I have to admit, I get a real chuckle out of these threads. Props to the original poster for admitting he flew off the handle over a $3.50 part. That said, looking at Denny's driveshaft FAQ (I happen to be having some issues), I notice he seems pretty touchy about just this subject. quote from teh FAQ "Why does my rear u-joint wear out so often? This is usually the case when a u-bolt style pinion yoke is used. The pinion yoke is not the problem the overtightening of the u-bolt is the cause of the failure. You may find that every time you change the damaged rear u-joint you will find that one or both of the journals or caps that are under the u-bolts are destroyed and the ones that are pressed into the shaft are still in good shape. You did it to yourself! 17 ft/lbs for 1310 & 1330 series and 20 ft/lbs on the 1350 series."
22ft lbs? Just a little above finger tight! You trust a driveshaft/u-joint to a ubolt that strips at 22 ft lbs!? So you have a 500hp small block pushing power to the rear axle with a tin strip pretending to be a ubolt!! ..sounds like trouble! I doubt this is the first ubolt that's been stripped, sounds like Denny didn't want to hear about any more stripped Chinese ubolts that he bought by the thousand. I bet the ubolt at the dealer didn't cost $3.50 but I also bet it won't strip @ 22 lbs!
When I first read the rant, I assumed it was about CROSSTHREADING a UBold. Now that you have pointed this out, I have issues that I won't even go into regarding that FAQ. I've dropped drive shafts, replaced U JOints several dozen times in my life and have never even used a torque wrench on the damned things, I know I tend to overtorque, more when I was a kid than now, but that disclamer is bullshit, to me it seems that overtorque might stretch the UBolt, but sure as hell shouldn't crush the cap. ???? I have never had a UJoint fail after installing it, or a UJoint cap UBolt fail. Never. Something is wrong with that product.
Maybe he broke it and maybe it was cheap junk...maybe this was the 10th piece of shit he bought this month that's supposed to work and doesn't. That's what I'm getting sick of- nothing works. Everyone cuts corners and I end up with a piece of shit that breaks the third time I use it. Is it a BIG deal that the fan I bought sounds like a B-29 taking off? Not really, I'll just return it. Is it a big deal that the iPod dock for my truck played static louder than the music no matter how I set it? Not really, I'll just return it. Is it a big deal that my Garmin GPS just stopped working one day out of the blue? Not really I'll just return it...etc. At some point, it gets to be a pain in the ass running around all day returning things that don't do what they are supposed to do, and everyone's breaking point is different. I used to keep a list of companies that have wronged me to the point where I don't do business with them anymore...the list is so long that now I keep a list of GOOD companies...that doesn't seem right. In this case, for the most part I agree with the folks here, not because Denny was right but because I wouldn't want to deal with waiting for it to come in the mail. That being said, if this part really was cheap junk, how long before it failed while driving? But then again if it really is cheap junk, why do you want them to send another one? More questions than answers...but a rant of my own.
I just woke up. 22 Ft Pounds on a little UBolt? Sounds like a lot to me. That's more than I torque spark plugs to, is the torque on a big assed bolt like exhaust or intake manifold mount bolts, flywheel to torque converter bolts, etc. Fact is that might be the problem, 22 Foot Pounds might be too much torque.
But as a buisness owner......A $3 part? shure , I'll drop one in the mail, just be shure not to torque it over 22lbs. Have a nice day, call me if you need anything else. It isn't even a part he made, so it isn't a "personal attack" on his craftsmanship. I had a steering knuckle go out pretty quickly on my Fatman front end. Brent admitted they got a bad batch from the Mfr. He gave me a new one and it is going strong. I went to NAPA and got the other one, even though he probably would have given me another. He could have easily told me it was my problem now, go buy a new one. This is one of the reasons I swear by his stuff and only run Fatman stuff on all my projects. If the transcript is correct, he gave Denny 3 oportunities to make right, 2 after Denny began ranting an him, before going off on his business. Who knows the tone of voice from either party, but from a proffessional standpiont, that is unacceptable. Don't attack a customer over a stupid, cheap part, even if he is an idiot and screwed it up himself. In these days of the internet, a disgruntled person can go off to millions of people in a few minutes, and it is there for ever, to anyone who googles your business. Over $3? Not remotely worth it. Yes,you could easily go to NAPA and pick one up, which I would do because I hate waiting for mailed parts. But you can't fault him for calling to replace a "bad" part.
Aside from all of the advice that some have given about how the man reacted to his problem, and the fact that he might live 40 miles from the nearest gravel road, telephone is easier than driving to NAPA, remember this; It was the obvious bullshit reply he got from the vendor when he called in about his problem. 6 times out of 10 when I have a problem with a counter person, I get the attitude instead of a civil response. If a parts dealer can't put up with unsatisfied customers, gets riled whenever even a dick has a complaint, then he shouldn't be in business. The customer is alwas right, to good businessmen, and good businessmen know this. That's why so many businesses fail, ran by WANNABE businessmen. You've probably heard this story in one form or another. In the barracks in Thailand during the late '60s we nailed our houseboy's shoes to the floor. Nothing was ever said until one of the guys was preparing to rotate back to the world. He told houseboy about his involvement and apologized. Houseboy replied, "that's okay GI, I quit spitting in your coffee cup after I wash it now.........."
I'll add. In reply to a businessman that whines about how rude some customers are; "So?, what's your point?"
Yep, Fleet Pride Inc <cite>www.[B]fleet[/B]pride.com</cite> 3901 Jones Sausage Rd Garner, NC 27529-9436 (919) 779-2320 But beware, they'll be mean to you if you strip a u-bolt.
I've sold hundreds of driveshaft u-bolt sets, removed and installed hundreds, and have yet to see a good set of u-bolts strip. I have seen many that have been damaged over the years from being run loose or being soft Chinese crap. Like some of the guys are saying, support your local guys too. Hey zman, fwiw, Fleetpride is owned my mid-east investors. I call them Taliban Truck Parts. My buddies at the local store get a laugh over it.
Personal responsibility, increasingly rare anymore. The US is turning into a "its never my fault" mentality - i.e. the lady who sued McDonalds and received $640,000 because she put her hot drive-thru coffee between her legs and it spilled.
I disagree. More often than not, yes the customer is right. But the customer is sometimes not right. A real businessman knows which applies and responds accordingly.
No comment on Denny's - I've never done business with him. My comments are directed elsewhere. The comments about customer service do remind me of a time when I was 16 and took a axle shaft to have some 3" studs pressed in it. I took it to the local NAPA store. After I got it home I realized the flange was BENT where the studs were pressed in. I took it back and complained. The OWNER of the store proceeded to explain how I was at fault because I told them I removed the old studs by hammering them out. To which I asked, "If it was me then why is the flange bent OUT instead of IN ?" To which he couldn't reply. He turned me away knowing full well that it was in fact HIS guys who screwed up my axle. I swore off them as being jerks and vowed never to buy any shit from them. Well 10 years or so later I softened up on my stance as I was desperate for some spindle washers. So I broke my promise to myself and walked into the store. Found the right spindle washers and went to the counter. Both counter guys had disappeared into the back room when I was looking for my parts. The OWNER was fiddling with a display at the far end of the counter. Well I waited and waited ever so patiently - the owner full well knowing I was there. Well after a few minutes of this I came to my senses and walked back the wall and hung up those washers I desperately needed. Just as I got to the door, The owner says "Can I help you?" I reply, "No, but you could have 10 minutes ago" Point being - in my case the store owner - once an asshole always an asshole. He proved that. Sometimes you gotta stick with your gut feeling. I almost messed up by giving him a second chance - I am glad I came to my senses. The other thing to consider is that eveyone has a bad day once in a while - even business owners. We were working late at a buddy's shop not long ago. The phone rang and my buddy ended up being a little bit rude to the caller. Just as my buddy hung up the phone - he says, "what the hell was I thinking!!!!" He shook his head and we laughed - it was a stressful night!!!!
Did you over-react? Good of you to admit it. But Denny, if he's that good, has to know what he sent you was crap. And he could, indeed, have treated you with respect and consideration even if he ultimately turned down your request. Instead, he became a big man in his eyes by flipping you off. I'm siding with you-could have been handled a lot better. And I'm too old and life's too short to deal with people who just don't give a damn about "customer service". Sorry,Denny.
The genesis of "the customer is right", is simple, has nothing to do with emotions, feelings, or phylosophy. If there was no customer the businessman would not have a livelyhood. Therefore, since the customers support the businessman, they are essential to his survival. The businessman can respond, accordingly as you suggest, by being grateful for the opportunity to serve the customer.
True. My father had to, many times, explain to customers why what they were asking for was beyond his ability to provide. Some times he lost money doing the right thing. Occasionally he lost business for standing his ground. And a couple times he told people to get the hell out and not to come back. He had many loyal customers for a lot of years.
Been in sales for over 35 years, and a dissatisfied customer is always a selling and PR opportunity, based on how the situation is handled. I was taught many years ago that there is only 2 rules to succeed in sales: 1. The customer is always right. 2. If the customer is ever wrong, reread rule #1.
fact is the customer didn't even know what torque to use, he heard the 22 pounds afterward. he used his own judgement first, instead of calling customer service. he took it upon himself to know how to install a u joint. you never bothered to look into the facts of the mcdonalds coffee lawsuit, have you? mcdonalds had been serving their coffee excessively hot, hotter than allowed by law. they served it so hot a person could not drink it immediately after purchase. "some" customers wanted it so hot so it would be the perfect temp by the time they got to work. customers reported it being so hot that it would melt the styrofoam cups. they had been warned repeatedly to lower their serving temp and never did. the old lady that got burned got third degree burns in her crotch because mcdonalds continued to break the law.
Arguing with any customer over a $3.50 part is not the way to build goodwill. News about bad experiences always travels faster than good
There is a LAW on how hot of coffee you can serve? I can see it now cop at the counter.... "Yes sir I am gonna have to write you up, been a lotta complaints, excessive coffee temp in a regular temp coffee zone. Thats penal code 212.0 f." Ha Ha come on
NO she got burned because SHE spilled the hot coffee in her crotch! (Hotter that allowed by law) Which coffee temperature "law" are you refering to? Don't bullshit, cite the case and legal citation number. Ray, you must be part of the population that needs the "don't use the hairdryer in the bathtub" warning label.
fine, no actual law, but here's the facts: McFact No. 1: For years, McDonald's had known they had a problem with the way they make their coffee - that their coffee was served much hotter (at least 20 degrees more so) than at other restaurants. McFact No. 2: McDonald's knew its coffee sometimes caused serious injuries - more than 700 incidents of scalding coffee burns in the past decade have been settled by the Corporation - and yet they never so much as consulted a burn expert regarding the issue. McFact No. 3: The woman involved in this infamous case suffered veryserious injuries - third degree burns on her groin, thighs and buttocks that required skin grafts and a seven-day hospital stay. McFact No. 4: The woman, an 81-year old former department store clerk who had never before filed suit against anyone, said she wouldn't have brought the lawsuit against McDonald's had the Corporation not dismissed her request for compensation for medical bills. McFact No. 5: A McDonald's quality assurance manager testified in the case that the Corporation was aware of the risk of serving dangerously hot coffee and had no plans to either turn down the heat or to post warning about the possibility of severe burns, even though most customers wouldn't think it was possible. McFact No. 6: After careful deliberation, the jury found McDonald's was liable because the facts were overwhelmingly against the company. When it came to the punitive damages, the jury found that McDonald's had engaged in willful, reckless, malicious, or wanton conduct, and rendered a punitive damage award of 2.7 million dollars. (The equivalent of just two days of coffee sales, McDonalds Corporation generates revenues in excess of 1.3 million dollars daily from the sale of its coffee, selling 1 billion cups each year.) McFact No. 7: On appeal, a judge lowered the award to $480,000, a fact not widely publicized in the media. McFact No. 8: A report in Liability Week, September 29, 1997, indicated that Kathleen Gilliam, 73, suffered first degree burns when a cup of coffee spilled onto her lap. Reports also indicate that McDonald's consistently keeps its coffee at 185 degrees, still approximately 20 degrees hotter than at other restaurants. Third degree burns occur at this temperature in just two to seven seconds, requiring skin grafting, debridement and whirlpool treatments that cost tens of thousands of dollars and result in permanent disfigurement, extreme pain and disability to the victims for many months, and in some cases, years. now, which customer is always right? the one that wants their coffee scalding hot, or the one that has third degree burns? back to people stripping bolts...
Amen....... Another company screwed me on a $7.00 float for my gas tank... Their customer service rep told me to "suck it up" it's only $7.00. I have bought over $40,000.00 worth of parts over the years... FROM THEIR COMPETITOR.. It should have went like this... "hey man. I am sorry you are having trouble, it's an in-expensive part and we will get one shipped out today. What's your address?............. By the way, these things are only supposed to be torqued to 22 ft. lbs, it's easy sometimes when your laying under a car to over torque them. Sometimes they get stripped from over tightening. Thanks For shopping with us and hope to hear from you soon." Then after you hang up the phone you can go ........."f'n moron" or whatever else you feel like saying.
I will admit... a couple of bucks in a part back to the customer goes a long way to keep that customer. I bought a carb from Jegs that had a part missing on it when it arrived. I called and they sent a new one right away without any questions and I returned the first one. I received a voucher for $20 on any part they have for my trouble. That is customer service. The attitude of the customer calls sets the tone for the conversation. If you're an asshole you can only guess how the customer service rep will treat you!
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