OK.. I'm not sure if I'm good enough at explaining to be able to paint you a picture as to what I'm trying to do... so anyway here goes. I'm working on a Studebaker pickup (but I think for my question it could be any kind)... what I want to do is eliminate the wing windows. In their place I want to fill that in with sheet metal, and then mount my side mount rear view mirrors in that spot. I'd love for anyone to be able to help me learn how to do that or point me to a thread, tech acticle, etc that can help me out. I'd like to be able to see pics so I know how far out the sheet metal sits (in reference to the outermost sheet metal).... how thick the replacement piece needs to be, pics of how it might be installed, and how it looks when completed... You know.. kinda the whole process from start to finish if possible. All help will be appreciated.
Doesn't sound to me like a good idea either but tell us the year of pickup so we can visualize this change. I bet if you post a picture of it you'd even find someone here to photoshop it.
I wouldn't do it, that wouldn't look good, you'd be better off to replace the wing and gl*** with one solid piece of gl***, You'd still be able to see around it and it would look good. Here's an example...
I'm with Chaddilac on this.I've got one piece side windows on my '54 Effie.Look clean,improve visibility from the peep mirrors; Good luck whatever you decide. Paul
I ***ume you mean to do only a very small area of the winged section... just enough to mount a vintage mirror? FWIW: I've actually seen that done to an early 50s Stude pup to fit a modern mirror... and I don't think it worked well. What I saw was visually jarring and ended up looking like a "patch". The stock window opening is such a good shape already. One of the cool things about those trucks was that there was no pillar between the wing and the roll up gl***, very modern for 1949 (introduction date) on a truck.
Actually I'm not sure WHAT was the introduction date of a Studebaker pickup right off hand... 1949 is correct for a R series... What I have is an "M" series. 1946 model. I know those started in 1941 In any event some of you asked about the year of mine so there is the answer to that... Someone touched on replacing the deal with a modern mirror... thats more along the lines of what I had in mind. I am making a street rod out of this vehicle, and I plan on putting on a mirror like on more modern vehicles. One that has the triangle type mounting 'base' so it would kinda fit onto the area I am filling up. I want a mirror that has the turn signal built into the outside edge that people see flash when approaching. One that you paint that matches the vehicles color. Lets see what else was brough up... oh the area (size) of the wing window. Yeah I doubt I close up the entire size of the wing window. Now I may get close, I have chopped the top 1" in the back and and in the front by about 2 1/2",.. so that closed down the size of that little window quite a bit. OH.. One last thing.. It's just about impossible to put a one piece window in this old studebaker. If anyone is familiar with these type old trucks you will know they are not 'straight' down the sides down the doors. They have a straight section when the original window gl*** was, but where the wing window was it makes a curve. The door skin itself shows an overall curved shape. If you put a straight line on the inside of the door skin from side to side there is about a 1/2 in gap in the center. SO to put a piece of gl*** in all the way that is straight, the inside panel would have to be cut and pulled in and made straight... then the outside piece would have to have a filler made where the window channel was so it had a parrellel opening to put the window seal in where the window open and close in. Even if we do that... The bottom of the window is going to be kicked in, and I'm not sure the angle of the window will go to the proper location at the top and fit correctly there when closed. Either way I can fix it will look fine. I'd like to see how-to or tips on both if you all have them somewhere
Not trying to be an ***, but this board is interested in "traditional" style hot rods. Not modern, painted-out, swoopy, turn signalled stuff. I doubt you'll see anyone admit they did their mirrors like that on here. If they do, they get laughed at. The problems you list in making your gl*** one-piece sound very surmountable. It's just cut-n-weld. And I think it would be a result you won't look back on in two years and be sorry for.
It'll look like **** as alchemy has pointed out, swoopy modern mirrors don't belong on anything other than they came on.
Well I FIRST thought that also... we considered that before we chopped the top... SO we went ahead and chopped it. We run into the problem when we started to work on the doors and the gl***... The problem is the door isn't 'straight'. If it was straight it WOULD simply be cut and weld. If we eliminate the wing window (which we already have... so we are already committed there) then we try to make the door straight so the gl*** can be straight... we have to pull the interior piece of sheet metal in at least 1/2 an inch (Now I'm not talking about inside at the bottom where it mounts. I'm talking about where the opening for the gl*** channel is that runs from front to back horizonally. Thats do-able. Then I'll have to weld a piece of sheet metal onto what is left and close up the original opening and (in effect) close that gap and move it closer in, and make sure it is the same size it originally was. Basically I have to take the curved opening that is there now,.. and make it a straight opening by pulling everything in toward the interior. I can do all that. Thats no problem. HERE is where the problem comes on. We have had several people that hav worked on old cars and street rods before, and no one we have spoke to has been able to show us a way to get the gl*** to line up if we run a one piece gl*** the full length of the window opening. What happens is by the time we pull the gl*** in toward the interior so it will be a straight line,.. then it is in so far that it does not go up straight. It has to go up at an angle.... front the inside pointing outside., then it will NOT match up with where it HAS to be so it matches up with the top of the truck. SO that the problem we have with the one piece gl***. We can handle the bottom and getting it in the door,.. but it won't fit at the top. There is no way to make it fit at the top because the top is rounded also and the gl*** would stick out further than the sheet metal... so needless to say it's impossible. Thats why we were considering closing off the wing windows. It would shorten the length we had to go,.. and also mean we had a lot less angle we had overcome. One last option we might consider would be to REPLACE the wing windows... problem there is WITH WHAT. The original ones are gone,.. and even if I were able to get original replacement wind windows, they would be 2 1/2" too long, since we chopped the top that amount. SO they wouldn't fit anyway. Not sure how I'd even use them if I had them..?? Don't have any to experiment with for starters,.. and As I said they'd be too long, and with the top now sitting at with a rake, it wouldn't stand straight up either... Thanks for the opinions... that why I come to you guys and ask.. You guys have always helped before if you had any knowledge on the subject, and always jumped in with what you knew and your ideas... It's always appreciated.
Most of the people who chop their roofs on this site cut the wing windows down as well. IMHO it makes for a much nicer looking side profile and a finishes the chop.
well we considered all those options when we thought about chopping the top. Believe me we put a lot of thought into this before we cut anything... We measured and cut and discussed for two days... LOL When we got done we wasn't gonna have much of a wing window left,.. so thats why we decided to just do away with it all together, and have a one piece window... I guess it shows no matter how much planning you do... it's easy to miss something. This one item is a h***le. We have been wanting to work on these doors for a year,.. but keep putting it off because of this problem. Winter is coming and we'll need something to do.
gee.. post to this thread dried up in a hurry... Come on... surely some of you folks here smarter than we are... lol
However you go about the task......... Welding in a peice of sheet metal the entire area that a vent window used to reside, will look like your taping cardboard over a broken out window (Think total **** here), no metter what you put over it afterwards or how pretty you try to paint it. I did find a partial filler peice with a larger window and it looks ok, but you can tell what they did. If your vent windows are in good condition, you should leave them in. I looked on the carnut site and these are the picts of the make and model close to that you speak of. http://www.carnut.com/cgi-bin/07/image.pl?/photo/contrib/hourie/pic1170.jpg http://www.carnut.com/cgi-bin/07/image.pl?/photo/contrib/hourie/pic1171.jpg http://www.carnut.com/cgi-bin/image.pl?/show/01/pbo/nat426.jpg http://www.carnut.com/cgi-bin/05/image.pl?/show/05/spf/nat2455.jpg
Vent windows are gone...They were in pretty bad shape to start with... finding replacements for an M series would be almost impossible. At least in good enough shape to use. I bought two trucks and none of them were fit to use. If I found some.. with the top being chopped 2-1/2 inches the fit wound be off... so I'd have to cut them all apart to get them to fit and look right (make the rear bar be straight up and down) since the top has a rake to it.. Thanks for the links.. I'll go check them out. I'm still listening if anyone has any suggestions. I'm not being negative. I'm just throwing out the PROBLEMS we are facing,.. and why the doors have been sitting on the floor for the last year. We can't figure out how to fix them and do it and make the look right
Use Plexi-gl*** to experiment with. You need an actual panel to slide up and down in the door to see where things need to be. Once you have the correct shapes, any gl*** shop can use them as templates to cut new gl***. .
I have to cut my vent window frames apart and reshape them too. Its part of finishing a chop. Not trying to sound like a ****, but it sounds like there is more work in trying to put 1 piece gl*** in it, and a 4" thick 'A' pillar would look pretty redonkulous. A few extra hours of searching for parts and making them work will pay off tenfold in the end.
Yeah.. I got a gl*** shop guy all lined up to cut my gl*** for the entire turck. In fact he's been over to check out my problem with the windows. He's stumped too. Of course you can't bend gl***... so we either have to pull it in and make it a straight one piece unit... but then we have the problem of it not fitting at the top. SO that looks like it probably won't work Whole problem with that is it just won't go straight up and down. It has an angle to the outside. Then that seems to leave us either putting in the pieve and mounting the mirror,.. or trying to find wing windows. (which may or may not exist)... And as I said above, even if I find them first thing I have to do is chop them up and put them in so the inner most bar is verticle and gose straight up and down. It can't lean or it'll look wrong... also the gl*** won't work unless it is straight up and down. After we cut the wing window all apart... not sure it can be put back together again correctly. Not sure without having one to look at to be honest. Obviously the points it 'rotates' on will be incorrect since it will have to stand at a different angle than it is originally made for... It's a stumper I tell ya.
I agree with ya... Can you tell me how you did yours... then I'll know what I'm doing and how to go about it. Seems few people here have a clue so far. At least if I know HOW to do it... maybe if I can run across some parts I'll know what to do with them... Finding parts is gonna be a tall order... but I'm not opposed to searching. These things are so rare I may have to buy a WHOLE TRUCK just to get them...
I'll be taking the gl*** outta mine, shortening them what is necessary and welding them back together. If the angles and curves dont match, I'll be cutting from the open side of the channel in, towards the closed side, but not all the way thru, and welding them back together. Grind, and refinish. Sounds easy....... Time will tell. not sure if its the correct way to do it, but I'm sure there was a tech on it here recently...
hey.. as many chopped tops as there are.. I've never saw a tech on it..?? Maybe there is somewhere,.. But I've never run across one. Thats why I was looking for some ***istance here. Thanks for the answer.. I'm hoping someone else who has done this before might jump in and maybe have some pics, or a tech article. Could help us both, or others.
I'm in the same boat but I'm gonna shorten mine and go with it. Wish there was a tech but I'll muddle my way through and try to take pics etc. I agree it will "finish" the chop. I vote find something workable and go! $ .02
If you can't, or don't want to, rework some stock wing windows how about some fake ones? Make some small gl*** panels that will be stationary where the wing windows are supposed to be. The back edge seal could be the stuff that came on the front edge of 60's hardtop cars. A thin stainless with one-sided rubber for the rollup window to seal against. It's gotta look better than a painted piece of sheetmetal.
Thats not a bad idea either.. I'd have to check into exactly what you are talking about... I'm not familiar with that per se'. Long as it installs, and can be taken out in case it gets broken,.. that would work also. God knows I live in GA, and we use the A/C down here most of the time.
The Jalopy Journal
