Epoxy = waterproof = no rust! Get it? I've been painting some big ticket items for over 20 years (not hot rods - but way more expensive!) I will NEVER use any polyester based filler - no matter who makes it. And there are companies out there that make epoxy filler compounds that applies just like the B word, and sands out just even easier.
There is a product named WES Systems. My friends use it a lot. I believe it's used in the avitiation industry. They claim it's the best thing on rusted out panels. Super strong with powder added.
That's West Systems Epoxy made by the Gougeon Brothers. It's primarily marine related product because it's 100% waterproof. Now l don't propose that it will fix rust -it won't. But after you've spent all that time and effort doing a real metal repair, why would you coat it with polyester fillers that absorb water and allow water to pass through it???? Talk to anyone that owns and old fiberglass boat about blisters. It's caused by polyester's inability to prevent water migration through the glass. You want that on your perfectly reworked metal patch??? http://www.westsystem.com/ss/
That's why you put paint over top of it. Also most cars I know don't spend the majority of their life sitting in water like a boat.
How much moisture is in air anyway? And that's the least of it. Did you know that polyester shrinks? Forever? Did you know that the elongation properties of polyester is less that 2% and epoxy is about 5%. That's going to make a difference if there is any flexing in the bodywork.
A lot less than a lake. Again that is why you seal the product off from air. Just like you cover bare metal with paint so it doesn't rust same theory applies. I am well aware of the proporties of polyesters and if used properly they work very well for what they are intended for.
Stick to building boats. Apparently all the paint jobs of the last 20 years are goin to come apart any day now. Like the Apocalypse of paint jobs. All at once. We've all been doing it wrong. Thank you for teaching us all a lesson.
58fridge100 has the perfect answer for this if you can't weld in new pieces. and his coment on the 36 grit is dead on, when using glass 36 grit is the perfect grit, in boat repairs if you prep it with anything else your asking for issues
Then that shoots down your epoxy theory as well. You can scratch through an epoxy to the metal surface just as you can scratch through paint to get at filler.
Wow,,, would you do all of that metal working on a 60 Dodge Seneca? I don't think that anyone is debating your abilities, they are obviously superior, the question is whether this caliber work is required on the op's car when his standards don't seem to be on the same level as your skills... Perhaps we should not do anything to our cars unless we can do the absolute BEST... We could all learn to be the greatest engine builders, the greatest chassis builders, and the greatest upholsters as well as becoming the greatest metal workers ever! Hell, if it is beyond us to be the very best at what we might do with our cars we should save our cash and hire the best.... Sorry, it is too damn bad that I will NEVER have the skill to do metal work as well as a whole lot of people on here, I will just have to plod along in my meritocracy and get things done as I learn to be better by experience. Does this sound like sour grapes? Might seem that way, but even if I am envious, in any case, I can take solace in the fact that it is very doubtful that I will ever become so good a metal worker that I will be a dick about it....
jesus christ this thread is still going on.. if you want to fix it. do it right, most people spend more time taking and thinking of short cuts then it actually takes to just do it right, cut it out and replace. if you cant do that now then fucking drive the wheels off it rusty, till you can. period.
Take my original advise and do your self and your Senaca a favor.Save up and buy a cheap flux core, and cut out the bad spots ,and weld in new steel .I know where your coming from on the work fitting the car thing ,but if you only want to do it once cut the rust out and butt weld in a new piece.Grind it smooth and put a skim coat of filler on it.Makes sure you seal the back of the repair from moisture (i use paint and then undercoating),done.Despite what a few think you dont have to metal finish your car,and just cuz you dont doesnt mean your "half assed" or dont have the ability to do so.Some of us drive are cars as we work on them and dont have but a day or so to work on them at a time.I figure your Senaca is no different.I look at it this way ,while some people are spending a month to metal finish a fender ,two months on a door,etc ,im out driving mine and enjoying it.After all, the factory used lead on the weld seems back in the day .My repair wont rerust either .Nothing wrong with filler over solid metal as long as its thin and used properly ...
What is this- like day #3 on this thread? Everyone is still talking about how awesome they are, and how no one else knows what they're doing.............instead of just answering the O/P's question for him. LOL BTW- Nice work, jhnarial- way to make me eat my words!
what the hell? this guys problem could have been answered in the first 5 reply's, and it turned into a pissing contest. do it right by butt welding a patch, temporary by skim coat of glass, or leave it. what the fucks the problem here? the car should be done and rolling down the road by now!
Some people eat steak some eat balogna. you can survive on either.It all comes down to $. anyway 90% of people that see you at the gas pump wouldnt know the difference between a metal finished panel and a quarter panel made out of chicken wire and covered with F/glass.(i am not recomending the chicken wire tecnique) Do what you can aford.
this entire thread is starting to remind me of the green cloud i walked into this morning in the bathroom at the plant.
well im glad that this thread started such a heated debate. i guess for now its just gonna be rusty until i find somewhere to use a welder.
The Jalopy Journal
