hey guys, im trying to put 3 point shoulder harness type seat belts in my 36 pickup. im thinking im goanna haft to build a row bar in it to hook the top point to. any better ideas ? thanks ......
I'll have to look but I recall seeing belts that go over the shoulder that still mount to the floor. Check some of the off-road websites.
weld a plate with a captured nut to the b-post and bolt it there... PS, what the fuck is a "row bar"?
Look at minivans, I used 99 caravan (I think) in customers truck. You will have to beef up a place for an upper mount though.. (whatz a row bar? is it like an oar lock on a boat?)
I am going through the same thing with my Model A, but I am not looking at racing type belts, just a good 3 point setup and mount the upper point to the door jam or upper part of the body. What you are describing with the "shoulder harness" and bar behine the seat is strictly a racing type setup and I don't think this is what you want because it will require belts other than stock type. If you put over the shoulder belts (other than factroy 3 point like in new cars) you will have to put a braced bar behind the seat. The belts that go over the shoulder should be as short as possible so they minimize stretch. (If you where to just run the belts over the top of the seat and then down to the floor this could potentially be very dangerous. If you were in an accident it could compress your spine and creat serious damage to your body, this is not a safe way to attach over the shoulder belts) You also need to remember that when you do you should mount them behind the driver/passanger and supported above a line drawn downward from the shoulder point at an angle of about 20 degrees with the horizontal. Also, realize once you have done this you now really need to add a submarine belt, because you have effectively anchored the shoulders but in an collision if you don't have the submarine belt your lower body will not be anchored anywhere and you could receive spine or upper body injuries. I would look at Julianos products and maybe call them for some suggestions. www.julianos.com IMHO
You know newer cars had row bars and radio tires. Gawd you're killin' me fiddy. BTW forget the roll bar and do it like fiddy says. Its the easiest way to git 'er done. Fiddy knows what he's talkin' about.
what i was thinking was something like a factory over the shoulder / lap, type setup. thanks for the ideas.
no. that will rip out of the post, and really defeat the reason for doing it... when i say plate, i mean plate... 1/8". make sure the plate that holds the captured nut is at least 3" past the capture box on at least two sides, and 1 1/2" past on the other two... and WELD IT IN.
I put 4 points mounted to the floor to avoid this situation, but it sounds like I may have done it wrong. Chopped- you sound like you know what you're talking about with the belts. I mounted a 4-point to the floor behind the bench seat. The belts still wrap over the top of the seat and down over the shoulder. How is that any more likely to compress your spine than any other way?
do you have a bar welded into the car behind the seat just below the top of the seat? if not, you're askin for trouble when your seat back wants to follow you through the glass
No... No bar. So would you pass the belts around the rear of the bar to give the belts something solid to pull forward against? I have noticed the seat back issue, but didn't think it was a huge deal, it didn't seem to want to pull forward that much. EDIT: How thick of a bar would be needed?
ah, yea... bad idea. the seat WILL fold like a wet taco shell in a crash... you'd be farther off without the shoulder belts in my opinion set up like you have it... as far as a bar, depends on the thickness and material. a pair of 3/16" slotted plate guides bolted to plates like i mentioned above with captured nuts would suffice
Well poop. I thought it was good. I can see the point about the bar across the back though, I'll check into it. As far as my setup, this is where I got my belts and the installation instructions. http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo.net/4-point-seat-belt.html
35PontiacCoupe, The way you have your setup now could kill/permanently cripple you or your passanger. If you want to keep the over the shoulder straps, you will need to put a roll bar, roll hoop in behind the seat that is braced. When you put the harness over this bar you want to wrap it around the bar at least twice, then mount it to the floor. You want any movement from the harness to be transfered to the rollbar/hoop, then to the floor. The movement I am talking aobut with the harness attached to the rollbar/hoop is horizontal, not verticle like you have it now. A verticle movement will just pull your shoulders down to the floor........not good at all!!!!!!!!!!!!! As for the picture you posted, I would put any belts in the configuration.............even on a rocking chair!!!!! Plus, it would never pass any tech inspection at any racing orginization I have ever been a part of; NHRA, IHRA, SCCA...................... IMHO
My apologies to the original poster for hijacking this thread, I intended to add to the discussion of your problem and it went OT for a bit and hopefully I'll bring it back around to something you can use too! So if I were to just go to 3 points, since I have wood framing around my doors, what would be the best way to mount the anchor? I looked on Julianos and they have a writeup, but the door they're installing on has pretty solid steel frames. The wood's pretty solid, but I don't know if I'd trust it to hold in an accident...
Newer Cadillac seats have the shoulder harness built into the seat. I passed on a set from a pick-a-part for 40 bucks. Wouldn't look "period" correct, but neither would a shoulder harness.
I have to agree with Chopped Coupe, you don't want the shoulder belts anchored to the floor or anything else that would be a couple of inches, 6" max, below your shoulder. Anything lower than this will allow your body to move forward in the belts and essentially do nothing to prevent forward motion, it would give you some nasty bruising and compress the spine. Lap belts on their own would be better and would cause less physical damage. Keep the attachment point for the shoulder loop as high as you can, I think it was said max. 20 degree down. This will be the safest, most secure route. And weld in an attachment point.....
I'm attaching a picture of my "B-pillar" and as you can see, there's not a whole lot to mount to. The wood is 70+ year old oak and I don't feel comfortable mounting anything to that. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated though! On the Caddy seats, I've been looking around and they might not be too terrible. Wife's been complaining about the lack of lumbar support in the original seat anyways, maybe it's time to upgrade to something with an integrated seat belt. Looks like 99-05 Silverado's etc, had integrated seats too, and I wouldn't have to mess around with power, heated, a/c, lumbar massaging seats from a caddy... http://newseatcover.com/seatdetails.html
35PontiacCoupe, About the only way to put a three point belt in your car would be to take out the wood and replace it with metal and brace it, then you could attach the belt to the door jam. Now with that said it looks like your car is painted, so, these metal replacement pieces for the wood would need to really be welded in, not just bolted. I would have to see more pictures of your interior and think about it for awhile. But in the meantime if you drive your car I would ditch the over the shoulder harnesses and just go with a lap belt........................what you have is just dangerous. IMHO
Thanks chopped, I am definitely not looking to replace any wood any time soon. That just does not appeal to me! I'm actually looking at the newer seats, notably the Chrysler Sebring and Caddy seats with the integrated belts. I was planning on doing new seats eventually, but holding off because I can't do everything in the interior right now. I'll just do the seats and let it look goofy for now. I'd rather be driving it- and driving it safely... I will ditch the shoulder belts in the meantime and just go with laps. Thanks for all your help!
Here is how I mounted a 3 point system in my 40 pickup. Welded plates in the corners with three mounting points for adjustment.
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