Hey, After the block has been sonic checked for cracks, have it chemically dipped. Remove all non-ferrous parts before, however! Swankey Devils C.C. "Meanwhile, back aboard The Tainted Pork"
Due to the EPA Chem Strip shops are getting fewer and farther between but I'd check to see if there was one within reasonable driving distance of where you are at.
Most big city's have places you can take your block & heads and have them tumbled in beads, also cleans the inside water jackets. Sorry I can't be more specific..........................
Probably the best current way is to find a shop with a thermal cleaning system...basically a three part process that 1) bakes the block in a gas-fired oven; 2) the block is then abraded with steel shot; 3) then it is washed & rinsed in a conventional solvent tank. You can take a block that looks beyond salvage from corrosion & get it looking nearly new inside & out. Keeping in mind, that is, that if the block actually has fatal all-the-way-through corrosion, no cleaning process is gonna fix it. Or, you could try the molasses technique- there's a couple of threads about it. Dunno if anyone here has tried to do a block yet.
At home process - use a piece of rebar, grind the end to a point and scrape away. Also. get a piece of cable, like that for a bicycle or motorcycle lock, cut off a length, chuck it up in a drill and clean away. Flush as you go with water.
Here's a question more than an answer.. What about flushing it out with that "Safest Rust Remover" or "Evaporust" (that's what I can get around my part of the world)? That stuff does amazing things for my projects.
thats the kind of thing i`m looking for , bottom end didn`t need a rebuild , but when I replaced all the freeze plugs , I could see the scale on the cylinders , also heard CLR and muriatic acid , but i`d like to hear from someone who`s done it to be sure.
Safest Rust Remover works awesome....I had a hudson 212 flat head 6 that had 1/4 inch of scale in the jacket and almost no drain down from the head. I looped the water pump back to itself and filled the block with the magic juice. then ran the engin until it got to operating temp then let it sit, repeated 3 times over the next 24 hours and drained. the stuff that came out was black and the water jacket looked incredible, factory fresh
Lowfat, is the engine still assembled? I've been wondering how the mollassas trick would work inside an engine block for some time. I'm sure it would make the freeze out plugs leak, maybe the water pump too. It shouldn't hurt the radiator. Anyone ever try it?
At the Ford Dynamometer Labs they used to use a caustic product to clean out the entire dyno cooling systems, using the engine on the stand to circulate the stuff. It was called Alconox - looked a lot like Spic-n-Span. Made the entire cooling system squeeky clean. Do a search - the company still exists.
Any acid type product will eat the rust. Phosphoric acid is best, but swimming pool acid (muriatic) will work. Cut to about 25-33% will work. It may take a couple cycles. Be careful with any acid, always add acid to water. Neutralize with baking soda. Flush with a couple cycles of clean water.
I want to flush my flathead 6 while it is sitting in the car with the head off. I don't want to remove the engine or take it apart. From this and some of the other threads, it seems that I have at least three options: 1) Fill the water jackets with a molasses solution from the top, and let it sit. Protect the cylinders and valves with a nice layer of grease and some rags. Drain from the bottom and flush well. 2) Same, except oxalic acid. Flush with bicarb. 3) Same, using washing soda and electrolysis. Fabricate thin rod electrodes that slip down into the water passages from the top, through the head stud holes. I can insulate the electrodes where they go into the block with plastic tubes. Flush with bicarb. Which approach do you think would be best, or should I consider something else? I noticed that there was a lot of scale in the lower sections of the water jackets and I would like to get it all out.
I've done a lot of electrolysis on many different things but not engines, so I'm not familiar with results. It's a real pain to setup on anything complicated because the effect is "line of sight". However, it works well and I'm very happy with it. Molasses is good but SLOW and major stinky after it gets fermenting. Acids are dangerous. Simple as that. They work though. Neutralizing them properly is the trick. Flush well. If I did that for my engine I sure would be changing out the coolant after a few hours to be sure the system was clean. I've seen panels rot out quickly after being flushed "enough" according to someone who didn't quite understand. Can't seem to find oxalic acid around here. I'd love to try it for some things. I just picked up a '49 flatty (drove 7 hours each way! I keep telling people it's hard to find this stuff around here). I'll use the Evaporust to clean it out. It's been amazing for my uses.
I get the Evapo-rust at two Canadian chains.. Home Hardware and Canadian tire. But they are in the states. Their site shows AL, CT, IL, IN, MI, MO, NJ, OH, PA, TX Their site is at http://www.evaporust.com/index.html Their distributor page is http://www.evaporust.com/distributor.html These products are more than one-use but they do wear out after use.
No probs. I just hope it works as well for others as it does for me. The old tin we find around here usually isn't thick enough for blasting so we need to find other, less "rough" methods. I took a bottle of the stuff over to fellow HAMBer "Dammit"s place one evening. We put a pair of vise-grips in it for 20 minutes. He told me that they had been holding a fender on a guys cars for 5 or 6 years (in our climate.. major salt on the roads in winter! yuck). Dammit had blasted them but they still were frozen. After 20 minutes of soak I took them out and turned the adjuster! After 20 more minutes they were functional. We were impressed. I have used CLR too and been quite happy with the results.
To PLYM49.& anybody else interested. I have dissolved thick lime and rust deposits with vinegar. Takes awhile but it does work.
It looks like the above thread has listed many different ways of removing the rust and scale from the inner surfaces of the block. One question remains: what about the buildup of rust/scale particles that are clogging things up? This is stuff that just needs to go away. It would be nice if it could simply be dissolved. Do any of the above techniques eliminate this loose rust and scale and sediment by dissolving it? If so, which ones? It's this buildup of loose stuff that I really want to remove.
If you could run a pump to keep a flow of any of the liquids (Evapo-rust, vinegar or any of the stringer acids) you would flush out the rust flakes and break down the chunks. As for dissolving the rust.. yes, they do so you would need to do a rinse after to get rid of any sediment. Keep in mind that acids will eat good metal. Evapo-rust and Safest Rust Remover type liquids do not attack good metal, aluminum, plastics, etc... only iron oxide (rust). The liquid turns black when it gets worn out after absorbing the rusty metal. And again folks.. I do NOT sell the stuff. I just think it's great stuff. I'm basically lazy and it helps me get parts clean without spending hours blasting and cleaning up after. There is a fine line between lazy and efficient. I walk that line all the time.
I used Rustaid on the coolant passages of my aluminum Hudson head and it ended up looking like a fresh casting inside. Pretty amazing. Find it at most home improvement or hardware stores and here: www.rustaid.com Bout $8 a gallon locally.
Guys my old flathead block was RUSTY. After hot tanking the bare block to remove all grease and oil etc, I dunked the block in a barrel filled with a 4:1 mix of water to molasses, and let it sit for a month. Took it out, hosed it clean and man the water jackets looked like had just been cast. Silver. Fresh. New. After u funish with the molasses, you can dump it into your garden as it is totally ennviro friendly and is actually great for you plants as it is now simply an organic mix of sugar and ferrous oxide. Good stuff although it can be whiffy, so keep it away from your back door. Imo its the cheapest, easist and safest way to de rust parts. Rat
My engine is in the car with the head off. I don't want to break it down all the way, or remove it. Also, the worst of the flakes of scale (or whatever they are properly called) have built up in the lowest sections of the water jacket on the drivers side. They are piled up higher towards the firewall (inline 6). That is where the stock cooling system would have the weakest flow, so it makes sense that that is where the worst of it is. When I pulled the head, I opened the drain stopcock on the block - near number 3 cylinder. Nothing came out! I blew in with an air chuck, and then it started flowing. So, there is crud just laying down there. None of this is 'good' metal. I want it all to go away, and without removing the engine from the car, the only way I can drain things is to use that draincock, or maybe use suction on a lance to suck it up through the head bolt holes (which are open to the water jacket). I need something strong enough to dissolve this stuff so I can flush it out thru the drain. That's why I want something strong that will just eat away the offending debris. I am not worried about eating away good metal as the castings are plenty thick, and I expect that the flakes/sediment will react more vigorously to the acid/whatever than the native castings. Also, it is less feasible for me to set up a recirculating pump, because the head is off. I don't want to button things up until I get it good and clean, even if that means laboriously vacuuming the crap out of the water jackets with skinny lances. It is sounding like oxalic or muriatic acids might be best. They should work fairly quickly (I anticipate leaving the acid in for hours at most), and I have plenty of sodium bicarbonate on hand to neutralize afterwards. Thoughts?
Personally,I steer clear of muratic acid. I buy it by the pallet for use in a commercial swimming pool but won't have that stuff anywhere near my garage.Just the fumes off of opening up a jug will flash rust anything it comes in contact with.I've had good luck with the oxalic(Rustaid) though and will use it again.
I agree with Ramblur. Muriatic=bad in my books. Too strong. Heard of people flash rusting everything in the shop after a few minutes of exposure. Sure can't be good for the lungs.. and who uses proper air supplies? If you could pour the mixture of oxalic acid and water in and let it drain through the petcock you might get the job done. You may have to "pull" it out the petcock until the passages open up. Not gonna be easy or quick if you aren't going to break it down further. Here's an idea (ignore me if I'm out in left field)... Could you not reassemble the engine and flush it? I mean.. you don't need new proper gaskets. You only need it tight, not ready for the heat and compression of a running engine. Make some gaskets out of regular materials, bolt it up and run a pump until it's clean. Just a thought. Hope it's a good one.
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