FIRE in the Garage SERIOUS/FATAL INJURY

FIRE in the Garage SERIOUS INJURY
We sometimes get distracted by the goal and bad things can happen.
I received the following email this weekend.
Not Good.

From: xxxxxxxx
To: xxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 11:49 AM
Subject: xxxxxxxx
xxxxxx, Just wanted to let you know on the 31 of March,xxxxxx was working in his garage and was set on fire. He is in xxxxxxsssssBurn unit. He has 30 percent 3rd degree burns on his upper right side, and back. His face and his neck. They told us he has a 5 to 10 percent chance of recovery. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxso pray with us and xxxxxx will get well.
Today he is going for his first skin graft. His face, neck and his right arm which is very damaged. He is to bxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx hour surgery.
more later. (signed), xxxxxxx



I'm guessing few of have had a fire in the garage. I had a fire with about a pint of gas in an improvised setup to test run a motor, it caught on fire and that minimal amount of gas made a hell of a bonfire for a few minutes! Afterwards, there certainly wasn't any need to try to use the wiring, heater or radiator hoses!

I’m lucky I didn’t burn the house/garage down, and have resolved to do such things outside away from the house. That said, nothing can reverse the pain and suffering that my friend will endure if he comes out of this alive, which is questionable at the moment.

I offer an example of something I did years ago, because of all the work I do on Model A's. As a nit-picker I am of the opinion that a dry run, a rehersal, is a good way to plan for such an event.

I have in my mind a checklist of what I will do on a carburetor fire. On a Model A carburetor fire (I've experienced a few),the FIRST THING I DO IS GO INSIDE THE CAR AND SHUT OFF THE GAS VALVE, then proceed to smother the fire with a heavy blanket.

On Hot Rod Nash I have a gas shutoff valve, actuated with a choke cable that is accessed out back by the tail light. Any fire, even with the motor running will be starved in a couple of minutes after I pull that handle.

Yes, I know, prevention first, but things still happen, so does anybody else have anything to offer along those lines that would contribute to the mix? Just common sense ways to be prepared, and to react appropriately when a fire starts to assure (a thought out) reaction instead of panic?

Specific postntial events with appropriate preplanned reactions that one could 'reherse' as a preliminary to starting the job?

 

I am a professional firefighter and this thread definately caught my eye.
One of the biggest things I can suggest is watch where your grindings are going. Under benches, rag bins, oily parts etc etc....some of these can smolder for hours and hours before finally reaching flame up.

Another often missed one is the oily rags in the waste bin. Yes folks, spontaneous combustion does actually happen and quite often. Basically, the oil causes the cotton to slowly decompose. This decomposition causes some heat. If the rag is wadded up or otherwise compressed, it will self heat to the point of ignition. Read any varnish or stain can label. YES it really happens.
I have been on two very serious garage-related fires with victims. One was changing his fuel filter in the winter and spilled fuel into a nearby propane heater which then ignited. He was very lucky to survive and is scarred for life after spending months in the intensive care burn unit. The other was actually outside, poured gas on some branches in a small pit and went looking for a lighter. When he found one the fumes had built up in the pit and it exploded on him with him in the pit. When we got there in the first due engine he had skin dripping off his arms and face.


Take this serious guys, I can't think of a worse way to get hurt.

 

Fire extinguishers. I've got two big ones ,one at both of the overhead entrance doors. A large one that I move close to any extensive welding, grinding job BEFORE I start work. Every car I own has one in it and readily eccessible. Never have too many. I also check the gauges at least once a year to see that they haven't bled down.
I also take one last walk around of the shop before closing the doors and goin in the house for the night.

Frank

 

...i just went around work with a Federal Fire Safety guy who was checking on all the extinguishers. i asked him what you can do to older extinguishers that have lost some of their charge and this is what he said. "turn the extinguisher upside down and hit it once or twice with a rubber mallet". i guess it helps break stuff up...anyways, i only say this because i've often wondered when that little fire will turn into something BIG and i wont have a working fire extinguisher.

...not sure if it really works, but i did it anyways.

 

Just yesterday three houses down, the guy was cleaning his interior and had a heat gun drying the seats off. He set the gun down and got sidetracked cleaning something else and went inside for lunch. You can guess the rest, he lost the car, the boat, the garage and his sunporch on the back of the house.

 

I had the same thing happen to me a few years ago - I actually pulled the carpet/insulation back, but unbeknownst to me it had flipped back into position where it quickly caught fire from the welding heat. I was under the car and it took me a few seconds to figure out what teh hell was going on. Damn nylon carpet might as well be solid gasoline as fast as that shit lights up!!!


Be careful guys - it only takes a few seconds!!

 

I can vouch for the grindings in the rags. Forgot to put the lid back on my rag container and while grinding on a frame set them on fire. Was lucky to see it and only lost some stuff right above the container. Hope your friend survives. Lots of our car related activities can result in damage to us and our property. Joe

 

Sad news indeed and I will pray for your friend.

What have I done in "preparation" for a shop/garage fire?
I have made sure I have an Agreed Value policy on Big Olds.....and a few fire extingishers thruout the garage.

 

Dam i hate to hear this..
Ive lived thru it...3 weeks at Detroit burn center..loss of everything..

I will pray hard for this guy..its a tuff thing to get thru the pain is nothing you have ever felt before in your life. And i was no where near as bad as this guy sounds..mostly from inhalation and on my hand

I was lucky..I hope he is too. hes going to need alot of support

1 word on your ABC powder filled fire extinguishers..at a minimum 1 time per year pick up that fire extinguisher look at the meter..be sure its in the green..than take the extinguisher and tip it up side down hold it that way for a while, (you may feel the clump of powder flump to the top) than tip it back upright..do this at least 3 to 4 times 1 to 2 times a year..this keeps that powder from blocking or cakeing..this is what a fire extinguisher tech. taught me here at my Facility..
they do it to all of our extinguishers once a year when testing them all

 

I was in a guys shop yesterday 24X50. Only door is in the front. Talked about what a fire could do and vounteered put a door in the back for him.

 

Is there something us HAMBers can do for him or his family?

 

Sorry to hear about your friend, fire.
s are the thing that scare me the most.

I have a friend who lost his race car, garage and house when gas fumes from the car were ignited by the natural gas water heater in the garage. He also lost a pretty nifty wife in the divorce afterwards.

My garage is so small that I don't cut or weld inside it and usually take the chopsaw outside to use it.

I've seen several fires caused by drop lights. One that was left inside a car on the front carpet by a guy working under the dash while he went to lunch. A couple by gas hitting the bulb when someone was working on a fuel line under the car.

One of my buddies keeps all of his paint and other flammable liquids in an old fridge. Both to keep the stuff from freezing in winter and to keep them out of the way of errant sparks. It is rather bulky and ugly sitting in the garage but it does the job.

 

About 20 years ago I managed to burn myself badly. 2nd and 3rd degree burns on about 20% of my body. Summer time with only cut off levi's on so the burns were everywhere except the really important stuff. I can tell you without hesitation that even a flash burn like the one I got from exploding bug spray in a closed area is the most painful thing I have ever endured. The part that hurt the worse was the re-generation of the nerves... Or maybe it was the nurse grinding away at the raw wounds with what felt like a red 3M scuff pad every day... No matter. I live in fear of setting my shop on fire and, as a consequence of that fear, do as much welding and grinding outside as I can . I'm careful about where and how I store flamables and I have fire extinguishers all over the place.

Even being conscious of the danger, I still am aware that I could start a fire in just one minute of carelessness

Be Careful. Have a Plan.
Rich

Post Script.
At the time I was laying on the gurney in the burn ward several folks were brought in (can't remember how many but quite a few, maybe a dozen(?)..). These people were working at the power plant in Laughlin, Nevada when a 30 inch steam pipe burst and hosed them all down with extremely hot, high pressure steam. Massive 3rd degree burns on 90 to 100% of their bodies. I watched these people slowly die an unimaginable death over the course of the following two weeks. ( I was in the burn ward over night and did my treatment as an out-patient). They had to be suspended in saline solution and cared for 24 hrs a day, which included having all their entire bodies scrubbed at least once a day.
This was an incredibly humbling experience for me.... All I could do was compare the amount of pain I was in to what these folks must have been experiencing during the last days of their lives. Made me realize that no matter how bad off I might be, there is always someone else hurting more than me. The lesson has never left me and never will....

Rich

 

The biggest problem I see is panic. After you work in a foundry for a while, fire control becomes routine and there's a lot less adrenaline.

The couple times I've been around accidental fire outside work, people literally run in circles and panic and do stupid things. Immediately get to where the air is clear. Breathe a few clean breaths and count to ten with your feet in one spot. Decide to fight or flee. If it's a fight, you give it one good attempt real fast then get the hell out of there. Remember, the combustion is BELOW the visible flame. It's really gonna get smoky when you knock it back, so plan to retreat even with success.

My best wishes go out to X, fire is such a random and terrible thing. I don't mean to imply panic caused any of this, just hope the advice can help someone.

 

I almost lost a tractor trailer due to a battery cable short/fire.

The truck was parked and not running outside a McDonalds where we had just sat down for lunch. Someone said, hey, a truck is on fire in the parking lot, so I got up to see what unlucky bastards truck was burning... surprise!

When I saw the flames they were already 6 feet tall, by "staying cool" I managed to put the fire out wit my 2 pound ABC, and two other borrowed 10 pounders, one from McDonalds, and another that a person had scavanged from the city dump.

I was able to knock the flames back a little with the two pounder, then I was able to remove the plastic covers (farrings <sic?>) to get the powder on the base of the flaming melted plastic.

I had all of the household possessions of a middle age terminal cancer patient on the trailer, I was determined that she not suffer this loss before she died. Frankly, it had to be a miracle that I managed to put the fire out. In the 10 minuites or so it took the fire department to arrive it would have been a total loss...

Fire is scarry and dangerous, just a couple days ago I had a close call. I was welding OUTSIDE of my garage while my son was painting under the hood of his Falcon. I had been useing some laquor thinnner to wipe down under his hood. I left the STILL WET rag ON TOP of the NEARLY EMPTY 5 gallon thinner container.... dumb, dumb, dumb.... (there was probably about a quart in the can)

I noticed the rag had caught fire, I was cool, I calmly moved the rag off the container and safely onto the concrete. Not so scarry right?

Except, after I had done this, I noticed on the clear plastic neck where the plastic cap screws on, a very small flame, so I calmly blew it out, problem was, the flame was inside of the can, after a second, with my face still very close to the can, it went out. I will count this as a blessing from God.

There is no way this flame should have gone out, the can was full of air and fumes, it should have gone off like a bomb and set my face on fire. It took me a second to apreciate the gravity of the situation...

 

After my uncle lost his shop and 5 restored Alfas to an ember in a rag pile (30 min after he closed his shop the fire started), I won't grind weld, or make sparks in my garage. I go into the driveway, I need to get some type of a welding shield between me and the street though....

 

I worked in an aluminum smelter, and man, you're not kidding...

I think this is a good place to remind people of the 6 P's

Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance. Think ahead about what would be the worst thing to happen, and plan to prevent that.

I've been burned so many times I can't remember, but never like your friend Nash. I'm so sorry to hear about what happened to him, he is in my thoughts and prayers.

 

what a crazy name "xxxxxxxxxxxxxx" how do you say that? best wishes to your friend and a speedy recovery. thoughts going out.

 

This is very true. I've been in flames more times than I care to remember, but I've never had any serious injuries because I've always managed to keep my head together. It's an instant fight/flight response that I'm lucky to have programmed into my basic wiring. That said, I've learned to never take anything for granted, and when the risk of some sort of combustion is possible, I always plan my out ahead of time.

 

I'm in contact with his wife. She has her feet on the ground. They have loads of extended relationships in the car community. Thanks for the thought, contributions of any sort could go to somebody closer to you, or of financial need.

For my friend and his wife, Prayer will be appreciated.

 

ok..
keep us posted on his health ,,ok?
I do regularly give to the burn center in Detroit..they did alot for me

 

Hope your friend recovers and gains his life back. I had an electrical fire under my T Ford dash, toasted all the wiring but it spared the paint. When it happened I jump for the fire extinguisher and suppressed the fire very quickly. I keep a fire extinguisher on both sides of my garage and one near the kitchen door. I never let rags build up and remove them from the garage as I work and keep a fan on the far side of the garage to move out any flumes. One can never be to safe.

CRUISER

 

I have a 32x40 shop, and put a man-door in the center of the back wall; due to the slope of the lot my shop is built on, that rear door is 3-feet off the ground. It's strictly a fire exit, in case something bad happens up front, I don't have to run through flames to get out of the building.

I also just got a vintage Craftsman roll-away tool box that I'm converting to a welding cart--I'm going to screw a fire extinguisher holder to the box, so I've always got an extinguisher right near the welder, which is a pretty likely source of sparks and fire.

Also, spend a few bucks and get some of those metal "FIRE EXTINGUISHER" signs that hang on the wall above your fire extinguisher: just because YOU know where you keep your extinguisher doesn't mean any of your buddies will once the poop hits the fan.

-Brad

 

Thanks, 42hotrod for the firefighter's viewpoint.

A lot of responses regarding rags.

It just reminded of my crurrent ideas on that. I used to save rags, and even washed and re-used them. Then I realized that my wife was constantly offering me old clothes as rags, before she threw them away. I quit saving rags and washing them because it was much easier to toss them and use new clean rags ripped from discarded clothing.

Now, even though the decision to discard the used rags, that action was not related to any conscious safety concerns, I realize that putting the used rags into the dumpster outside the shop immediately after using them instead of saving them for washing/recycling will ease my mind when I wake up at night wondering if I put the shop to bed properly, and knowing that there are no oily rags there.

Maybe it was my guardian angle's way of protectiong me? Might be overkill, but today after wiping down some sheetmetal with laquer thinner I put the raq on the lid of the dumpster in the sun to dry out, then as I left for lunch it went into the dumpster instead of back in my rag bin.

 

we had an oil fire a couple of Years ago...pressure line popped off the gauge and soaked a hot header.


Yeah...I didn't know that could happen either!

several fire extinguishers and a cool head made it a non issue...but I quickly realized that my crew functioned as a team...and this was due to 15 minutes of simple conversation on "what to do IF".

there is so much truth to the "6P's"

 

good luck to your friend hope he recovers

 

I have scars all the way across my hairline from moisture that was on the OUTSIDE of a dross tub I dumped some molten aluminum in. Those pics you saw were probably of an old Kaiser plant explosion. I have their handling manual around here someplace with some really scary pictures in it.

Welding blankets are a good investment too, for what it's worth.

 

my 60 corvette still has the badge of a fire from a carb leak while stored i leave the car with the hood latch popped so when i start it after a several month break from using it if it sparks up i can see it, one extinguisher put it out last time but it was the second one the one in the garage turned out to be bad so i went into the house for that one

more recently a person that rents space in my workshop had an engine fire on a car he had just finished a high end restoration on, he got to restore it a second time. i got another building with a sprinkler system in it

 

I've survivied a couple of carb fires on the driveway, and luckily they were easily put out.
When I was a senior in high school, I worked nights in a paint factory where we had a fire one night that lasted eight minutes and did over a million dollars of damage.
Imagine being eighteen years old, and being involved in a fire in a facility that had so much chemical in quantity that you couldn't run far enough fast enough to get away from it. Thousands of gallons of mineral spirits, methel ethel keytone, acetone, zylene, you get the picture.
We got lucky. You realize when you lay your head down on the pillow that night there is a God. I've had fire extinguishers around me ever since. You really can't have too many, and they don't cost as much as the damage they could have saved.
My dad died from burns he suffered while an invalid in a wheelchair.
My heart goes out to this family, the news they are getting from the medical group right now isn't good, and it's hard to be strong and go on. God be with you folks....

 

He's in the Denver General Burn unit

Thanks for the best wishes and kind thoughts.

Maybe I should have explained the xxxxxxxxxxx. I did'nt post name because of a couple of reasons. I wouldn't post his or her name without permission, and she don't need any discussion like that at the moment.................and she sure don't need any calls from ambulance chasers or insurance representatives, selling stuff (or whatever people sell), to people in distress.