Projects wishbone thru the frame mounting ?

I am locating my wishbones and it has been determined that the mounting points will be through the frame vs under (with a drop mounting point). I have not decided on what to use to mount the wishbones to the frame and need some advice. (heim joint ends or tie rod)

the frame is 2x6 1/8 wall square tubing, I am deciding between heim joint and tie rod ends (which appear to be tapered 7 deg).

If i go with Heim joint then I will weld a tube thru the frame and bolt it on (dont really care for this look and i hear heim joints are noisy). Would prefer to use the tie rod method but the threaded shaft are not long enough to go all the through the frame.

My question: What is the proper way to mount this, drill a hole, weld a short tube (tapered with a 7 deg reamer) and then a larger access hole on the backside of the frame to get a socket over the nut.

How is everyone doing this.??

any pictures?

 

Here is what we did, pins in the back and bones in the front but we went through frame, used heavy wall tube and plated the inside. I also didnt like the look of the Heim joint so we fab'd up some wing covers for front and rear.

 

Here's how I did it, and I know I saw it here before.

Took a big chunk of steel reamed for 7* tie rod endss. Welded it inside some heavy wall tubing that spanned the width of the framerail. They actually came from a '36-'40 wishbone splitting kit which allows for the installation of a later model auto trans, but they would still be pretty easy to make.


Drilled through both sides and welded the tubing in. Can get to the nut on the backside wit ha socket, used a lock washer and regular nut since I wouldn't be able to get a cotter pin in it.

 

It depends on the look hat you are going for. If a majority of your parts are more traditional, tie rods would be the best. They make chromoly heim joints with teflon liners that totally eliminate the noise, and will last a very long time with the limited movment they will have at the end of a wishbone.

I don't have a pic but i did a through the frame mount with tie rod ends and the nut was recessed inside a cup and hidden. The only problem that this will cause is that you can't run a castle nut as there is no access. To solve this problem you snug the tie rod up with a socket and a regular nut, remove the nut and replace with a nylock nut.

 

What they're saying is this...If you rin tie rod ends, you'll need to cut a "window" into the inner frame rail. Make up a flat chunk of steel with the 7 degree taper [reamers sold by speedway motors] and weld it to the inside of the outer frame rail. Whether you want to box in your "window" is up to you.

 

Hey before you get much farther with this, take a minute and go on ElPolackos web sight. www.industrialch***isinc.com. He has come up with a plate that has a 7 degree bung welded in, but has a small amount of angle pressed into the plate. It has a neat shape and mounts tothe out side of the frame rail. Aw hell, just go on his sight and look under '30 model A sedan build - that will explain this better than I ever could. I know he has been talking about marketing these, and I know that the target price is not too expensive.

 

I felt that welding the bung into a sleeve that spanned the width of the framerail, and tying it into the inside frame wall was much stronger. The 1/8" thick steel of only one frame wall itself seemed like it wouldn't hold up to the stress.

 

How thick does the plate with a 7 degre chamfer. I see on speedway it is a 7 degree over 1/2" does it need to be 1/2". not sure how deep the chamfer on the tie rod is?

I do not see the plate on ELP's site

 

here are some pics of elpolacko's mount











hope he doesn't mind me posting them

later jim

 

As always, El Polaco's solution is top notch.

Here is a link to a thread I posted some time ago.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=115715&highlight=teardrop

You can buy the tapered bungs from Speedway. Part 916-36502. My catalog says
$3.00 each.

The only thing that I would do differently is to weld the bung into the tube and angle the tube through the frame.

 

Thanks for the posts Jim and Chip, I don't mind at all. I know I have at least one set on the shelf, maybe two. $60 for a pair sound fair?

 

bib, why would you angle it next time, is it because of the angle of the wishbone to the frame. i would think you want the tie rod perpendicular to the wishbone? and I guess it is not always possible to get the wishbone parrellel to the frame rail

 

There is a lot of range in a Ford tie rod end and I am not concerned with what I have built.

That said, running the tube through the frame at an angle will center up the tie rod stud/pin and give a nicer result.

You will note that the ones El Polacko are designed to compensate for frame pinch and wishbone angle.

One tip. Make sure your socket will fit in the tube you use before you weld.

 

Here's mine: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=290533

 

Nicely done Scotty.

 

Here's how i mount mine i make these through the frame bungs. They just weld through the frame and have a 7 degree tapper on the outside anf hollow on the inside for a socket wrench. I get $30+shipping for a pair.

 

Not really easy to see in these pictures, but I have done the mountings through the frame also.

This was an A pickup we did a few years back. Both the front and rear suspension was attached to the frame with tie rod ends. Also has tubular crossmembers that go all the way through the frame.







You can see the machined bung on the table just behind the tube crossmember here, and where I was thinking of placing it in the second pic.





Also pictures of Glen's Brown Sugar A just as the frame left my shop.

 

I'm gonna have to go hang out in AZ and see if any of that sickness is contagious.

 

The secret is the heat, it makes us crazy as a **** house rat!

 

The hair pin radius rod threaded bung is scary , looks good but not strong may kill some body when it breaks at the weld !!!

 

WTF are you talking about? The SoCal chrome plated hair-pin or something I built?

 

The so cal plated **** , look good at it

 

Steve, those mounts are killer, I am HOPING my bones end up on the frame so I can get some of those frome you!

 

I've looked at SoCal parts for quite a long time. I have used their parts as have thousands here and abroad. NOT ONE mention of the welds breaking.

You are going to have to do better than just level accusations from your armchair quarterback position. Prove it's **** and show your work or go back to the sidelines of the conversation.

 

I think ElP and SoCal know a thing or two about structural integrity and suspension building. Go back in your corner.

 

Since when has tig welding been weak? I am so confused.

 

Whew. Metal Bender you had me going. Straight to the garage. I just looked at the SoCal hairpins on my roadster. 11,000 miles and no sign of failure. Hairpins have been around for a long time. A properly made set should bend before the welds fail.

 

Elpolacko, very nice work, the torque arm design and mount as well as the spring mounts on page one look outstanding, thanks for posting the pics. Is that fire wall to frame mount a one off or are you selling them? very cool also.

 

Those are one off brackets but I could build you a set if you want them. Send me an Email through my website, PM or gimme a call.