model A frontend , what gives ?

okay , i have a four inch drop axle , and a Mr Roadster reverse eye spring that is 31 1/4" from eye to eye . i set everything under the frame just to see what it would look like and it seems to sit too high . i know there is no engine , but even when i get up on the frame ( i'm 328 ) it does'nt give .
the tires that are on it are 600x16 , but i plan on putting 5.50x16's . right now the frame measures from the deck of the trailer to the bottom of the u bolt plate 15 and a 1/2 inches . today i put a one inch rachet strap around the ***embly and was able to colapse it only 1 and a 1/2 inch . i stopped because the ratchet would'nt ratchet anymore it was so tight .
what gives ?

i did notice that the new spring has more arch tnen the old one , but the old one is a hundred years old .

also from what i understand on the old springs you had to use a stretcher to get them on , but this new one just slid right on . does this have any effect ? ........thanks

mike

 

You don't have any weight on it yet.

 

Put the body and motor in it, issue solved.

 

New springs settle over time. I would not be suprised if it settles an inch or more plus it drops if you remove a leaf or two to adjust the ride. Wait until you have the front end loaded with the motor-trans-body-radiator-etc. You may want to wait on shock installation as the front may settle so much the shocks will bottom out.

 

I have essentually the same setup with the same problem. I reworked my crossmember for an additional 1 1/4" of drop, just clearing the '32 radiator tank, changed the spring to a Posies 1" drop/ reverse eye spring, and took the top leaf of the spring out. Then I reworked my bones for an additional 1/2" of drop and this set my front dimension at 12 1/2" as you measured with G-78 Cokers on the front and L-78 on the rear. The car sits perfect but it was a **** load of work to get it there.

My understanding is the Mr. Roadster springs set higher than Posies. Anybody know for sure? PM me if you need any details.

 

How wide is your axle 46 inch or 48 inch? and what is your batwing mounting width? I ask cause your spring might be too wide...ghost

 

Those springs look thick as hell. And if you notice the shackle angle, should be around 45-degrees when loaded.

Install the motor & trans. Bounce up and down on the front end a few times. After a week of sitting the spring ought to settle a bit. If it's still too high, swap the front crossmember out for a '32 crossmember, and it ought to sit good.

I thought the same thing before I dropped in the motor on my old project.

Stock "A" frame with '32 front crossmember, dropped "A" axle, stock unreversed "A" spring with a few leaves removed, 5.00/5.25-16 fronts, Ford Y-Block...

 

thanks koz . i do plan on changing the crossmember for that extra drop as well . i have seen the posies , but only in pictures . they do seem to have less arch to them .

 

By the time you add a body, radiator, motor, trans etc etc you'll be putting 1000 lbs on that front end

 

How is it that a Model A front crossmember in a 32 frame results in a 1" drop and a 32 front crossmember in Model A frame results in any drop at all?

 

well thats what i am hoping , but i had a 69 camaro one time with the same issue ( full body ) that i put a small block in and the front end bairly lowered because it had big block springs . so i was wondering if the spring that i have is too much . there is no advertised spring pressure for these springs .

 

You are probably lacking a total of 1500 to close to 2000 lbs of total weight including the engine, trans, body and all the other goodies. I'd put it all together before I got too excited about changing things right now.

 

I've got a 30 inch standard Mr roadster spring. And with it sitting on it's eyelets to the bottom of the crown, on a table it measures 4 1/8 inch tall with no weight at all...ghost

 

ghost , the total width i'm not sure of . its a stock model a axle that has been lowered by joe of joes speed shop . the width of the perch bosses is 36 and a 1/2 inches that i measured when i ordered the spring ..........thanks

 

Well you've got the right spring width. Everyone is prolly right about the weight. This frame has a 4 inch drop with a standard posies spring...ghost

 

thanks ******** . i'll set a motor and trans on there and see what happens . i'm also thinking of getting rid of the spring for a stock one and then reverse the eye on it . i may be jumping the gun , but if this was going to turn in to an issue i'd like to address it at this point .

 

thanks mr48 . i think you along with some others here are right . i'm just jumping the gun .

thank you all..................mike

 

Mike, I had the stock spring in mine. When I first set up the ch***is, I wanted it low, but not stupid low. The small tires help the lowered stance more than you think. I had a spare main leaf that I was planning to reverse the eyes on incase I wanted a little more drop.

I say you should move on from the front end, and keep working on the rest of the build. When everything starts going together and you think you need more drop up front, then you can mess with the spring and crossmember.

I think you'll be surprised once you get all the weight on the ch***is and the smaller tires up front.


Jeremy

 

I have know knowledge of the Mr. Roadster front spring, but I do the Posie's reverse eye spring, and I actually had to take out the top three or 4 leafs. I have a 4" dropped axle and it is 46" king pin to king pin. I think the stock Model A axle is closer to 50.225" king pin to king pin.
Depending on what type of look you want you may have to notch the frame under the springs is you get lower, as you don't want the springs contacting the frame.
As far as weight goes, if you have a highboy you will have a total weight of 2500lbs and more than likely you will have more weight up front than in the rear, so as everyone else has said is you need to mock it up with motor, trans, radiator, (hood if you have one) and everything else. It even helps to add weight where ever you are going to put the gas tank just to load the whole ch***is.
Yes, the springs will settle, but the front will settle less than the rear, ***uming you are going to use a stock/modified A spring.
Here are a couple of pictures of my bare frame (the ride height had already been set through mock up) and one with the car pretty much at full wieght mockup.

 

Yep, put some weight on it and watch it sink in. Mine sunk like a GOOD 2", at LEAST. Ive got a 4" dropped axel with a 2" dropped/reverse eyed spring on mine, STOCK front crossmember too.

 

Yep. Put some weight on it.

 

I have tried both springs and the mr roadster spring sits higher than a posies spring they are also a bit on the stiff side

 

No offense, but the crossmember looks like the re-pro A crossmember common to the aftermarket.

The gennie 32 crossmember has more of a dip to it and using the A crossmember gives you about an inch of drop.

 

If you're not setting the engine in or body on for a while, you can dis***emble the spring and use the main leaf only.
(Make a block - wood is ok - to duplicate the height of the missing leafs.)

This duplicates ride height pretty well and can be useful during the build.
(If you don't know how to safely dis***emble the spring - ask.)

Installing a roadster body doesn't make the frame come down to a great extent, it's the engine/trans combo that does it.


You have to use a spring spreader to get the complete front spring ***embly into the car when the car is complete - or nearly so - with engine, body etc.

There are other ways to do it if you don't have a spreader.

 

Are you using the later style bones with a thicker top mounting flange?
This will raise everything from the spring perch eyes upward by 1/2".

 

first thing i do to a new spring... screw all that guessing . take it apart and add leaves as you build the car

 

I took the stock crossmember out of mine, made a new straight one. Magnum 5 inch axel, and reversed eye Mr. roadster spring. Its low. Had to notch out the frame rails for spring clearance.
I dont have a pick of my front end, but here is another frame I did sitting next to mine. Its all speed way, with 3" tube and a flat crossmember.

 

Not a bad idea.

I'm prone to do the single main leaf bit, then add all the rest.

After driving it a while - spring loosens up etc. - I'll pull what looks necessary.


I am doing what you've done with the 31's rear spring.
It may need one leaf added, but right now things look about right with the 1" aluminum spacer block in place.

 

i'm at the point where i need to add 1 to mine...kept takin' leaves out because of some ride issues...ended up being the gas shocks , but never replaced a leaf.. but its low , oh yes , its low about a inch off the c notch.....

 

Here's a pic of the aluminum spacer block on mine.

31 roadster on 32 rails.


And without.


It does sit on a steel "wear" pad.
(Be sure and bring the bolts in from the bottom so you can swap for different length bolts if necessary. I didn't and paid for my sin.)


The car sits fairly low in back as well.


This is without the aluminum spacer block - which is 1" thick.



Even if you're running a stock A rear crossmember, a spacer block could help.

I did a similar thing on my 32 with Durant Mono-Leaf up front.
It has an extra 3/8" spacer - including all the supplied Durant spacers.
The spring sagged a bit and bottomed too early.

That's about the max you can go with spacers inside the re-pro Model A front crossmember.