I'm sorry to hear about your friend. We were tig welding some mag steering parts a few years back. Everyone was afraid to try it knowing the chances. I figured the inert gas made it safe to do so I gave it a go. No problems. Still have a sizable block of it in the bottom of my toolbox. No joke to play around with.
Pay attention to what you wear while grinding. Nobody wants to wear a leather welding jacket in the summer, but just a leather bib will keep dust and sparks off your front -- make one out of your old disco outfit, lol. And all cotton clothes, all the time, every time.
Ive seen it burn a hole right thru a metal container shaving pan , thru the floor and into the ground below the floor (wood machine shop floor) and it kept smoldering..a guy came over while it was smokin up the place with a cup of water, and the shop instructor smacked it out of his hands, and repeated the rules taught to him at the begining of the class. the guy on the lathe ( if my memory seves me correct) didnt even know it was burning between the floor mounts of his equipment until the guy next to him yelled fire..could have been a bad day.. the insructor shut all the equipment down and had a lecture for the rest of the day on what that shit could have done
PKP will contol a Delta fire it will not extinguish it though. If we have a helo fire on the ship we are trained to jettison the helo. I know that black silicate sand will extinguish a delta fire by melting around the metal encassing in glass essentially. Sorry to hear about the guy getting burned. Hopefully he gets better soon.
One of the guys in our car club works at a place restoring P51 Mustangs. He stole a cup full of magnesium dust and brought it to the shop to set on fire. Was cool watching it burn in a controlled environment. Then we threw water at it, not knowing it would explode. Glad we tried it on a VERY small scale. Learned our lesson real quick if we ever happened upon a real mag fire.
If you work the stuff keep sand around, it doesn't really put it out, just controls the flash/splatter so it doesn't create secondary fires. Extinguishers for magnesium are crazy expensive. But whatever you do, do not keep the sand outside. Too much moisture once you're 6 inches down and ugly things will happen Best wishes for the burned friend, that's a terrible way to get hurt. I've heard of a lot of magnesium flashes but never with dust impregnated clothing. Talk about scary. Wow.
Mag is used for insturment panel castings in many new cars. A very controlable, lightweight impact part can be made. Guys, learn how to identify the stuff and work with it safely as it is at its highest availability in the common salvage yard since the immediate post war era.
Good thread for me to post this tidbit AGAIN. Guys, it doesn not have to be magnesium to be dangerous. Fine Homebuilding did a sidebar on belt sanders and fires. How many of us will sand a chunk of rusty steel then maybe later clean up some aluminum with the same belt? Between the Iron oxide, aluminum shavings, al oxide in the belt and some dust we just created THERMITE!!!!!!!!!!!!
Years ago I was trying to polish a set of 12 spoke mag wheels for a T bucket I built, my work bench top was 2 by 4's , the dust from the wheels went down between the boards and a couple of days later I had to weld up something in a vise on that bench when a spark hit that powder it was like all hell broke lose, scared the crap out of me me and did a number on that work bench, you got to be carefull..........................
Cold fire has products that are supposed to extinguish mag fires. Anyone use it? Sorry to hear about your friend.
Although I remembered all the dangers of Mg from chemistry lab in college (or so I thought), I got a first hand refresher course when my Porsche 928 had an engine fire. The multiple piece intake was magnesium, and made quite a spectacle when it caught fire. Hope your buddy heals quickly.
During WWII, the firemen found out that on MAGNESIUM fires could only be put out using a FINE SPRAY of WATER!!------------Don
I'll pray that your friend has a speedy and complete recovery. My brother was in a gas fire and 3rd degree burns on his arms and side. I've seen how bad that can be. But he will heal up fine.
so what is the best way to cut a mag. part.. i have a set of millitary hummer wheels that have mag. run flats in them that i need to trim alittle.... best wishes for the friend
Sand or other traditional oxygen blockers won't work on a mag fire once it's burning because it makes it's own oxygen. Like other said PKP will slow it but not put it out. Think fireworks and enhanced dynamite it's all mag or aluminum dust added for a hotter bigger bang. Most metals will burn if the pieces are small enough and enough heat is added. Don't even think about metallic sodium like used in some valve stems it ignites just by exposure to wet air.
Point 1, magnesium is a metal, not an oxide and does not make it's own oxygen. Second, metallic sodium oxidizes in air and fine powder can spontaneously combust. In water, it reacts to form sodium hydroxide and gaseous hydrogen, which was one of the reasons the Hindenberg was so pretty at night.
I'm only relating what I was taught as a fire fighter in Navy Crash Crew N.A.S. Agana Guam in 1960. I was a cocky kid and voluteered to extinguish a hugh Magnesium aircraft supercharger. I believe we used TMB I walked up and started spraying and it was like putting gasoline on a fire. scared the shit out of me and a good laugh for all watching. it was explained after that burning Magnesium does create its own oxygen as it burns (underwater torches) and the TMB burns much faster than Magnesium and uses that produced oxygen and leaves a hard crust that blocks outside oxygen. it's been close to 50 years and I'm not any smarter now than I was then. I won't argue, just thought I'd share a personal story
Back in the early 80's I'd always take a VW block to torch at Glamis. We'd do it out in the dunes and not at Oldsmobile Hill. Kinda funny, we'd get it burning then go sit on a hill and watch the curious passerbys. They'd pull up, look at the fire, then have to sit there until their eyes adjusted back to darkness before being able to drive off. DriveEm: All the best to your friend. Burns are the most painful injury.
Purple k is good for mag fires only you would need more of a metal-x extinguisher for other various types of combustible class d metals ( blends, platings) or even buckets of dehydrated soda ash to put out a mag fire. J/m/.02
The ol' Man served in the Navy as a Aviation mechanic 69/72' . He told me the stuff they used to put out fires on the carrier "Saratoga" was called "Light Water" and made with Deer Blood and Salt Water. i know he is full of
This is why we do not blast, or powder coat magnesium. When we order metallic pigments for our custom powder colors we have to sign a end use certificate, and swear not to use it for making bombs. that cert/contract get mailed to the Government (D.O.D. I think)
I am sorry to hear about your friend . Yes that stuff really is hard to put out but does make some nice fireworks ! Everyone be real careful around magnesium !
yup magnesium is quite flamable also aluminum dust is flamable to i believe iron dust also when airborn is combustable , sorry about your friend , vw blocks burn bad a teacher at school lost one the F/D hadnt much experience with magnesium and they hit it with a hose , ended up shoveling sand on it to smother it ,
Yikes...safety posts are a good thing!!! Magnesium is a dangerous material, I remember seeing a film where the fires after the Mercedes crash at LeMans in 1955 (over 80 killed) burned out of control and when the fire marshals tried to douse them with water all hell broke loose! And the Hindenburg disaster in 1936 was made worse by the use of the doped fabric/aluminum powder covering. I forget when working with dangerous things-we all do. Take care!
Hope your friend recovers quickly. I have two five spoke American mags to clean up and polish for my Lyndwood. How do I safely get rid of the filings and sanded off mag bits?
all metals fall under class d fire. purple k is a brand name of a class d extinguishing agent. it works well. other wise co2 can be used. it works by cooling it below ignition temp. but you will need a lot of it. the reaction you get with water is spawling. a violent reaction due to rapid cooling. at work we use indirect aplication of heavy foam.it's more bubles than water. also works by cooling. if you do not have these. let it burn. if possible. if a larger treat is involved (like fire inside your shop). call the FD. if all else fails plain water will work but use it at a distance. it is extreamly dangerous to try and fight a metal fire with water. as for how to cut it. use a cutting/cooling fluid. work out side when possible. and work clean, don't let filings and dust collect.
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