Bought a really bad project- so now what?

I'm in there as well... the stock style front axle and some disc brakes is where I would go for simplicity and safety.

 

Good luck on the project! Sounds like your going for the build are you going to do the work yourself now? Aggie?

 

A.F.

Sometimes its not a matter of tradition its just a matter of education.

The Mustang II is a popular front end. I have heard some good and bad about it. But the old Ford axle is no slouch either. I know you are worried about the saftey of you child. My kid is 39 this year and I still worry about her.

Never the less here is something you should take into account. I learned to drive on what is considered obsolete, straight axles, kinpin early indepsendent, I even drove an old Knee action chebby when I was real young. I'm still here @ 56 years of age. I learned to drive in the Cascade mountains when they were still two lanes roads. Take it a little farther than that there are fellas on here way older than I am.

You can with a little patience and some advice from some of the older fellas along the way make a beam axle car handle like a CanAm racer. Granted probably not a competative Can Am racer but you can make one carve a canyon with the best of them.

I have driven both and I personally don't believe that one is any harder to drive than the other. They handle a little different but for someone that is just learning it doesn't make any difference at all.

One other thing, thanks to all you fellas that picked up the ball and offered to help. That's real stand up in my book. When you talk about building a traditional rod that seems to be the part that everyone has left out of the equation.

 

The disappointment is crap like this! He chose the frontend he wanted for a reason. I've been to his house & "NARROW ROADS" is being kind. This car is for his daughter.

Either front end properly setup works fine. Lets keep the BS comments to ourselves & just help a guy out.

 

If it was for myself I would do a beam axle but I understood his intention of setting the car up for his daughter. He has valid concerns for reliability and safety and the front end he chose met those needs. A new traditional front end was out of reach price wise.
Please keep in mind he is trying to do this work himself on a limited budget and the mustang 2 setup will make what was an unsafe car usable. The "value" will be in his daughter enjoying driving this.

 

x2. and.......... remove MII from your vocab.

 

now add MII back into it. Tradition is one thing, his choice is another. Nothing wrong with MII.

 

I know that it is a matter of choice, but here is another thing to think about.... A Mustang II on an open fender car (Pre-35) is gonna limit your buyers when you're ready to sell and move on to something else. Basically because you can see it and they're just an eyesore.

A well setup axle with a 4 bar, disc brakes and a panhard rod will do just fine.

I've always been told that when doing mods to the house or a car, you gotta keep re-sale in mind.

just my .02 cents.

 

x2.

 

First of all sorry to see this was a horrible start. But it will turn out far better in the long run if you can stay at it.

LEAVE THE MUSTANG II OUT OF THE EQUATION! They are a good alternative for a big full fendered car post '41 where you can't see the suspension stuff. They aren't that great to start with anyways. I have owned MII cars and straight axles so I am not popping off here or coming from an uneducated point. A well placed and correctly adjusted straight dropped axle will handle, stop, and ride pretty damn nice and look right in the car. 3-4" drop and a reversed eye spring will be a great start, I hate discs but I also understand it's for your daughter. It's an old car and it will never handle like a Porsche without tons more than a MII thrown at it. Enjoy it for what it is, drive it to your comfort or daughters. You were handed a bad pile but I see Roses. That's a Model 40 Sir, you're lucky.


Tim

 

Right On again, Hellonwheels! When I had my shop, a guy brought in a '40 Ford Coupe that was 'similar' underneath. I pulled the SBC & 400 TH out, then the Corvair front crossmember/suspension. Then the 12 bolt Chevy rear end, which was secured similar to this, trailing arms, coil springs, secured with Allthread! (grade 3!!!)

My 6" heavy body sander cleaned up the pigeonshit welds, then I 'patch-painted' the places I fixed. A narrowed 9-inch Ford rear went in with Pete & Jake's brackets, and a nice flattened '40 rear spring. Front got a 4" Magnum axle, Chassis Engineering bracket for splitting wishbone, and I made new cantilever engine mounts. I used a Saginaw cross steering box, fabricated tie rod and cross drag ling from 4130 tubing & Ford tie rod ends. He bought some Wheel Vintique solids and radial Big-n-Littles, and the car rode and handled nicely. It didn't 'break the bank'!

 

Holy shit, dude! Who ever concocted that horrendous chassis needs to be beat down badly. The trailing arms dangling on bolts and booger-welded "subframe" brackets were the absolute worst hack shit I've ever seen. I hope you can salvage something from this. Hindsight is always 20/20, but always take someone who's mechanically-inclined to inspect these things. As you can see, there are some inbred people out there building the lowest form of garbage.

 

M2 front crossmember and suspension are a reliable safe fix. Modern shocks, brakes and parts availability at the local Napa has an attraction to someone that will drive the car alot ... In a fendered car it is almost invisible anyway ... just get a good one ... Joe

 

You might think it's BS, but my opinion is shared by many and you're proving my point about the brainwashing comment by saying 'he chose it for a reason'. I still contend that a straight axle performs just fine, but there are some out there that believe that a MII setup is superior no matter what, and THAT is what I call BS. The only advantage I can see for his daughter is power steering, but this subject has been flogged to death on this board anyway.

The real problem lies with aggieforester's intention of welding the crossmember in HIMSELF. I'm pretty sure he pointed out that he wasn't an experienced welder early in the thread, do you think it's a good idea for him to learn on the crossmember that will hold his daughter's life in it's hands? I consider myself a decent welder but I got a friend with more experience to weld on my frame, just sayin'.

I appreciate the sentiment of helping a guy out - you're right, that's why we should be posting on this thread. The fact that you went to look at his car in person speaks volumes about you. Plus, you have seen the car with your own eyes, I haven't. But I think he is adding more expense, time and labor for no real gain. Again my opinion, propagating a myth doesn't help anyone.

 

I agree with you when you say " A well placed and correctly adjusted straight dropped axle will handle, stop, and ride pretty damn nice and look right in the car. 3-4" drop and a reversed eye spring will be a great start" Totally agree. I have had both, and frankly I like my drop axle better than my MII....but...My point is that his car should reflect his views, and what he likes, not what others like. You hate disc brakes, I love them. He might hate them also, but that's for him to chose. He already bought a FatMan IFS. I respect his choice and wont lose any sleep over it....because my original statement was.....an MII will work just fine...It might not be what you or I would chose on our build....but it WILL work!

 

please consider that the fatman conversions were designed for 35 and up early fords.they are to wide for the 32-34 and the tires will hit the fenders on turns.he does sell a narrowed 35 type that will work on your 34.You must take into consideration that there are 100,000 members on this board.the majority of which have never built an early ford from the ground up.Its easy to jump here and give your 2cents worth.I think most of us are trying to give the man our best advise,considering he and his daughter are home building this really nice car with limited welding skill and experience.The old straight axle is a bolt in ,it`s cheap and clean and they can do it themselves.If you decide to go with the mustang 11,make sure you leave the radiator mounts on the frame when you cut out the original cross member.you will also have to ,at the very least partially box the the frame where you weld in the new mustang mounting brackets.To be safe ,the welding should be farmed out to a qualified welder.And i guess that my point on using the early ford I beam; you can do it at home YOURSELF and have a safe reliable front end ,that adds so much to the classic look of the 34 ford.

 

Thanks for the advice, folks. I'll take another look at the C.E. and Posies traditional front end kits. Speedway has one, too, but I've heard some of y'all rail on them for their lower quality parts. One gent was suggesting an original 37 axle, I'm not even sure what rehab that would take to be usable. Good point on the welding. I'm planning on boxing it myself- the welds aren't what I'd call high stress. If I have to do welding, I can either tack it up and pay/bargain RC or one of the other locals to help me out- that does ouns like the safest option.

 

Build it the way you want it ... I have a straight axle in a Model A and a Heidt's M2 1940 Ford coupe ... I like them both ... power rack steering it tough to beat in a heavy fendered daily driver ... especially for a young lady ... I have never seen a Fat Man M2 but they are in business since the beginning of time and it must be decent stuff ... It is yours to rescue ...

 

when did OCC start building cars?

 

BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Lets hope they don't.

 

My offer still stands that I'll be glad to do the welding on the frame regardless of which frontend you go with.

 

Thanks, RC, much obliged!

 

Deto --- I build cars / bikes / airplanes ... I am in the middle of a Model A land speed project ... I dont resemble the axxholes from OCC ... no tatoos ... no loser sons ...

 

I guess that you are going to have to explain to me what makes a beam axle unsafe. As far as cost is concerned that last time I priced an MII they were way more than a Ford Axle.

A beam axle can be set up and on the road for well less than a grand. I'm not sure you can touch an MII for that price.

Aggi this is not to hijack your post. So please don't take it that way. Bottom line is its still your choice and I'm glad to see that you haven't given up on your quest.

 

What porknbeaner said............. I'm running 'beam axles on 2 rides. Perfectly safe, and a LOT less money than MII.

 

My 46 Ford convertible with a Chassis Engineering dropped axle, 11" power disc brakes and GM 605 power steering, split wishbones, and 10 bolt Chevy rear handled better then several cars I've owned with MII suspensions. Besides Mii is for a fat fender car as its an ugly suspension. Go with the dropped axle like everyone has been telling you.

 

He was comparing the prices of new complete dropped axle kits in the $2500 price range. He was concerned about the safety of using original/used parts("I" did not say it was unsafe) and the MII was definitely cheaper than some of the axle kits he priced. Again, I have traditional front ends in my cars and if it was for me that would be the way I would go. I offered info on several ways for him to go with the suspension and pointed him in the right directions to research every option.

 

I think you guys that are getting your panties in a bunch regarding whether (any) suspension (on narrow twisting country roads) is more desireable over the other needs to do what porknbeaner so wisely pointed out. That requirement(to be driven on narrow, winding) would be steering wheel/gearbox lock to lock ratio, not IFS vs 'beam axle. Therefore any idear that IFS would work better than 'beam axle is an (un-)educated presumption. .

 

Wow, sorry to see that! The way the rear links are pivoted amazes me!
Even more amazing is the fact that you managed to drive that thing w/out it fallin apart

If i was closer to you i would love to help you out, really,
but unfortunateley we have an ocean in between..... Best of luck man!

 

I've bowed to the collective wisdom of the group. Ordered a Posey's complete traditional front end today, they've got a nice package (better overall package deal than CEs, IMHO). Now to trade off that Fatman MII crossmember.... And JC kindly offered to help with the welding, he'll keep me running right.