Inspired by Ed Roth, Plowboy and Racerdad

Slider! Ah, you know me too well! What's a project that doesn't push your skill set beyond your comfort zone, boring!
What's a project that is just beyond your current skill set? It's called 'Belairo'! LOL Sad but true ... one of these days I will be ready to finish that car ...

Exwestracer, yes, we are on the same page to a large extent! I do believe the rear section can be attached underneath the very back end and the hardware accessable from underneath via a drop-down frame. The front of the turtledeck, beyond the already installed gas tank, may also be reachable from underneath. It's the no-man's land in between that I think may be a problem. I'm really not sure how much of an issue it will be?! I'll know more as I define the torque box support system for the deck lid, that will determine exactly where the forward turtledeck mounts have to locate. Once they are located, the turtledeck attachpoints may become 'plain as the nose on your face'!
I just felt I should reveal some of the concerns you have to be aware of, when you are doing extreme modifications to a body, such as I am here. You have to remember that there is a limit to how narrow you can make a turtledeck, and it is determined by the support system the turtledeck houses. If you build the absolutely most beautiful/slickest design out there, but there is no room for a gas tank, you have failed! If you have no way to attach those wonderful new bodypanels, again dooh!

I am fast running out of room with this car. The battery will have to go behind the seat on one side. There will need to be an auxillery fuel-cell behind the other seat. The second fuel-cell is going to be for a high pressure alcohol injection system to prevent predetonation. It'll be triggered by the EGT's,and only kick in when it's needed, (hard excelleration etc). This was called an 'Ultra Hi Compression' engine, and at 10.2 to one compression it doesn't like our modern day pumpgas without octane booster.

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Dan, have a look at the battery for a Honda Civic from the mid 90s. Only 5" wide. I had the same issues on an O/T project and ended up stacking 2 of them one on top of the other in an insulated rack.

 

I don't get how you'll transition from the body tub/****pit to the narrow rear deck? Maybe I missed something, but I don't see what's going to happen there...

Brian

 

Abruptly.

I think the back wheels will cover that area - like a T roadster maybe.

 

A big wheelwell like some '60's style g***ers? Hmmm, I dunno seems a little clumsy. I'd like to see some sketches or something about what the end result is gonna be.

Brian

 

Ah, Flynbrian I'm afraid my brother inherited all of the talent for drawing pictures in our family! I do wish I could accomodate your request, but I believe that too is beyond my reach.

As to how the back panel will look? If the turtle deck were removed the backpanel's body lines, with all of the reverse curves that entails, continue around the corner that I have cut in the ****pit 'rail'. I was thinking about what to do in the area behind the turtledeck, where the turtledeck ****s up against the backpanel? For safety sake, I think I need a 'firewall' there too (that area between the two curved corners would be flat maybe with some beading for strength/ridgid***y). Afterall the turtledeck will only have room to house a gas tank and little if anything else. If there was ever an accident (hit from behind) I'm sure I would want any loose fuel to be contained and not endup with a shower and possibly flamable exit! So, the turtledeck forward edge would be cut to match the rather curvy backpanel at that line of interface on each side. I'm also thinking an inner flange sticking out @90 degrees from the backpanel toward the rear of the car would act as a permanent set of guide flanges on the inside of the turtledeck's mating surface. I wouldn't use them for attach flanges, more as body sheetmetal guides that hold the turtledeck width distance to the right amount. Those same curvey bits would probably be made of sheetmetal bent @ 90 degrees, or cut and welded @ 90 with the curves included in their construction. I'd only need them to be a very short 1 1/2" leg each way and could easily attach them on the rear/outter side of the backpanel. That would hold my width. A secondary set of attachment angles, that have a joggle to clear the guide flanges and allow 4 bolts to be installed to draw the turtledeck up tight to the backpanel from inside the ****pit area, would finish the attachment (at least to the backpanel).
With an additional two bolts from underneath (somewhere under the backpanel/turtledeck line and through the floor) would hold that end. The other end could be secured onto the frame section that has to go down behind the rear axle. There is kind of a nice box section inside of the turtledeck that should be more than adequat to bolt to.

Thanks for voicing your concerns, it forces me to think about some of the attachment details and get some parameters down on paper. These notes may continue to evolve as I have time to build more parts and pieces and actually see how everything has to go together.
If I had to have all of these answers before getting started, I'd never cut another car! It would be too much for me. This way, designing as I go with a fairly concrete picture of the finished product lets me proceed along a clearly defined path, filling in the details as I go.

Al mentioned that the MGB's? (maybe another engllish sports car?) had twin 6 volt batteries to accomodate their lack of room and they two were behind the seats. I don't know if they were stacked or not?

There was also mention of what was going to occur around the rear wheel? My perspective is that it will be fenderless, and the rear axle will be far enough back to not have any affect on the curvey rear corners of the ****pit. If at some time in the future it becomes appearant that fenders are now required, they would be form fitting cycle type fenders attached to the backing plates and riding close to the tires themselves. However for now it will be fenderless.
If the axle proves to be too close to those same wild and curvey corners of the backpanel, I will simply build the backpanel corners as I have outlined here, and if there is an issue of the tire being too close or some other concern, I will cutout an arcing path and install a section of cycle-type fender into the backpanel corner as needed.

I think I have addressed all of the issues you have brought up as a group. If I have missed anyone, or if any other concerns surface please speak up! I don't have all of the answers and I'm enjoying the input/various experiences from all of you.

Got stuff to do!
Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Just keep doing what you're doing.... Really enjoying your build!

 

not that I'm complaining but when you post I picture a butler telling the story. I love where you are going with this!

 

I'm liking this one. I also like solving the problems as they crop up. On a project of this sort you can only preplan so much and then you just have to dive in a go for it. The challenge is when you find yourself painted into a corner (and that can happen no matter how much preplannng you do) you have an escape route. Keep the progress coming.

Frank

 

Dan, if you're keeping the cove where the original rear bumper wrapped around the body, could you bend up a loop of tubing (1 1/2"?) that would fit in there all the way around and weld it into the rear of the body (imagine a horizontal roll bar tucked in there)? That should give you plenty of strength with almost no loss of space, as well as something to hang mounts,etc. off of... just a thought.

 

Thank you all for your positive comments and your input with optional ideas and ways to get this build done! As I mentioned, I am an enthusiast! When I am able to turn loose in the shop nothing could be better/all is right in the world! Ha

I too enjoy being able to 'think on my feet'. During my years of gainful employment I have run various shops and also singular departments within a wide range of industrial settings. This experience has given me perspective that not everyone has to draw from. I am very fortunate.
That still doesn't mean I can handle any situation that comes along! Occ***ionally I still manage to 'paint myself into a corner'! Ha However I have learned over the years not to panic or over-react when it all hits the fan. A good friend of mine taught me years ago, to take the time to grab a cup of coffee and speculate upon the task at hand before you go diving in! Having good people to help you speculate, discuss options and formulate plans of attack just makes the job come out so much better. I'm not suggesting that your input is how I take my direction in this project or any other. That would be like trying to build by committee and expect an artistic result! That ain't gonna happen!
However I can be influenced/guided by relevant input, that is what makes a good project even better.

About how I write, the way I use my words is something that has developed from years of reading, evaluating what I have read and deciding why certain styles of communication come across so much more clearly than others and adapting those techniques into my own style. Thank you so much for noticing and commenting about such a thing here on the Hamb!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Exwestracer, again we are thinking along the same lines! ha That is one of the options that I will be examining over the next day or two. Unfortunately, there was quite a bit of rust in the lower body. Most of the inner panels are going to be cut out, I'm afraid some of the outer panels have extra ventilation holes in them too! I won't know how much I can save until after those panels get sandblasted, we'll just have to see what's left.

Thanks again for your continued input!
Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

dont CUTL*** but CUT MORE

 

'Olle Cutmore' Ha! I like it!

Yesterday, was an electrical day. Got the 3-phase repaired, which runs the compressor. Without air nothing gets done 'round here, sometimes the same result even when there is air!

Im doing the last couple of notches on my prototype Desoto grille tooth mounting pan, and getting it packed up to ship. Once that's done and out of my hair, I'm thinking I'd better grab the front section of the Cutl***.

Allergies this time of year make sleeping an optional habit this time of year. Getting a slow start is just the way it is ...

The yard hoist will be put to good use getting the front half of the Cutl*** moved into the shop. I went a lot of years knowing I needed to build one of those, before I got too old/less limber, too many light injuries and Had to build one. Do yourself a favor! If you work alone, get or create the equipment you need to handle the weight of the material you have to contend with, before your injuries force you to!
Yes, that was the voice of experience talking ...

Anyway, the reason I'm jumping to the front section? While I was not sleeping last night, I was going over where I am in the process. As I thought through the rapidly approaching final mock up stage, (which will include rolling the ch***is outside) I realized I can't get there from here, without mounting a door to the hinge post as well as the rear doorjamb. Without those components together, I can't place the backpanel and without the packpanel placed, I can't locate the forward edge of the turtledeck! It all kind of rolls downhill from here!

So that will be my task for today, get the front half moved into the shop, (after removing the ch***is from within). Cutting the front half down the middle, so I have two manageable pieces. Get the doorjamb together with a door bolted to it. I'll use the yard hoist again to hang the door/jamb ***embly off of the ch***is. Doing this should allow me some lateral movement as well as elevation adjustments, in and out too! The back panel will be next, and I'm thinking the distance from the top of the rear tire to the top of the 11" wide flat at the top of the quarterpanel will be about 4". I guess we'll see how much use the speculation process has, when confronted with the real world!

I will take pictures! I may not have the energy to post them tonight, that is ***uming that I get that far in this process today.

Have a good one, and we'll talk later!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

looks like a cool project

 

Definitely subscribed! This is a great project and an awesome undertaking. Thanks for posting all of your process and progress!

Ryan

 

Here it is, just after 10PM. In consideration of my neighbors I make it a rule that I don't run the compressor after 10PM. So, I'm done for the night. Whew, it's a good thing, as it has been a long day!

I did get the front quarter sections cut out from the rest of the floor/front uniframe and wheel-well structure. Yes, I did take pictures. I'll post them in the morning, I'm too tired and need to be fresh of body and soul before trying to post pictures.

Things went smoothly, most of the cutting was done with a plasma cutter. I also use a 4-1/2" Makita with 1/16" cutoff wheels and an air hammer with an exhaust cutting chisel. Before I called it a night, I used the yard hoist to pick up the leftovers and moved them outside. Swept up the floor, rolled the ch***is back inside and called it good.

What's coming up next should be very interesting to see. Tomorrow, I'm going to reattach the various pieces of one rocker panel from door hinge post to the rear doorjamb. I will also install a door in the hole, and the new much shorter backpanel which will complete the new configuration for the ****pit. I'll then mock-up that ***embly onto the ch***is and move it around until everything finds a home. Once it's all located, I'm thinking that I should weld some supports to hold it all in place so I can install the new turtledeck. I want to be able to roll the mock-up ***embly outside so I can stand back and get a better view of what it all looks like and then fit on the front sheetmetal.
No, there's no way that I will be able to get all of that done tomorrow, (remember I do have other stuff to do). I am thinking that I can have the entire mock-up ***embled and outside for pictures by the middle of next week! Al and I were talking for a few minutes this evening, looks like I should have the donor MGB here in about the same time frame!
That means the only major question that will remain by next wednesday will be the interface between the MGB windshield and the Cutl*** cowl! If I find any extra time I'll section the decklid so it fits the new opening.

With the mock-up being just one side of the car and the windshield/cowl area still in question I won't be doing the section/narrowing of the hood yet. I will probably start to plan the mounting structure for the body to the ch***is and the bracing required to make it safe.
I was looking at the rocker panels on the Cutl***, they're pretty thin/fair amount of rust. I'll just fabricate a new outer rocker skin, so there's no splicing to deal with. The inner rocker will be replaced by the new tubing structure that will also attach to the ch***is. This will make the entire car stiffer overall and make a penetration barrier out of the rocker panel itself. The original rockerpanel was ... less that it might have been.

It's gettin' late and I need my beauty rest ... we'll talk tomorrow!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Very Cool!

 

Nice project! Look forward to following the build.

 

Good morning! Spring in Idaho can sometimes be very brief. It last snowed in Boise on the 5th of May, this weekend now approaching the 15th we are expecting 80 degrees! Gotta love it! Ha

Should be an absolutely beautiful day today, Big Blue Skys, light breeze if at all, just gorgeous. I'm gonna go grab some coffee and launch the photo software. I'll have pic's up after a couple of cups have managed to soak into my skull!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

I'm on pins and needles.....

Jeff

 

So, late yesterday, I grabbed the yard hoist backed around the shop and got ahold of the Cutl*** front half.


Some times when you have weird pieces to pick up you have to be creative in what you use to rig the pick. Usually I can find a balance point and just use my four chain. Not this time! Having some of those rachet straps for motorcycle tie-downs comes in handy when you have a long reach to do.


Once it was hooked up, it moved very easily.

 

With the front section on the lift, you may notice that the front right corner is kinked up a bit as you face the section. This general weakness in the ch***is is what doomed this car for the last owner and made it just a parts car for me.


When you are preparing to do some major structural cutting, step back, grab a soda and get a plan before you just jump in and start whacking!

Be thinking of what all you can reuse to save yourself some time. I've decided to try to reuse the seat mounts and will cut them out from the floor before discarding the leftovers. I may change my mind later and not use them, but you can bet if I haul this carc*** out, there'll be soomething on it I need! ha

 

When you are cutting out the floor in a unibody, you need to decide what it is you are trying to save. In this case the floor doesn't matter but the inner rocker panel may. So I'll remove as much seam sealer as I can and aim the plasma straight down.


As I already mentioned I'll try to save the seat mounts without getting too carried away with being careful. They were installed with flanges and spot welds, which will have to be removed at a later time and that is only if I really decide to reuse them.


Again, I will use tape to keep me on target and to note which side of the tape to cut on. Going through multiple layers of spot welded material is not a plasma cutter's favorite thing to do. Throw in some tar/asphalt based seam sealer and you are ready to have a really good time! Make sure you have extra consumables for the plasma cutter!

 

The footboard/firewall area is never any fun to cut out. Lots of layers of sheetmetal spotwelded together and seam sealer and rust make it a spark throwin' pain in the ****!


Make sure you always wear safety gl***es and if you are plasma cutting some protective dark lenses and leather gloves, 'cause some of those 'sparks' that get thrown have a bit more metal in them than others!LOL


Since I don't want the front wheel wells but do want the hood hinge mounts. I opted to cut the wheel wells out and leave some rather wimpy sheetmetal that doesn't really get reused, but does provide some data for reattaching the front fenders.
Those odd little braces that are running down to the 'frame-rails' in this picture were the forerunners to todays crumple zones. Yes, they did actually function, sort of, they did transfer front end impact energy to the surrounding structure. This particular car's downfall was that there just wasn't enough surrounding structure to survive even a light inpact. This particular car didn't actually hit another car, just high-sided into a ditch on a slick winter road. This caused a severe kink in the body, made the drivers door drag and it now walked down the road at a slight angle!

 

I am trying to keep the two freshair boxes on the forward side of the hinge posts. Keeping them allows air flow in a non A/C car, and there is a sheetmetal flange that has a gasket seal to the fender that keeps whistling down.


Same thing 'nother view ...

 

With the floor and forward frame-rails/wheel wells cut out, there's not a lot left!


Even less when I cut off the back 10" to retain the seat mounts!


This piece is ready to be hauled out!

 

With the junk going out the door, what have we removed?


Now it's time to see what all of this work has brought us in useable parts!

 

This last picture shows the twin doorhinge/rocker panel ***emblies and the top view of the previously removed backpanel area. It's been a lot of effort for not much metal salvaged. Good thing there's a plan to put it all back together! Sure would be a waste to do all of this and end up with nothing but a pile of s**** metal!


Since I've already outlined what I'm up to next in last night's post, I won't go over it again. I've got a front valance and p***enger side front fender to straighten out for Al this weekend. He's got the fever to go on a road trip at the end of the month. His chopped '54 Ford truck has been ailing and this winter it has had major work done to get it back on the road. The fender and valance are my part in getting him back together and it gets me an MGB to use for parts!
Thanks Al!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Dan this project is great! This is the first I've seen this thread and I can't wait to see the body all put together!