Got a dilema on my hands. Maybe you can help me. Im putting a 4-speed manual behind my 427ci BBC. w/ 3.73 axle ratio Sounds straight foward right? well heres my issue... I have a Borg warner 63' T10-1C, Needs rebuilding. Have no linkage, bell housing etc. My buddy has a Muncie, wide ratio Needs rebuilding but its not bad condtion, i can buy for $150. So my problem lies in this, Do i rebuild what i already have? Or sell it,And rebuild that muncie? Would i be wasting my $$$ on that early T-10? Being that its behind a 427, will it live? I DO plan on running this thing pretty hard. And tend to do so.
A number of years ago I put a T-10 behind an L88 and it failed on the 2nd hole shot.Put in a Muncie and never had another problem. I guess it depends on how hard you want to drive the car.
I've got a 500 HP 427 in my 55 Nomad. I put a Muncie M22 behind it. I did some reasearch before I decided on the M22. The t-10 isn't as strong at the Muncies are. From what I remember, the factory 409 cars had lots of warranty issues with transmissions, so they switched to the Muncies. Other peoples opinions WILL vary. My new project 34 Ford, 392 Hemi powered, has a Richmond Super-Street 5 speed over-drive trans. Supposed to be rated at over 500 HP.
$150 is a steal for a good Muncie. That wide ratio box has a deeper 1st gear than the M22 or M21 also. Lots of upgrades are available for it like a stronger case and a steel midplate.
well i'll admit, Im hard on sh*t. I'd like to go with the muncie, just because that reason. and im sure theres alot of aftermarket stuff for um, an early t-10 im not sure. i did like the wide ratio idea as well. its a little more trouble to sell the t-10 but im thinking id be ahead in the long run...Agreed? the countershafts and such are good in it, so im guessing just a basic rebuild is all it needs. Ive also heard you can out the M-22's ge****t in that case? Jesus hurst super comps are pricey! anyone have a good source for a ****ter shield/bellhousing, and a shifter. something good but maybe not paying for "the name" or are they really that good? Thanks guys, I love the HAMB for this reason. y'all give it pretty straight foward, helps me out alot. I get pretty...Indecisive sometimes
If you are a tight--, er, eh, "frugal" like I am, why not use a Muncie shifter instead of the Compe***ion Plus jobber. Probably pick up a cheap Muncie shifter since most were quickly pulled for the Comp+. I love mine. I set the rods up so that it leads going from 2nd across the H and up into 3rd. it only takes like a thread or maybe a thread and a half to make the levers lead into gear. Like this ol' "Snoopy art" of mine.. .....l.../ ...../..l Hope this helps and this is onna my old "feelie" deals, you will feel the slide across once everything is adjusted right.. pdq67
The Muncie is stronger than the old T-10s. The newer/Richmond T-10s are stronger than a Muncie. Depending on you car and how you drive it, you might get by just fine with the T-10. But cost aside, the Muncie is a better option than an old T-10. Putting this in perspective: When used within its limits the Muncie is a decent trans. I am using one in a project myself. In spite of the fact it was used behind some powerful big blocks, the Muncie is far from bullet proof. From the same era as the Muncie; the better versions of the Chrysler/New Process and Ford top loader were heavier, but were stronger than a Muncie. And while some people can break pretty much anything, it isn't uncommon for even the slightly stronger M22 to fail when used hard with a healthy small block.
Hmm Ill keep an eye open for a muncie type. Ha Yea that actually makes scense once i figured it out! Yea im frugal in every ounce of the word. But its kinda Funny im building a big block 55 chevy I musta been raised wrong, im thinkin
Agreed, I do realize that anything can & will break. Im just looking for whats gonna let go first (In therory) this is my first big block car, and first 4-speed (Of my own) so its new waters for me. This will be a street car with occasional drags. Keep ideas coming guys, Im starting my rear end install today so im going to make a move soon (leaning towards the muncie)
Munci is great and a Hurst Super Shifter is the cats ****, I run stock car and hit 4 gear by the first corner and I am a very sloppy shifter and it takes a very good clutch to hold it too, i finally had to go to tripple disc, good stuff is worth the investment, I was broke and cheep and never regretted a few good parts, even if some meals got a little thin
A '55 with a Big Block and you're "not sure" what 4 Speed to use??? <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/RJb67ljCkws?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/RJb67ljCkws?fs=1&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>
Most of us have tore up a 4-speed at one time or another. While we would like to think it was from too much horsepower, it was actually from the old style 3200 lb pressure plates shocking the driveline while power shifting. Todays new style clutches use less spring pressure yet hold a lot better and are much easier on the driveline. I would go with the wide ratio Muncie. A good rebuild on the transmission and a properly adjusted shifter will work fine. Use one of the newer style aftermarket street and strip clutch setups. Now comes the important part. This is the area where you DO NOT want to start getting cheap. ONLY use an aftermarket explosion proof steel flywheel and an aftermarket blow proof bell housing with the proper block plate put together with ALL the bolts. By your own admission you plan on running the car hard. Don't let this happen to you...
Holy sheep ****!!!! My four speed (m-22) and clutch have been sittin in the car since 1976,maybe when I change out the oil pump (has a high pres.75psi @ 3 grand) I will really check out the clutch set up,I was thinkin about going to a five speed............thanks for bringin this up
Gezze your right...Maybe i did have my head up my a$$!. mine was flat black when i got her, you can see the radius job in my avatar...And thats prob my favorite movie. AND THAT FLYWHEEL EXPLOSION PIC!!! WOWWZERRRR!. Never seen one that bad
Definately go with the Muncie - $150 is a pretty good price,too. I've been road racing Muncies behind L88 big blocks for many years - no issues. You can get new M22 ge****ts - some made in Italy, and some in China - I have used the Italian sets with good results. But, they are pretty pricey - I'm remembering $900 or so. Good thing is you can get them with a 10 spline input (and 27 output) if you want to save driveline components you have. But, you may like the wide ratio better on the road. Hmmmm - not sure the Italian ge****ts whined much - but hard to tell over an unmuffled L88 and noisey quick change........
This is probably the best advice on the thread. Put a Lakewood bell housing with a mid plate in it. I had a clutch and pressure plate come apart in the Lakewood housing on my '62 Corvette 30+ years ago. Contained everything. Made a lot of expensive noise but the car was still whole as were my feet. Cheap insurance, even new. Charlie
McCleod sells one safety bell housing that accepts the Ford Toploader. I've got one in my not quite complete '31 roadster along with a Jeep top plate shifter so'es it looks like a stock old Ford 3sp. top loader. The Top Loader isn't indestructible, but it's about as close to it as you can get. I've been abusing them on the street, drags, and oval track since mid 60s when they came out! Dave
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