235 oil filter placement with Fenton Intake??

Hey Guys, I just got my new fully rebuilt 235 into my brother-in laws garage for its long winter nap waiting for the Spring to live again. But I need to buy, and modify a few parts, it is going into my 50 Chevy-replacing a knocking 216, and I have a question or 2.....I need to buy a oil filter for the motor, probably from ebay, and I'm trying to figure out how to mount it. I am going to run a Fenton intake/header on the car, and the filter usually mounts to the intake, but unlike the Offy intake the Fenton does not have any bosses welded on the side. I am thinking that I can just mount it to the inner fender, or vent tubes coming from the core support. Any cool ideas or solutions would be great, pics would be helpful if available. Thanks again!!

 

I'mpretty sure the oil filter housing was held onm by small U-bolts...like muffler clamp size, on my stock 235 intake...been year since I sold the engine, but I don't recall a boss on the stock intake either?

 

i just checked my 235 it has u bolts too my 261 does too.

now you could mount the filter on the fire wall or the frame. but you will have to use BRAEDED STEEL LINES. if not the oil lines will crack.

 

I didn't like the way the filter worked (or didn't work) so I converted to a full filter system using a remote I had laying around in the garage. By making the mount this way, it's still connected to the motor, so it moves with it making it possible to use hard lines if you want to. This is during mock up, I didn't use these manifolds.

 

Beautiful work, but the motor is already built, and I would rather not pull it apart to change over the filtration. Is there any better way than u-bolts to do this??? I already have brand new rubber lines, and would like to keep this as nice as possible. Also any good sources for the oil filter system (canister) I looked on ebay and found really expensive junk, and want more choices if possible. Thanks again!

 

Yeah, I understand that you want to keep the stock setup, but I figured you could still make a mount like that with a bolt pattern to fit your old filter if you don't want to attach it to the manifold. This way, it's still attached to the motor so there's less stress on the lines.
As far as the full filter setup goes, you can do it in the car if you have the fender off, and if you're careful, that's what I did.
And thanks for the compliments guys, I was going to try to hide the filter in the old one somehow, but figured I was going a little overboard, and could better spend that time working on something else.

 

I got a repop Heildebrand filter that was made for a screw on type oil filter. Pull the top and the filter is screwed into the top. I used rubber lines as the filter is just a byp***. You may be able to find the repop Bee Hive to do the same thing.
Dom

 

Do you not have a stock style cannister that holds the element/cartridge? Or am I misunderstanding you?

Anyways, if you need on (stock style), and it being close to Christmas, I'll send you one for the shipping charges.

 

Dom, the car looks awesome. Is your filtration pressurized?? I got my spindles back for Buffalo, had the front suspension powder coated, and it's back together. Posies superslides for the rear. Real nice stance, maybe finish wiring and have it on the road by Spring. The cold spell, and no heat in the garage has slowed progress. Roddinron do you have a remote oil pump to push oil through the filter. Is there much to pressurizing

 

Yes I need the stock style cannister, and I appreciate the gift, I am collecting parts to do the 216/235 swap and the 216 did not have a oil filter of any sort. I have a Fenton intake with 2 matchd carbs, Fenton header and the motor is completely rebuilt full oiler. I got the motor for a song from a reputable machine shop that was trying to recoup their losses on the motor, the customer skipped out at the last minute. I am trying to make a nice driver out of the car, and trying to make this motor sing-so I have the Winter to pick up needed parts and chrome. So I need t o figure out whats missing, and what I still need for the swap. Thanks again, and if possible pics of a u-bolt setup would be great!!

 

Hey 51, the filter is a byp***. It's not full flow, meaning it just filters a small amount of oil. My motor is a 54 so it is a high pressure engine. Since it's rebuild I see a good 30 lbs of oil pressure. Sounds like Buffalos' parts will have you busy this winter. As it should be!
Dom

 

Roddinron, looks to me like the only thing you gained was the style of filter. Was that what you were after? Everyhting I have seen says the old style filter is as good or better filtering particles as the newer spin on.

 

If all he picked up was just the ease of changing the filter, he did good, no more cleaning the bottom of the canister fthe parts on hand!rom sludge, etc.


Only thing I didn't see in his pic, is an external line run up and over t the top of the head to distribte extra oil to the rockers....something that GM added as "factory" later in the 50's or early 60's IIRC, and is a definite uprade that should be done.

But the price of a spin on filter vs. the "drop-ins" is worth it, especially if you have the parts on hand.

 

I dont think GM added that line - it was a common thing to "repair" oiling difficulties to the rockers caused by the dusty conditions of the times. There was a plug in that hole from the factory

 

I dunno...My '59 I haed, was redone/rebuilt inn '61 (for waht I don;t know) and ha the line frm the filter area up to the rear of the head...heard from someone, that it became standard in the late '50's, or early 60's, but all onjecture on my part, but...still a good/correct upgrade to do.

 

If you study the way the original system works, you'll see that it really filters very little oil, actually all the stock filter does it take a small percentage of "byp***" oil that "bleeds off" from the galley, filter it and return it directly to the crankcase, where it is mixed with dirty oil, most of the oil never goes through the filter. When you start the engine, the oil is pumped directly through the engine straight out of the crankcase, any oil that bleeds off the galley enters the filter and drains back to the crank.
I plugged the oil galley, drilled the side of the block into the galley just before the plug, so the oil is forced through the filter, then back into the galley where the old line used to go to the filter. That way, my engine receives 100% filtered oil.
This wasn't my idea, it's done a lot, and GM even finally figured it out and did it to the later engines. My gauge is showing over 40lbs pressure of clean, filtered oil.
I'm old enough to remember when an engine was worn out at 60,000 miles, it wasn't that they were bad engines, it was that they were poorly lubed. I really can't see why a 235 can't go 250,000 miles or more with this setup and the better oils we have available today (though that opens another can of worms).
One more thing, oil used to be non detergent, it allowed the dirt to settle out of it, that's why you'd see so much sludge in old engines. Detergent oil suspends the dirt so that it can be carried to the filter and filtered out. If you are using detergent oil and not using a full filter system, the dirt remains suspended in the oil causing more wear to your engine.

 

The byp*** filters were introduced when detergent oil became available.
They do a very good job trapping even the smallest particles of the entire oil in just a few minutes.
Full flow filters can not be too fine, so they don't lose pressure.

A combination of both type filters is used by big rigs these days.
The full flow filter protects the main moving parts of the engine from larger particles and the byp*** filter keeps the oil clean and extends oil drain intervals.


Interesting side note: Todays Wix/Napa Gold full flow filters are more efficient with a lower nominal particle rating, than standard byp*** canister filters still available today.... haha
However there are also byp*** filters available that have an extremely low nominal micron rating.


The additional oil line was installed originally when later heads and rockers were used on earlier blocks to allow more oil to the top.
Later blocks had a larger metering orifice to the top and later rockers were redesigned to retain the increased oil and pressure.

Sometimes with an old and plugged up engine that didn't pump enough oil to the top any more, this additional line was installed as a fix.

 

Once I forgot to tighten the lid on a stock byp*** filter and soon learned how quickly it will drain a crankcase. Full flow filtering is not always true as oil is let by any time the differential pressure is enough to move the spring which on some filters can be nearly always. I run an Amsoil byp*** filter on my 235 with an efficiency rating of 98.7% @ 2 microns and don’t believe a conversion will make an improvement.

 

My wife mounted hers on the firewall. It was a stock cannister type filter. She had to extend the oil lines though

 

I am vaguely familiar with how the 235 oil flows. The reason I made the comment about your filter was for a few reasons: there are a lot of people who confuse "full flow" with "full pressure". the second thing is that from the pictures it looks like you have pretty small lines to the filter. Maybe the picture is deceptive. With that small of line I thought that it probably wasnt plugged at the vertical channel and they were the same size as the stock filter lines. The third thing is that I cant tell from the picture, but I dont know the angle or the size of the front fitting - it doesnt look angled to me and most of the full flow conversions I have seen are.. so, not pingin' you, just saying how it appeared to me.

Regarding the filtration, it has been beat up over and over again how effective or ineffective the oil byp*** filters are. Nobody is gonna win that argument. I happen to be in the camp that says the old byp*** aint too bad. I wont get into an age thing with you either, but I am old enough to have driven my 235 over 160,000 miles with the byp***. it worked fine and is doing fine as a rebuilt with the beehive byp*** on it too (253,000 on it now). Maybe I am lucky, I doubt that - I have never won the lottery

 

Hmmmmm, well, so maybe I'm wrong. But I still don't think so, I just can't imagine that taking SOME of the oil and filtering it, then dumping it back into the crankcase to mix with dirty oil, then sending that mix back around so that only SOME of it get's filtered only to be mixed with dirty oil again, etc. etc. etc. is better than sending ALL the oil through the filter before it goes to the engine. Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems that if GM changed to the full filter system there must have been a reason. Anyway, here's what I did-
http://www.webrodder.com/article.php?AID=398&SID=4&CID=15

 

I never said byp*** on a 235 is better (or worse) than full flow. I said that argument has been going on forever and in my opinion with the way the oil flows, the byp*** aint bad for daily use on the street in this millenium. if you want to make it a bigger argument than it is, I quit, you win.

I recognize the webrodder 235 - its mine

 

I wouldn't spend a nickle on converting, if I didn't have a filter in hand.

If I had an old style filter, for look, I'd hang it on the intake with U bolts like it's been done since Christ was a Corporal.

Even in dirt racing, we didn't screw with filters, we changed the oil more often. With a good AIR filter, the motor don't pick up contaminates that find the oil. Acid, oil breakdown, and combustion by-products are the enemy, and filters don't take enough of those out to matter anyhow. Change the oil on a frequent basis and the filter if you have one, and .......go!

 

roddiniron. If you haven't ran that motor yet, I would like for you to consider this;
In the picture, it appears to me that, even if you have made internal mods to direct full flow oil to your contraption, the lines are too small to carry enough volume for the motor. The oil flow to the essentials will be restricted. In my mind, the minimum INSIDE DIAMETER of the hoses, along with all portals to and from, would need to be approcimately 3/4 inch, absolute minimum 5/8 might do it.

 

any problem with removing the partial flow filter and plugging the lines?

I did on mine just for initial tune after swapping to the 2x1 intake and Fenton headers,
I've only run it for a few minutes and will be driving it to the muffler shop for dual exhaust this morning...

unless I'm missing something here,
my thought is that I'm eliminating the byp***,
the motor will still be getting full pressure... too much, not enough, no change?

 

Paul; You are okay. They came from dealership plugged when the filter was 'optional equipment', I think you might have had to pay $10 to have a filter added.

I like the edmunds setup.

 

Ok I wil leave well enough alone, I really didnt wanna start messing with a fully built block anyhow!!!! But I am now curious about the external oil line added on the head, the line inside the side cover is new, and I would like to keep this motor running like a champ...so any info or pics of the external head oiling line would be helpful. Thanks again for all the info & advice guys!!!!

 

I'm very bad at putting things down with a key board sometimes, I didn't mean to seem like I'm "arguing" with you. I'm just saying this "seems" better to me, and started out by saying "maybe I'm wrong" you sure have given me a lot to think about.

 

OK, no problem. everything is all good. a misunderstanding on my part.

I used to be convinced a full flow was better too. there was raging debate on this somewhere - maybe over on inliners - and the more i thought about it I came to the conclusion that they are just different ways to get the same thing. I'll look for the thread - it is really interesting