Nice build keep us posted want to see pics of it with the engine and the wheels and tires your going to use.
More important - Gasser at 100mph on a smooth track where bumps etc are pretty much non existent. Jeeps of course are driven at 80mph+ on crappy freeways everyday, especially out here in Cali. Also bump steer is really critical on trail as it can rip the steering wheel right out of your hand or throw you right off the trail.
i agree jeep should have put them on the rear ..faster you go you will need to tip that axle back had a local guy with a henry j get tossed in to the ditch because it was not set up right ...
Shackle in the front will add caster when the spring is flexed Shackle in rear with subtract chaster Subtract caster and you get wobble, like driving a bike with the forks straight up and down, don't work. Or another example, a shopping cart with the wobbling wheels. Shackles gotta go in the front in my mind.
I guess that's why there are menu's in restaurants. Although this has the potential to turn into the same line of discussion that the "right amount of caster for a straight axle" turned into a few years ago. I agree that what works in a Jeep should work in a car, as they are basically the same front suspension. And as far as it works either way, sure it does. Production cars/trucks should be a basis for inspiration for what does and doesn't work for all of us. After all, Jeep wasn't, isn't and never will be interested in producing something that's going to get them sued. That said, I'm not in agreement about caster being affected enough to have any input on how the cars steers from the shackles being in front or in the back. The amount of travel in the axle lengthwise on the spring, as well as vertically, WILL change the caster. But it would be fractions of one degree. If you're only running 3 degrees, sure, you're going to feel it. Or if your shackles are six inches long. But not with the average 2 1/2" or 3" shackle (like the ones provided in the Speedway kit). But anyone building a straight axle anything knows you don't run less than the argued 6+ degrees. 10 degrees is normal for most dragsters that will see 100+ miles an hour with a straight axle. Strut, leaf, coil over, whatever, 10 degrees.
Not to change the subject, but MAN I wish I was closer and able to take the classes your given'. I hope you keep the rest of us updated with pictures!
My coons shackles are in the rear, my buddies 57 chev are in the front. Both cars drive and handle very well. Its all in how you want to set it up.
Thanks man. I just posted photo's of the car. I butchered the floors out of it the other day. It's getting a monoleaf and hairpins. Similar to the Two Lane Blacktop car, except it had coil over shocks in the front and a panhard bar.
Well actually you arew wrong. period. The thing that put the CJ on the endangered species list is the shackle in the front. You just keep building and posting it, it won't be right with the shackle in the front never has been and never will be. The ultimate worst thing about it is that it isn't your ride. Its bad enough to do it ass backwards when its your ride but how could you do that to a friend or a customer?
Actually porkandbeaner, your speaking of the CJ5 which was was killed. It had nothing to do with the shackles, but instead was a wheelbase problem. People turning to sharp would flip the things. The CJ7 was the same Jeep with a longer wheelbase, better... But if you read hotroddon said, YJ, this Jeep has much wider axles and stronger sway bars. I can do things in our YJ that would have killed you in a 5, and turned your hair white in a 7. All 3 Jeeps run front shackle set-ups, as do every Chevy I've seen. Not that I've seen all of them. But argueing the point is mute, no one will change anyone's mind. Right or Wrong.
Heard that from a couple of sources, we use axles from '49-'54 Chevy trucks on tri-fives, just about the exact width also. Mounted with stock re-arched springs on 2x4 frame rails the caster is very close to where it should be 6-10 degrees. Our cars handle great, drove them almost 900 miles last year round trip to the Pile-up with no problems.
I'm confused as to why Speedway would say their gasser axle kit would be too light for a full size car. If you use the axle with GM ends, you're using spindles, kingpins, bearing and brakes from a 49-54. Which is a full size car. The front springs in the kit are each about equal to the monoleaf they put in their suicide kit. That'll hold up a big block and hot rod just fine. And the kit it that times two. The axle itself is 2 1/4" tube with a 1/4" wall.
Well, actually we aren't wrong on this one, period! And the shackles had NOTHING to do with the demise of the CJ, repeat NOTHING. As others have stated Jeep is not the only OE who did shackles this way. It is also fairly common for off roaders to move them to the front as lifted straight axle 4 wheelers have the shackle hanging too low and moving them to the front gives more ground clearance. In the early 90's I worked as National Sales Manager for the worlds largest Jeep aftermarket company and have first hand knowledge and have ridden in and driven many set up this way, and they drive fine when set up properly. I've even seen leaf spring Monster Trucks done this way The many millions of miles driven in these vehicles by their owners prove that it is right and always will be. It may not be the only way, and both have their plus' and minus' but that doesn't make either one "Wrong"
I'm confused too. The kit is advertised for full size cars. When I bought mine, I called and asked as specifically about the length of the axle and Speedway's response was that the length was fine and that there were thousands of '55-'57 Chevys out there with their kit. So I got one for my '57. I do think the axle might be too short. It's the 46" axle, which is all they had a year ago when I bought it. It would probably be OK if you did a 2x3 or 2x4 tubing front end, but with the stock chassis like I have, there's a chance it's going to be too narrow. Once there's an engine in the car and it drops some, I think I might have a problem with tire clearance when turning and I'm going to have to end up getting one of their wider axles. As for the shackles, I asked Speedway whether I should mount them in the front or the back and they were very clear that they should go in the front. Right or wrong, that's what I was told to do.
I'll be redoing my Caster angle from 6 degrees to 10 degrees tomorrow as mine is only tacked in place. What is the maximum angle that is allowed? BTW, My shackles are in front, and staying there.
Just went back and looked at my April 67 Hot Rod magazine, the article about Blair's speed shop. They have the shackles in the front...but then what do they know...
LOL, I'm a 4 wheeler also. I see all these same arguments on the 4x4 sites, but in reverse! ie, "you can't move your'e Jeep shackles to the rear, if it was safe, Jeep would have done it that way." As has been stated, I'm convinced either will work, but the key is to setting it up right.
Blair's speed shop article, "Tube Axles Foe Chevys" Hot Rod Magazine April 67 Sorry its so hard to read, couldn't make it any bigger.
Wow look at that - Hot Rod Magazine Blair's article with the shackles in front. Blair's did more straight axle conversion than anyone back in the 60's and even 70's. Kind of validates what I've said all along doesn't it?
So tell me, how streetable is a stright axle car? I would be interested to see how well one would ride on a 500 mile trip for example. I have thought about going with a straight axle for a while now on one of my cars, but also would like to travel long distances with descent drivability. Would cruising at highway speeds for long periods at a time be a challenge?
Very streetable. as seen by my Econoline Pick up and countless early ford trucks, Only difference is that a car may be lighter. And yes, you have a "buggy ride" feel, front to rear. That just reminds you that you are not in an IFS car. Dave By the way,,,,,, My 65 Econoline Pu had the shackle in rear, (oh shit, I said it!!!!!)
Don't put the front end stupid high and they drive fine. No different than all those early Ford pickups etc.
Shackles in the REAR on mine. The resident expert from the show Pass Time didn't think my car would handle either........
SP55 I must say, i really enjoyed your youtube vids. The way you wholeshotted that funny car was beautiful! Cheers and beers Hodge
could anybody show some close ups of mounting the stock column to the new ft clip. and what other steering combos you guys have used? thinking about project with the kid, thanks rich
The Jalopy Journal
