Chevy 283 or 355 in 57 chevy?

bore it .125 and use a 327 crank.... http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Garage-Sale-Arias-327-Small-Block-Chevy-Pistons,5088.html and buy these pistons....

 

If you want a historically correct feel on a performance build, I would only consider either a vintage blower OR a old 409/Z11.

If I recall, the sotry line of American Grafitti was that the 55 actually was supposed to have a Z11 motor in it. That was the trick motor of it's day. A 409 would have a similar appeal and could be up to the task failry well.

Now if you have never driven a blown motor, you'll really have to do that before you decide to rule it out. Forced Induction (FI) makes so much torque down low it will amaze you. You can make well over 1 hp per cubic in with FI.

The key point here is that you need to pick a cut-off for when you would want to end your build. You said you figured a car a young man would build in 1965, so maybe that is your cut off. There was plenty of technology by then so you're not too limited.

I know of a fellow who ran a Jenkins Prepared 327 with a roller cam right about that time. You could recreate a similar build and split the difference between the 283 and 350. I don't have any strong religion on blocks and internals. As long as the Chevy motor was originally painted orange, I would use any of them.

So where are you cutting off your period time line?

 

i wanted to cut it right at 1965 seeing how the car was still only 8 years old at the time. right in the middle of the gasser wars. kind of build it where the car seems fit with or without a straight axle. not too radical but not too stock. somewhere in between.

i mean the picture posted is my motor now. maybe replace the finned covers with a set of either stock or i have a set of those turbo fire 327 covers with the v dent down the middle. i wanna re paint my block orange and leave the headers white

im also going to try to get rid of or hide some of the other modern parts of it. like the pulleys and the fan. but i dont know. it just seems confused under there


oh and pxtx i have driven an (underdriven) blower car. my dad lives in RI and i drove his coupe once (6-71 355cu in. with a turbo 400) but then again i exactly able to slam any gears either so i dont know

 

I would stick with the 350 stroke her out to 383 and dress it up for the nostalgia aspect. As far as the rearend I would go for a 3.73. I got a mildly built 355 w/ a TH400 right now with 4.11s at 70+ she's really talkin to ya lol.

 

OK, lets strip this back to basics.

Engines are air pumps. The way you make more power is by cramming in more air. You can cram in all the fuel in the world, but without oxygen to allow combustion, it's a waste of time.

Basic math. Divide 292 by 355 and you'll find that the 292 only has 82% as many cubes as 355. They're 18% different.

Sooo, if the current 355 spins 5500 RPM, then to pump the same amount of air with a 292, you'll have to spin it harder. This works out to 6686 RPM. Most performance cammed 350s are good to 6200 with a stock bottom end, and you'll have to wind that 292 out to 7537 rpm to pump the same air.

Now what you're gonna find is that 283/292 parts cost the same as 350 parts.

You're also gonna find every thousand RPM of redline past 6500 requires a thousand bucks worth of hard part upgrade. Stud girdles, forged pistons/crank, that kind of thing. Literally, the most expensive thing to do with a hipo engine is spin it harder.

Starting to see the benefit of the 355? If built to the same RPM capability and cost as the 283, it wins the race every time. There's nothing magical about 283s unless you're in a race class that handicaps based on displacement.

good luck

 

thats a great way of looking at it. makes it seem so clear it makes me wish i had thought of it! haha. so pretty much its back to basics and squeezin some extra horses out of the 355. the only down fall of the 350 is its got 1.94 valves and a cast steel crank. so ill just keep the 283 on hold for now and dress up the ol' 355. i wont play it off as a 283 but at least itll look more nostalgic.

 

With enough cutting anything will fit, but M/T was selling a 4" stroker crank in '64 that was for small journal blocks, probably mostly got installed in 327's

 

But what you dont mention is a 283 WILL pull more rpms than a 350 due to the shorter stroke, because every revolution it has to travel a shorter distance up and down. As in the factory built 3" stroke z-28 motors were known to be able to rev on occation to 10,000

Where you have problems is the upper end cant keep up with the bottom end but valve springs and screw in studs will fix that and cost mabey a few dollars more than a lower rpm performance motor

 

i have a 283,runs strong, but i wish i had a 350

 

I say choose whatever motor you want and put a nostalgic blower on it. This will allow you run a mild rear gear and still get great performance. Look at all the Buick guys. They run real fast with mild 3 series gears. Torque from a blower is where it's at!

 

i swapped a .060 over 283 in my chevy this winter. In my opinion, if you like tinkering and the idea of getting an ancient slide-ruled designed engine to be relatively powerful, you should totally build the 283.

 

You can put a small journal 327 crank in a 283 block, but it will have to be a 1967 283 block. The bottoms of the bores will hit the counterweights on any other 283's. And no, you can't clearance the bottom of the bores, you'll get in the water jacket at the bottom of the cyls. The 1967 283 block is already clearanced at the bore bottoms.

 

First things first.

Throw that tunnel ram in the garbage where it belongs.

Go to Ebay and find yourself a Holley 750 and an Edelbrock Performer Air Gap for the Vortec heads you can pick up for $100 at the local junkyard.

Have the heads machined for a nice hydraulic roller or flat tappet cam, throw on a quality set of 1 3/4 headers, a tire and the right gears and you should be good for some low 12, high 11 second passes once you have everything dialed in.

Form follows function, brother, any hot rodder worth his salt would have killed for this technology in 1965.

Good luck with whatever you decide, that '57 is going to be cool no matter what, they always are.


Tom

 

But then aren't you just building the 307 that nobody loves?


Tom

 

I was just responding to the posts that were saying..just drop a 327 crank in. You don't just drop it in. Yes it would be a 307, but small journal. 307's were large journal. I would build the 355 myself. It would stomp a 283 or 292 every time.

 

Being a litle harsh here eh? Form follows function? Why not tell the kid to go with electronic fuel injection and a turbo? I think if you are hanging around this board you can appreciate a fellow trying to keep true to a desired period.

I'm sure he can tune what he has into the 11's. If it ain't there it could be easily. Tunnel ram may not be for you, and you may be able to go faster with a single carb, but I trust he cold keep the cool facotor and still make the number.

I really like the idea of an old blower and a mag ignition. The fenderwell's are awesome. Tilt frnt end is there already. I like this kid's vison. I personally would like to see the early 327 be his choice, but then I've got an 65 Malibu SS with an L79.

 

seriously, did you read the whole thread? the reason for his wanting the 283 is for nostalga purposes, so you tell him to buy an ugly airgap manifold and some ugly modern junkyard heads......

 

now what rpm range is a tunnel ram good for? i know it performs best during top end but is top end 5000-7000 rpm ? or 7000-9000 rpm? my ISKY is rated for 2500-6800rpms and calls for 850 cfm. So i was under the impression that my tunnelram and 900 cfm's would be alright if i tuned the jets down a little bit?

 

Holy posers, Batman!

What this kid is running now is cannon fodder for a V6 Accord.

That's hot rodding?

C'mon, boys, the soul of hot rodding is fast for cheap. It was about keeping up with a Deusenberg in your junkyard Ford V8. There is no arguing this point.

Yet, I just told this young man how to hang with a new Ferrari off a light and you are bashing me.

Why?


Tom

 

I actually just looked on summit for basically the same tunnel ram iand it says basic operation range is 2,800-7,000? which matches my camshaft fairly well ( and my tunnel ram is and edelbrock from the 60's so that range my vary a little bit. and then 1,500-6,500 is for the victor air gap? so why is the air gap a better choice? btt

 

I guess I am kinda confused as to what you want. Do you want a streetable engine with good low and midrange torque? or do you want something that starts running at 3,000 and up and you don't really care about driveability? Lippy

 

Is your tilt steel or glass? I'd like to see more photos of your build, especially how you fabricated the hinges for your tilt. I am not an expert but the Air-gap has more torque in the lower RPM range, better for the street and a heavy car. However tunnel ram loves high rpm and a lot of gear.

 

well i mean i want something that gives a surprisingly good run at the strip. i mean. i have driven the car with the 3.08s and the current setup and its does me fine. but it is a little bit of a dog off the line. but i didnt know if the 283 would be to big of a drop off for torque to have to rev the hell out of it to get it off the line.

 

my tilt nose is fiberglass! if i swap to steel it will be a tilt nose also. uhm im not able to get any detailed pictures of the hardware now cuz im at college but within the next week or so i may be able to snap some pics.

however i can tell you that my tilt nose pivots on the 2 front bumper bolt holes on the frame rails. the hardware mounts to the "hood" in 4 places only and has a bar connecting the 2 vertical bars to keep it stable. the way i keep it from tilting it all the way forward u can see from the picture of my motor. from my radiator support i have 2 caribeaners with cables going the the tilt nose hardward. like i said i will snap some pics asap or i will even draw you it in the mean time for a basic idea

thanks for your support! loving the feedback! keep going im learning from all of it! also i appreciate the interaction afterwards!

 

It's not good for anything but a paper weight unless you plan on making 2,000 HP

Dude, you need to get these 9,000 RPM thoughts out of your head unless you want to buy a Honda. Get rid of that tunnel ram unless you want to lose to a Honda.

This is a proven combination I have given you.

I will personally guarantee that motor makes 400+HP in a good state of tune for less than $2,000 total investment.

These guys telling you to build a $10,000 supercharged 283 with a magneto?

I think they have lost touch with their roots.

Tom

 

I will personally guarantee that motor makes 400+HP in a good state of tune for less than $2,000 total investment.

These guys telling you to build a $10,000 supercharged 283 with a magneto?

I think they have lost touch with their roots.

Tom[/QUOTE]

i would personally like to keep my 327 heads for a nostalgia factor. perhaps port polish and grind over to 2.02. i know its more expensive but its the price to pay for looks and bragging rights. and it will take alot for me to do it but maybe take the tunnel ram setup off. ive got an old 750 holley and strip dominator i could put on the car but i think a part of me may die off

i like the idea for the future of a blown 283 but your right its definitely not the budget build or the exact topic of this thread

 

GO 283!!!! I am running a 283 bored .030 over with 1.94" camel humps and a mild cam (lost the fucking cam card and cant remember the duration and lift!!) I have a Holley 650 and an Accell super stock ignition on it connected to a Powerglide with 3.55 gears in back. It goes like a bat out of hell!! I love the quick rev the 283 gives you. Currently I only have headers on it with thrush turbos on them and it is one throaty sonofabitch!! The best part of my week is getting behind the wheel and giving that 283 a nice foot massage!! MMMM MMMM Nuthin better!!I am thinking about putting Hilborne mechanical injection set up on it any suggestions?


ASS,GAS or GRASS NOBODY RIDES FOR FREE!!

 

Stock motor of your choice + supercharger makes 400+ hp AND twice the torque down low = faster acceleration.

I would like to understand what direction you are leaning. Sure you can use modern equipment like vortec heads and that giant tach you've got OR you can stick with a rule of no technology newer than 1965. You'll need to man up and take some control of this thread and tell each side of this fence where you stand.

If the goal is to simply reach a certain ET, then there are some very established engine combinations.

I may be a little hung up on the blower because I think it would be so cool looking and I love the way blower cars make use of mild rear gears. I am certain we can hit that 400 mark with the combination you have. I suspect you need to do some carb tuning, as the idle circuits probably have not been restricted down. Really, once you decide on a path to take, you should start another thread. Heck you could even start a thread just on maximizing what you've got. Biggest draw back I see for the current combination are those mild gears.

 

Listen, man, get rid of that intake it's a joke. Fuck that old Holley manifold as well, take advantage of technology to make your ride FAST.

Period correct cars are for shows, dude, real hot rods are fast.

That's what they were meant to be.


Tom

 

EDIT - Being an A hole.

Sorry.

Just dump that manifold, man, that shit got played out in the darkest of the dark time of automobiles,the Pro Street days.

Be fast or go home.


Tom