late model setup? The difference between wasteful 6psi of boost and efficient 12 psi is HUGE.

What you have to do and what blower engines have to do is not that different. At 6psi No vacuum advance, reduced mechanical advance, slightly rich mixture preferred. But at 12psi time to look into some racy boost retards or run dedicated race fuel and if you miss the mixture/ignition at all it's gonna ventilate the pistons.

The other thing is you should hope it's not a corvette engine. That would have high compression and complicate any form of supercharging on street fuel

But thinking you're going to spin off the road from the turbo.... I gotta wonder if you're holding a learner's permit right now. Seriously. Turbo vehicles are all over the streets, they're just not as played up as they were 20 years ago.

good luck

 

I have a tube chassis proturbo car. I've run draw through setups as well as intercooled blow through setups. The original poster sounds like he's expecting this thing to go into orbit. Kinda along the lines of movie cars with a switch for boost.....just aint happening.
The 70's kits are Rayjay and Rotomaster. They liked to gall the bronze bushings and coke up from poor oiling so the unit likely will need rebuild/replacement. They typically have a single fourbarrel intake that draws the fuel at a sharp angle into the turbo then dumps it back into the intake. 6psi is a decent achievment out of the design. Hell ,alot of them didn't even run wastegates since they never built enough boost.
If serious about turbo charging the motor(even with this kit) plan on a lower compression and a boost retard ignition along with a boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator. You will pop the motor otherwise "if" it builds boost. Will take all the fun out of having something cool when it goes boom after all the work.
With all that said it is definitely "do-able" but it is not as simple as throwing it on and yanking it back off if it doesn't work well. It will take an investment to put it on properly and then another investment to convert the car back to naturally aspirated so you will be into serious coin and you'll need to be sensible.

 

I would use it. Do everything these guys say, have it checked out, well oiled and the carb correctly set up . Read up on turbos! Who knows? Screwing with this project may turn you into a turbo-a-holic.

Seeing an vintage turbo with some sort of cool looking single side exhaust would definitely get some gawkers and great conversations at car shows. Definitly a cool twist on the sometimes too common SBC.

"Getting out of control"...? Isn't that what your supposed to do in a hot rod?

 

For the older turbocharger setups, which is most likely an old accell, gemini, or maybe a Martin, I would get the Hugh McCanns "Turbochargers" book.

Put up some pics and info on this old turbo system. Some are complete garbage and some are really good. The Martin is the best of the old ones.

I have plenty of experience with turbo cars, especially SBC's with singles. Great for waking up a mild motor. I am running a single turbo drawthrough setup on my road race 355sbc in a non hamb friendly car.

 

Well, the Porsche, if its a real one with the engine in the back, has a reputation for getting squirrely in the turns if you are not paying attention mainly because of the imbalance of having a rear engined car. Not because they are turbo powered. But I am sure that does not help out much either!!

If this really concerns you, build a Mid Engine A!

 

I really think your over exaggerating the "kick in" the turbocharger it can be boost limited, depending on how old the set up is, it could have a wastegate, or bypass valve. You can simply just change springs in those to hold less boost levels and as you get more comfortable you can go with a stiffer wastegate spring. If you do not have that, just shift low in the rpm range, I think it would look cool as hell and all that power in a Model A w/ a 5 speed sounds like to much fun to me.

 

Not to be the one to point all all the mistakes I see but..come on.

so i got the motor and a 5 speed out of a truck so its a toploader
Is is not a top loader 4 speed if it is a 5 speed. It is a tremec of some sorts.
boost kicking in through corners
Boost is controlled by a blow off valve. Set on the exit side of the turbo. Usually and with the ERA of the turbo. This will be set very low. 5 to 6 psi.
Blowing off the tires in a corner.....Well proper driving and cornering ...ONE does not jam the throttle UNLESS your at the exiting point of the Apex.
Single exhaust....nature of the beast with a single.
Also just slapping the turbo on the engine is going to yield you a big pile of useless parts IF certain things are not known before hand. Things like what is the compression the engine? Anything over 9 to 1 comp...good luck. If by chance that boost is set in the 9 psi range....you might hear the spark knock then BOOOOMMM!
Key note here. As the turbo psi increases. You are slamming air into a cylinder that was once capable of the carb air induction. If you increase one parameter of the equation...air...fuel and spark......you must modify all the parameters. Timing must retard and fuel must increase and all must be in relation to the amount of boost.

 

Just so he is looking for the correct book, it is Hugh MacInnes. I have both sitting on the shelf next to me.

http://www.amazon.com/Turbochargers...bs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1224173970&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.com/Maximum-Boost...bs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1224174009&sr=1-1

I found Bell's book much more informative for me because I was starting from scratch, Hugh's book was decent if not more outdated and a bit harder to follow. I just felt like it didn't have the raw data needed to properly engineer the system.

Here is a post on www.theturboforums.com that sounds like it would match yours: http://www.theturboforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117467.0

 

Just to kill som misnomers about turbochargers. Turbos love a heavily loaded engine. Let me say that again for emphasis: Turbos love a heavily loaded engine, the more load you can put on it, ie: numerically lower gears, taller tires, lower stall speeds on converters and so forth. I wouldn't worry about blowing the tires off in the corners so much, not much chance you can put down enough traction and cornering power in a hot rod to even worry about it.

 

My bad on the spelling of the name...the books at home and I am at work.

The Hugh MacInnes book has a lot of data on those old turbocharger systems Maximum Boost doesn't have. Maximum boost is a better book for building a turbocharger setup from scratch however.

Some of those old turbocharger setups work very well, but they all are limited in flow compared to modern setups. You will never find a stock old system that will go over about 450hp on a single turbo. They used the old Rotomasters with V1 wheels, or RayJay EE series turbos in general. These have flow maps that crap out around 450hp and usually a 1.0 or so A/R. You can usually update the compressors to a 60-1 wheel and be good for about 600hp in flow however.