I'm in the process of restoring a 1960 El Camino. I just recently had the large bed panel sandblaster and luckily there are no rust-thru holes on it (which is rare)....however majority of the metal is pitted. I had the option of just spraying it with bedliner but I'm trying to do this job right and add value to the car in the end and I know the shoppers with big pockets are going to prefer a restored bed versus the cheap look of a bedliner..I just don't think it fits on a 60 Elco. So after doing some research and talking to some folks it seems like the thing to do is just lightly skim the entire panel with a very thin layer of bondo and then sand it down so all the pits are filled. Is there any other way around this? I don't mind doing the extra work if thats is needed but just curious if there is a better way? Thanks in advance fellas!
There is a product available called Feather Fill. It is a liquid plastic filler that a catalyst is added to just before application. Apply with an old primer gun and clean up immediately or the gun will be junk. Comes in quarts, not sure about gallons. Any body supply should have it. After blasting to "near white" finish, your will need to apply metal converting primer like Veriprime by duPont, also catalyzed, before the feather fill. The feather fill will need to be sealed before final paint. Have fun sanding all that. SAND - that's one of those 4 letter words. Carefull not to warp panels while plasting.
Sometimes your just stuck with good old fashioned hard work. Pitting is becoming more common with older iron. I personally don't know of any other way to smooth it out. Like you said, skim with thin coat of filler, prime and paint. I agree, paint looks like you took the time to do it right. I hate bedliner in an older vehicle. That's the easy way out. You'll be happy with the results if you paint it nice. And your potential buyers will see you put forth the extra effort too. JMO. Lippy
I agree with lippy, Prep it well--clean all rust, and fill...also make sure you have plenty of elbow grease, send some pics if u can.
Cool sounds good. I guess I'm gonna have to fabricate some sort of long piece to sand in the grooves but that shouldn't be too hard.
Well that takes care of that.. cos' I've been wondering whether I should spray a bedliner coating on the floor of my '59 Elco. I'm not selling mine, but what's right.. is right!
Hows the condition of your bed? I think I hit the lottery with mine altho I really wish they made replacement panels.
Another vote for FeatherFil G2. Thats going to be a lot easier than ******ing about with bondo. Altho I'd lay down some epoxy first instead of Yellow Death (as Variprime is known in the aviation industry). PPG DPLF, then the FeatheFil, then reduced DPLF as a sealer... (or one of the dedicatd sealers).
Hey, You're going to want the extra protection of an epoxy primer over your bare steel as there may be some rust( not visable to the human eye ) that will soon start rusting beneith the finish. You can slime coat the deeper pits or fill them with high build primer and then seal the job prior to top coating, but it's tough to save time sanding and prepping a pick up bed. " Humpty Dumpty was pushed "
The only thing I would be concerned with using a bondo type of filler, even though this should really be a small amount of filler anyway, only down in the pitts... would be the fact that the bondo is soft and if anything is placed in the bed, there could be a chance of hitting a softer spot causing an issue. Of course, that would probably scratch the pain in the bed first, which is probably something you are planning to acoid anyway, so it really should nto be an issue at all. Another filler option could be led fill maybe. But I am really not sure if that is any less soft than bondo being led which is a soft metal. What about using a fibergl*** resin to fill the pits and then sanding that down flush with the good metal? That stuff seems to be harder than the bondo fillers. For the work involved, I'd say the bondo or that other filler might be the best bet if you are not planing to throw stuff in the bed.
Therer's also the issue that acid etch such as VariPrime affects bondo from kicking off leading to early failure. As FeatherFil is pretty much just 'sprayable bondo" the same issue is likely.
...and I'll chime in with my .02 cents. I agree with priming the bed FIRST with epoxy primer. I have yet to see anything stickier or tougher than epoxy primer. That should seal the bare metal. Also, instead of using plastic body filler I might suggest using something like All Metal which is a partially plastic filler with, I believe, aluminum shavings added to it. The advantage is that the filler is much harder that typical fillers like Rage, Featherfill, et al. The disadvantage is that it is much harder and more difficult to sand. Use it sparingly so you don't have tons of work sanding it down. Good luck!
the only proper way to do it is high build primer. any type of superbondo with various flakes or strands of something is never a good way to do anything. prime with whatever it says on the can, I used it over the bare metal last time , but it seems like everytime I spray paint the paint formula has changed and the instructions are different.. this stuff goes on in 3 wet coats. problem is it will clog up your gun in a big hurry so you need to give it a cleaning between. I poured some in a paper cup to empty my gun once and the next day the paint in the cup was hard as a rock, I had to smack it with a hammer a couple of times to get it to break. it will definitly ruin your gun of you let it sit. <TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=605><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width=220 align=middle></TD><TD cl***=black9 vAlign=top width=560>FeatherFill® G2 A high-build, high-solids Premium Polyester Primer Surfacer that is compliant with California and National Rule VOC regulations. It has been specifically developed to work with 1K and 2K etch primers, while offering exceptional flow and leveling. Other features include smooth spraying, easy sanding, fast dry-to-sand time and a shrink-resistant formula. <TABLE style="BORDER-BOTTOM: black 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: black 1px solid; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; BORDER-TOP: black 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: black 1px solid" id=tblProductInfo border=1 rules=all cellSpacing=0 borderColor=black cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #eeeeee"><TD cl***=bold8 align=middle>CATALOG NO.</TD><TD id=tcColorDisplay cl***=bold8 align=middle>COLOR</TD><TD cl***=bold8 align=middle>SIZE</TD><TD cl***=bold8 align=middle>UNITS/CASE</TD><TD cl***=bold8 align=middle>WT./CASE</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>710</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Buff</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Quart</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>6</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>19 lbs</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>711</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Buff</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Gallon</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>4</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>48 lbs</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>712</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Gray</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Quart</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>6</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>19 lbs</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>713</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Gray</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Gallon</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>4</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>48 lbs</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>714</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Black</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Quart</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>6</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>19 lbs</TD></TR><TR><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>715</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Black</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>Gallon</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>4</TD><TD cl***=black8 align=middle>48 lbs</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <TABLE style="BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none; BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: none; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; BORDER-TOP-STYLE: none; HEIGHT: 20px; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none" id=prodLinks border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5><TBODY><TR id=trMSDS><TD cl***=bold8 colSpan=3 align=middle><NOBR>MSDS <SELECT id=ddlMSDS cl***=black8 name=ddlMSDS> <OPTION selected value="100636 Liquid Activator 10-4-07.pdf">100636 Liquid Activator 10-4-07.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100710 Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf">100710 Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100710cf Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf">100710cf Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100711 Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf">100711 Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100711cf Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf">100711cf Feather Fill G2 Buff 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100712 Feather Fill G2 10-01-08.pdf">100712 Feather Fill G2 10-01-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100712cf Feather Fill G2 Gray 10-01-08.pdf">100712cf Feather Fill G2 Gray 10-01-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100713 Feather Fill G2 10-01-08.pdf">100713 Feather Fill G2 10-01-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100713cf Feather Fill G2 Gray 10-01-08.pdf">100713cf Feather Fill G2 Gray 10-01-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100714 Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf">100714 Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100714cf Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf">100714cf Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100715 Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf">100715 Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION> <OPTION value="100715cf Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf">100715cf Feather Fill G2 Black 10-08-08.pdf</OPTION></SELECT> View</NOBR></TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>Info Sales Flyer Tech Tips</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Is POR15 not an option? I've used it before on lightly pitted metal with great results. You do have to paint over it, as it will discolor from the sun, but otherwise, I've had great results.
my .02 cents because it is pitted it will be really hard to get into the pits with sandpaper, a wire wheel will work but still its those deep pits are the ones that will come back and bite you later, so like lippy said, its gonna take hard work to clean it out, I highly recommend using phosphoric acid (Ospho) on it as a 1st step to get into the deep pits. the liquid will get into it deep,,,Then you can use a wire wheel to clean it (following drying time instructions), what the acid does is it coats the metal with a zinc phosphate and neutralizes the rust, so the rust you can't get to, will be neutralized and wont come back later. I use it all the time and have had good success. Ospho Writeup
Here's a trick that Mr Roth told me when I was in Junior High. If you are only pitted and don't want to replace the metal you need to seal it up, if you don't it will continue to rust. Bondo is porous and will not seal it and the paint will not do as good a job as you might think. Ever see a car with the paint bubbling? Take some fiber gl*** resin like you were going to gl*** it except you will not be using the cloth. Make sure the metal is clean you have already done that. Now take a brush and paint the pitted area with the resin. Let it set up. Give it a quick roughing up and now you can bindo over the top of it. Look underneath if it is also pitted under there paint that with resin also. Remember even though you are planning to peddle this car and make a buck you need to treat it like it is your own car and you are not going to peddle it ever. That way when you peddle it you are selling quality. Your reputation is all you have, guard it with you life.
evercoat FAQ: http://evercoat.com/faq.aspx evercoat featherfill G2: (OK over etch primer and good bang for the buck) http://www.evercoat.com/productDetail.aspx?pID=171 If you use epoxy primer, most tech sheets will tell you to apply to clean and free from oil, dirt, and rust, bare metal. Then which epoxy will give you the best protection? DP epoxies are typically less than .5 mil per coat which is not enough protection, and lay a wet rag on DP primer and see how moisture proof it is after a couple hours. There are other epoxy primers with better film build and moisture protection. My favorite system for bare sandblasted steel is: 1) After sandblasting, reduce the blast profile by sanding with 180# (DA). 2) Solvent wipe thouroughly to clean the surface. 3) Use a mild etch primer or a vinyl wash etch primer to convert any remaining rust in the metal pits to iron phosphate, followed (wet on wet per manuf directions) by 2 to 3 coats of high build urethane primer. This is easier than using metal conditioner/acid to clean the remaining rust before epoxy primer, and this system should fill between .030 and .040 deep pits in the metal, also depending on which high build primer system you use. some good primer threads: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=443506&highlight=etch+primer&showall=1 http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=429425&highlight=etch+primer http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=297587&showall=1 http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=381410&highlight=etch+primer&showall=1 Metal conditioner: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=396570&highlight=etch+primer Lots of reading but good info and discussion on all types and brands of primers and metal preps. overspray
Has anyone dealt with this company before? If so any feedback? I'm thinking with all the different steps I'm going to have to do in terms of prepping and sealing that it will probably be cheaper to buy one of there beds. Any thoughts?
POR 15 works great for pinholes and it loves rust or metal that was rusted! I've used it with excellent results!
Take a look at master sieries primer, it can be applied over rust, or a prepped surface and is made to fill pits. It should fill most heavy metal pitting with three coats and since it is primer it can be painted over with any paint. The website is <CITE>masterseriescoatings.com.</CITE>
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