Tony Defeo (author/ AA/FA pilot) posted this on another board, and I thought it was a pretty neat idea. He told me I could post it over here. As much as the whole g***er thing has caught on, especialy here in the midwest I think a cl*** like this would help to keep drawing fans and be fun and affordable to be a part of. _____________________________________________________________ Ok, this is something that has been banging around in my head for years...and I think this my be the right time to possibly kick something like this off. The goal is to create the lowest possible cost nitro cl***...one that will also have m*** fan appeal and be a true compe***ive arena. The outline I've got here is the product of a thousand nights worth of brainstorming. I've got specific reasons for each of these points, but my mind is open to anything that is viable. My main objective however, is to be able to keep the cars initial cost to as close to 20 grand as possible. Body: Regular production American coupe or sedan, m*** produced between 1960 and 1970. Roof, profile of rear quarters, door frame opening and firewall must remain completely stock in every way, shape and form. Wheel well openings can be any size and in any position. NO WINDOWS! This will not only give these cars a unique look that spectators can easily spot, but will allow the cars to make big MPH without taking off like a flying saucer. Suspension and wheels: Car must retain original configuration suspension both front and rear, but components may be relocated to any position on the frame as long as all four wheels remain within the confines of the stock body. Slicks limited to 10.5 inches, rear axle must be regular production and stock width for the body used. Engine and Trans: Engine must be based on a regular production ***embly line unit, stock dimension aluminum block and heads allowed. Engine must be within 10 cubic inches of its original as-produced size. Mechanical stack injectors only. Only other rule concerning engine is that there are no other rules. Run whatcha brung. Transmission must be a conventional 2 or 3 speed automatic. Transmission case must be OEM. Any internal modifications allowed. Back in the day, cars like this were able to run deep in the 8's without tearing themselves apart every run...today, we've got stock suspension doorslammers running down in the 6's on 10.5 wide tires. I would imagine something like outlined here could probably see mid to high 7's while remaining true to the Match Bash spirit. A pack of these thing would steal the show from just about anything...just like they did 45 years ago. OK, let's get some input on this.....
My only other thought was to add some superchargers to this, maybe supercharged cars need to run alky, or/ and a stock type 671 case with non stripped rotors with no overdrive.
I like it, but I would allow tube axles and limit rear suspensions to ladder bars, no 4 links. In todays world even a small block on nitro w/ a good tune up should make 850 900 horses w/o much trouble. In a 2800 lb. car tha would put you in the mid 8's over 155 MPH !!!! That would put one hell of a show on for the spectators. At that E.T. the ch***is requirements would not make a funny car addition to the cage mandatory. That always ruins the looks of a nostalgia car. I don't think you can run a door car w/o a windshield, but they ran that way in the day. Add an on-board fire system and you should be good to go!!! AWSOME
I like the idea especially with adding the superchargers. Why only limit it to 1960-1970 cars? 40's cars would be cool in a cl*** like that remember Fat Jacks '47?!
Thanks for posting that John. Let me hit a couple of points, in no particular order. The reason I think it should be injected nitro only, is because there is no shortage of places to run blown Alky...even the G***ers are blown on Alky. Injected Nitro is a real hit and miss voodoo thing. If you let anything else run in this cl***, the injected cars won't stand a chance just because the science and parts ore on the side of the blown cars. Also, for fan appeal and simplicity, this needs to be known as a Fuel cl***. I chose the body year cut-offs to help give this cl*** it's own distinct look and feel. G***ers are mostly pre '60. Flip Top Funnies are mostly post '70. The original Match Bash era really peaked in '65, so giving a few years on either side of that year keeps it feeling authentic, but gives some leeway and variety. The stock suspension deal, I feel is key to keeping this cl*** affordable. My main objective is to keep the money out. I want the cars to be as brutally simple as possible and as cheap to build as possible. I want the fans to look at these cars and KNOW they could drag that old Belvedere out from behind the barn and build one just like it in their own garage. I would go so far as to include a NAPA suspension clause in the rulebook. If you can't buy it over the counter at NAPA, you can't race it..period! I myself am not in the running to build a car like this. I've got a twin engine Fuel Altered in the works, and that eats up all my extra time and cash, but, I'd be more than willing to help with hands or knowledge anybody who would be interested in putting one of these things together. A cl*** like this would be a blast for all involved as long as the rules remain restrictive enough to not let the guys with the deepest pockets run away with it all. Tony
Not true here in Kalifornia. Can't run blown alcohol anywhere in the SoCal area. We can't even test and tune a nostalgia Alcohol Funny car with out dragging it to Bakersfield. Injected it not a problem.
I was referring to cl***es, not locations. I can appreciate your plight though. Perhaps it's time to get out of the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia.
Killer idea, John. If I might make a suggestion... you'd like to keep this on the low side of $20K, right? Going to be hard to do with engine internals, trans internals, etc. 'formula libre'. With the price of the fuel, this will NOT be a cheap car to run. Period. And the guys who will run 'em will spend $$$ to one-up each other. I'd recommend restricting crankshaft and major engine castings (heads, block) to low-perf. p***enger car stuff (no square port Chev, Max Wedge or Hemi mopar, tunnel port or Boss Ford, etc. If the crank is OE, there's a limit to how far it can be offset ground; kind of takes care of the C.I. limit. Reason: as was said, tuning for this fuel can be 'hit and miss'. So, the investment in $$$ blocks that might get used up will be diminished, and the 'weenie' cylinder heads will tend to keep the horsepower limited. Poor folks can take a chance at blowing up a 283 block, but not a 426 Hemi. I would recommend allowing swapping of parts (283 crank into 327 block; 351W heads on 289 Ford), as long as all pieces were from 'bread and ****er' cars. Also, some rules might be considered about transmissions; if everything inside the transmission case is up for grabs, a guy can spend a lot of $$$ there on lightweight internals. Also, you might consider a few cl***es to help make things more even, such as A/FS (Fuel Sedan), B/FS, C/FS, etc. Maybe a min weight for the ch***is (2500 or 2800 or something) and designate cl***es on a weight break so that you'd group cars together at the 290-310", 350-370", 395-410", and 430+ levels. Still too rich for my blood, but I think it'd be a cool cl*** nonetheless. -Bill
Can't have a Match Bash cl*** with 426 Hemis and SOHC Fords.That would totally kill the cool factor.No superchargers or make them run a differant cl***.A/FX for the injected S/FX for the blown cars just like the old days.I also agree with letting people build using a straight axle.It's cheaper and easier then moving the factory front suspension.No ladder bars or 4 link rears has to be like came from the factory for that body style.
hey I love anything running pop. If I am reading right, I suspect we would see a bunch of big block muscle cars showing up. And as with all these cl***es, you would quickly be priced out by the guys with big pockets. Drop the aluminum block allowance and offer a weight brake for small block cars would be my suggestion. Of course a claimer motor cl*** might level the playing field a bit
Couple questions, although I'm digging it. Stock rear axle in the 8s? By the time you build a strong enough GM axle, you could have had a 9" or a dana. I'd limit it to stock width and mounting points, but any axle. Cheaper and safer. Stock trans case? At least for the glides, it's cheaper to run a good case for 500 p***es than a stock case and a shield, and build every 200 p***es. Engine size limited but mystery inside? Sounds expensive. Like 20K. Those F.A.S.T. guys spend a bunch on stock appearing and sounding engines. I like the claimer deal. Have the price where no one is strapping into a grenade, but isn't spending 5K on the valvetrain either. Ask any cl*** racer about cheating the CI pump. Hillborn has Big Block Chevy, Small Block Chevy, Big Block Mopar, 289/302 Ford, 351 Ford, FE Ford. They have hemis too, but that's going to break the bank. All are ~3K for the intake. Add for pump, lines, and other parts. That means only Ford and Chevy if you limit it to small blocks. Lots of knowledge on running SBC on nitro, not much on Ford. Would end up a sea of Novas.... Moving a stock suspension is going to cost as much as a straight axle. Make it safe, and it should be good. No mention of driver position. Doorslammer should be stock position, along with the firewall to keep design, engineering and cost down. Full safety to include cage, fire system, nitro suit and gear, chute. How to address all the BS that comes with the feds watching nitro?
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