School me on brake lines please

A friend and I are going to run the brake lines on my A bone chassis tommorow. I have never bent lines nor flared ends before although my friend has and we have the correct tools. Any tips on making it fun as opposed to a headache?

 

For intricate bends use a coat hanger and make a model before you just start bending. Use anti-sieze on all treads.

 

Most common mistake is to NOT put the flare nut on the tubing BEFORE flaring .... ALSO ..... You need all DOUBLE flares ..... If you are not familiar with doing this find someone WHO IS !!! Brakes are NOT something 'ya wanna' LEARN on .......

jersey Skip

 

this link should help you out. brake lines.

 

I like to clamp the non-moving handle of the bender in a vise. That way the only thing I'm fighting is the tubing. Of course that will depend on the type of bender you have.

The same thing for the flaring tool.

 

Something else to think of when you are making the flares. Don't get carried away and really tighten down the tool and flatten the flare. It needs to be rounded on the edges and if you over tighten it they will split and leak.

 

Make sure the end of the line is flat and square. I clamp the line in the flaring tool so the end is just barely sticking out and run a file over it to make sure the end is flat, then take it out and camfer inside and outside slightly before flaring. It's also a good idea to clean the line out before installing, a shot of brake cleaner then blow it out with air.

 

1. Cheapie double flare sets are worthless. You have to use a good one.
2. A dull wheel on the tubing cutter will work-harden the end of the tube you are flaring, making it more likely to crack. Better to cut with a wheel or a hacksaw, then file the end square, than with a dull wheel on your cutter.

 

Think carefully as to the run. Lines with many bends will be harder to bleed and more likely to suck air in.
Try for a downhill run from the master to the terminus.
As stated, use only quality components.
Attach only to the side of the frame, never the bottom.
Use as many clamps as you can; lines do not like harmonic vibrations, nor do they like supporting their own weight.
Make triply sure there will be no interference with anything.
Make sure there will be no excess heat from the exhaust, either.
If that's your master in the attached pic, use 1/4" line. If using a dual master (highly recommended), use 3/16" for the front two, and 1/4" for the rear run to the splitter. The reason for this is fluid volume.
Make extra special sure the pedal rod will not pull out of the master. Just grab the pedal and yank it up as hard as you can; if it moves, weld in a limiter.
Relay any hydraulic brake light switch. They'll outlast you that way.
Cosmo

 

I think I remember reading a post once that said to slightly heat the end you are going to flare with a torch to remove some of the hardness, making the flare easier to form. Anybody ever done this?

 

Don't forget to put residual valves in the lines. Looks like you have the master cylinder on the frame. If your wheel cylinders are higher than the master they can bleed fluid back to the master cylinder.

 

An original drum brake master cylinder will already have a residual pressure valve built in, so it does not need any extra ones just cos it is mounted under the floor.

 

Not sure I would use that master cylinder it doesn't appear to be a dual circuit one so if you have a small leak somewhere you will lose all your brakes at the same time
Over here and in OZ it is illegal to use single circuit cylinders
Brakes are somewhere it doesn't pay to skimp on safety

 

That's a good question on heating before flaring. Anybody tried it?

 

I actually LOVE bending and flaring lines.
I bought a Snap-on flaring kit when I was 17, and have used the hell out of it. It retailed then for just under $100, and today lists for $113. Worth EVERY penny. I've never cracked a line while making a flare.

The small, little tubing cutters are junk. If there is any play in the wheel at all, you won't get a straight cut.

Double flares are a must. Not singles.
Same with master cylinders--dual chamber, not single. (Been covered a million times here already, so I won't whip that horse anymore)

Agree with squaring off and chamfering the cuts. A cheap set of needle files from the hardware store bargain bin will work nicely. Main thing is to make sure there are no burrs.

I've got a Snap-on 3-die tubing bender. It sucks. It only bends 90 degrees, and the radius is huge!
Though they're very expensive, the Rigid Tools benders do 180-degrees, and the radius is about the same as a quarter. Nice tight bends make the job look SOooooo nice.
On Ebay, there are some 3-in-one benders that seem to have a smaller radius than my Snap-on, and more importantly they make a 180-degree bend. They're less than 10 bucks, and metal, not plastic. Cheap Tiawan tool, I'm sure, but with the same design as that Snap-on I've got, it should make decent bends without kinks. Big thing is the 180-degree bending capability. Not a really tight radius, though.

Get a set of line wrenches. Box wrenches don't cut it. Box wrenches are why the number one tool for working on brake lines is a Vise-Grips. Sears sells a decent set for cheap--four wrenches, for I think $19.99 (Craftsmans!). Their Professional series of fully polished line wrenches is a little more expensive ($29.99, if I remember correctly), but it comes with 5 wrenches instead of four.

NEVER use teflon tape on the fittings. The threads don't make the seal. The seal is made when the flare on the line comes into contact with the little nipple on the inside of the brass fitting. The threads only hold the two pieces together.
If you have a leaking fitting, simply loosen the joint up and retighten it a few times, which will re-seat the flare on the nipple. You should never have to really torque down on the brass fittings to make the leak go away, just loosen/tighten a few times, then snug up the fitting and done.

That Snap-on flare kit has the flare tools and the cutter, in a plastic carry case. Check their website. The cutter shown in that kit is the ONLY cutter I'd ever use, and is a big reason for my flares going well over the years.

The Rigid Benders show up at swap meets and ebay. New, they're around $60 or more--and one bender only does one size. But like I said, 1/4-inch line making a 180-degree bend in the area the size of a quarter makes your lines look like art.

Having the tools I've listed isn't required to get the job done, but it's because of these tools that I always enjoy the job. A lot of guys I know absolutely HATE bending and running lines--and it's because they have cheap tools, and get frustrated.

For anyone reading, the flare kit ($115), wrenches ($30) and three sizes of tubing benders ($180) isn't cheap, but you can find less expensive line wrenches, and you don't need to buy all three sizes of benders right away (or get the one on ebay--I might just to have it). But I can't recommend that Snap-on cutter/flaring kit enough.
-Brad

 

I hate plumbing. I'd rather wire guages lying on my back forever more than plumb brakes or anything.
But when I do, I go to NAPA or Pep Boys and buy 2-4 of every length of pre-flared brake lines they sell, that I think I'll need anyway, making sure they will take back what I don't use or bend up, and keep the reciept!
You can get them from about 4 feet to about 6 inches long, so that should cover any situation.
Then I do the brakes and take the rest back.
I usuall get enough different lengths to do two cars just so I don't have to go back to the store in the middle of the job. (NAPA is 5 miles away, Pep Boys is a 5 minute walk)

 

[ QUOTE ]
That's a good question on heating before flaring. Anybody tried it?

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that was my pearl of wisdom. . . dad was a plumber and tought me that. . . and that **** flows downhill. . which is true in so many ways


anyway. . heat th end red hot wrap it with a welding glove so it cools as slow as possible. . it will be much more malleable that way.

 

I am sick like Brad, I LIKE plumbing!!! He covered it well, but I might add that I use a wood countersink bit to deburr my tubing. Keep it chucked in the cordless, works nice.

 

[ QUOTE ]
I hate plumbing. I'd rather wire guages lying on my back forever more than plumb brakes or anything.
But when I do, I go to NAPA or Pep Boys and buy 2-4 of every length of pre-flared brake lines they sell, that I think I'll need anyway, making sure they will take back what I don't use or bend up, and keep the reciept!
You can get them from about 4 feet to about 6 inches long, so that should cover any situation.
Then I do the brakes and take the rest back.
I usuall get enough different lengths to do two cars just so I don't have to go back to the store in the middle of the job. (NAPA is 5 miles away, Pep Boys is a 5 minute walk)

[/ QUOTE ]

Good tip DrJ for those who are tool limited or just don't feel comfortable making brake lines, I have done it this way for years.
I knew I wasn't the only one to do it this way!

 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That's a good question on heating before flaring. Anybody tried it?

[/ QUOTE ]

that was my pearl of wisdom. . . dad was a plumber and tought me that. . . and that **** flows downhill. . which is true in so many ways


anyway. . heat th end red hot wrap it with a welding glove so it cools as slow as possible. . it will be much more malleable that way.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not a good idea in Ohio, the line will rust through there in less than a year. New brake line is already annealed, so it shouldn't need any heat. Used line, maybe, used Ford line definitely.

 

Please tell me why I should run 1/4" line to the rear when the lines going over the rear end is 3/16". Not trying to be smart ass, it's just that I ran these lines last night and really don't want to do it again.

 

The 1/4" to the axle is for fluid volume purposes, as stated above. Once it splits on the axle, you can run the smaller line since less fluid needs to flow through each line.

 

The 3/16 to the rear is also ok - they have been doing it that way for years.

 

All great info, keep it coming

 

So, pros...is this thing good enough?

Doesn't look like it will do 180's, but 90's
Selling for a few bucks on ebay.

I don't mind spending more if it's worth it...



Or this thing ?

 

Right after my post, I checked out the listings on Ebay and am putting my money where my mouth is--I figured for $15 (can't forget the damn shipping) I'd find out if it's decent or junk. That one WILL do 180-degree bends, according to the gauge on it. I just can't tell how tight the radius is from the pics.

Interestingly, the same Snap-on/Blue Point 90-degree bender I have is also being listed by someone, and it was up to $16 and change when I saw it last. After owning it, I'd be thrilled to get that for the piece of.....

I'll update this post on the Ebay Special after I get it, and let everyone know if it's decent or junk.
-Brad

 

Duh, I guess the upper one can do 180 as well...

 

i agree on the snap-on flair kit, it is worth its weight in, well snap-on tools! i run all my lines in stainless though, with ss fittings. (mostly #3 a/n) and run a scotchbrite pad over them before bending. looks very nice and will never rust. also, make sure to squirt brakleen in them and blow them out with clean dry air prior to installation!

 

I'll never bend a brake, fuel, or oil line as long as I have Deuce Bruce up the road. He's the northwest gold standard when it comes to running lines. No leaks around these parts.

 

I'd think seriously about running a mechanical brake light switch. They seem to last longer than the hydraulic switches, and if one does fail, you won't have to bleed the brakes after replacing it.