Old Dawg, Interesting story about Chuck Davis and Joe Gemsa. I sold Mr. Davis two post-war Maserati 4 cylinder supercharged engines back in the mid 80's. I knew he was involved with Miller Marine engines - didn't know he was involved with the restoration of this Miller race car. Mr. Gemsa was a master machinist and designer/builder of "Jiggler" cylinder heads. Didn't know he built the crankcase for this beautiful race car - quite a feat within it's self. I used to sit next to him at WRA meetings in Burbank some years ago - didn't realize at the time all that he had done in his lifetime. Thanks again for posting this information - Beautiful car and engine. Offy 220
To see more of Chuck Davis' work check out this thread on H.A.M.B.: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=350409&highlight=chuck+davis&page=3
I'd like to correct the "whole cloth" statement. Sometime in the 1970's I p***ed on this very ch***is at $2,500. Chuck Davis bought it, knowing what it was and backed tracked every owner that had it, finding many of the original parts encluding the original two man body. The carburators were totally made from blueprints TWICE! The first set were stolen in transit and a second set were made. The restoration was perfect, it was a honor to judge it at Hershey both times were it won its AACA Junior and Senior awards.
"Kid", I follow, appreciate and admire your knowledge and the input you have on the H.A.M.B. I admire the work of folks like Phil Reilly and Company (out here on the "Left Coast"); and outfits like Zakira's Garage (in the East). So please don't get upset by anything I've said, or am about to say. I hang around with a bunch of cynical old fabricators and racers. Fundamentally, we believe that a race car, for the most part has to change from "Saturday Night to Saturday Night" to remain compe***ive. Thus the only cars that end up unmolested are those that make such a "splash" that they end up immediately in a museum (example: the 1946 Indy winner, Sparks "little six"); or they're so lousey, they get tossed aside, and left alone (too many examples to name). The rest of them end up as "recreations", or "reproductions", built with some original parts; and some fabricated parts parts. I happen to own one of the latter (I think most of you have seen it). Frankly, I consider my car to be a "****rel" of a typical SoCal 30's dirt car. It's my simplistic belief that most, if not all of the Millers, in some manner, or another fall into the "recreation" category. The glaring exceptions are the two front drive 91's brought out of France in 1959 So goes the lore of the 1931 Miller ch***is, according to the Mark Dees account, after two failed runs at Indy (1931 and 1932), the car was sold to Harry Hartz who took it apart, shortened the wheelbase to 100 inches, removed and sold off the V-16; and installed a new Miller 255 four. Dees said there is a remote chance that Hartz obtained a new short wheelbase ch***is. The new car, running much faster in the 1933 Indy race in the hands of Les Spangler, piled into the wall, wrecking the car and killing Spangler and his mechanic, Spider Matlock. It then was sold to Californian Earl Haskell. This is why I find all the "stories" of "collector cars" so interesting. This raises more questions than answers. What shape was the car in after it hit the wall? What modifications, or changes were made in the reconstruction? According to Mark Dees, Haskell's drivers did "very well" with the car. Then Joel Thorne got hold of it and put various engines, including a V-8 Ford flathead and Maserati in it, apparently modifying the frame. And, as Dee describes, the various body panels were "ugly". It ran at Indy (but not qualifying), in these various forms in 1949 and 1950. "Tony" Henkels, one of Thornes mechanics, told me: Thorne, just before his death, had the firm of Bohman and Schwartz start reproducing the frame rails and some of thee "original" body panels for the car. Whether these items are the ones that Bob McConnnell had; and Chuck Davis bought, is anyone's guess. Neither McConnell or Davis couldn't have checked with Thorne (he was already dead); and "Sonny" Bohman died in the 60's. Joe "Jiggler" Gemsa is gone, too. When I talked to Henkels, he thought that David Uhlein may have bought the stuff from Bohman when, he, Uhlein, bought the parts of the Sparks "Big Six". At any rate, the car sold, at a post block sale, for $545,000 at the RM Auction in Monterey in 2009. It has been listed in some publications as a "recreation", and a very nice one, at that (I might add). I hope we know "were I'm coming from". I certainly can't claim to be the "know all and end all"
Old Dawg, I think we all have our own definitions of restorations, clones,and recreations. The Chuck Davis V-16 is a restoration in my book, his Front Drive 91 is a recreation, and he would tell us all it is if he was still with us. His first MILLER, the 122 was one I admired because of all the work that went into collecting all the bits. Chuck called everyone he knew that was interested in MILLERS and asked what parts we had. I had 4 connecting rods from a 122 that I bought from Joe Gemsa, for future use in a Model B Ford project. Two years later Chuck called and asked if I'd sell them, he'd found a 122 crankcase that was cut in half and an uncut crank and two camshafts. With all these parts he "reconstructed" a 122 MILLER. The frame is totally new, but at one time he had the rusted remains of one that he later s****ped. Had he kept the junk frame the car could have been shown in AACA National events. You have to have the frame in AACA to claim you have a race car, the certification commettee came up with that rule over 25 years ago, and it works for me. You don't have to use it in the restoration, just have it so someone else can't clain the same car with a clone. It all comes down to splitting hairs now that all the great cars have been found and we are sifting through parts in the hopes of adding another running car to the world. I'd rather watch the "recreated" 1906 Darracq Land Speed Record car run on Ormond Beach than watch the original engine run on a stand. The true details on a race car only matter when you are buying or selling.....I'm just happy knowing people sink a lot of time and money in the projects, them bring them out for us to see and listen to. Bob
Old Dawg and 37 Kid, I appreciate both of you regarding your knowledge concerning Harry Miller and the fate of his beautiful cars. I have read Mark Dee's "Miller Dynasty" cover to cover many times - I also purchased a copy of his "Errata and Supplemental Notes" back at the Speedway museum bookstore in the late 80's. All of this brings me to this question either one or both of you could answer. Has any more information been found or discovered since the untimely p***ing of Mr. Dees regarding some of these Miller race cars? I take Mr. Dees' research as highly respected "gospel"- I realize after time p***es, someone may discover additional information regarding a particular race car. I hope this question is not too vague - I am just curious since some 25+ years has p***ed since he wrote the "Miller Dynasty." Thanks, Offy 220
The remains of the Ray Keech 1929 INDY Winner were found in Pennsylvania. I think that is one of the most important ones.
I agree with sentiment behind the "ruling" of the AACA vis-a-vis the frames. But, it is unfortunate that it disqualifies cars like Davis' 122. That may be the reason that, what I believe is the Davis 122, didn't sell, along with the V-16 car, at the RM Auction at Monterey in 2009. Moreover, my race car, which, like most "one off" AAA Champ cars, has no known original provenance, wouldn't qualify anyway; as I'm told the frame of the "original" wreckage was so damaged and rusted as to be only useful in the making of a new one. The original was a cut-down and narrowed 1928/1929 Es***. I'm guessing that a more nefarious fellow would save the Es*** I.D., dream up some history and "WALLAH!!" he'd have a "collector car" to show. I still feel sorry for one of the collectors (which one, I don't know) who bought one of the two cars represented to be The Auto Shippers Special. I do know the Shorty Cantlon was only killed once in the original. Or, then there's the beautiful replica of a Type 59 Bugatti, built by a fabrication outfit in Toronto, that was pulled from Ebay when the bid stalled at $25,000. It emerged at a UK auction with some added provenance that stated the ch***is and some parts were spares to be used on Robert Benoist's GP car. Somebody paid, I believe, six million and change for that story. And lastly, I had a discussion with my friend Bernard Juchili, manager of Leno's "big dog garage", over the Type C Auto Union that was to go on the block at the "Four Hundred Bucks and All you can Eat" event at The Quail in Monterey a couple of years ago. Bernard said it might go for 10 mil. I countered to say they'd be lucky to get half that, considering the many questions as to it being a reproduction. We were both wrong, I don't know that the bids even got to one million. But, it is a great car. The collectors, I think, were a bit more savvy on that one We certainly are in agreement that what ever the provenance of a race car, the public should be allowed the experience of seeing, hearing and smelling them running. And, NO! I didn't pay the $400 ($800 if I consider my wife) to get into the show at the Quail. My car was in the group that was invited over from the Monterey Historics. Sir Stirling Moss took one look at my car, then looked at me and asked: "Do you drive this?" I nodded. He said: "hrumph!!" and walked away.
He must have been having a bad day, his father finished 16th in the 1924 INDY 500 driving a Fronty-Ford.
Great discussion concerning this car and others that have a historical significance. I was questioned when I was selling the Watson / Foyt Bowes Seal Fast sprint car at RM auctions last August - how much of the car is original? Dean Jeffries stated in his book that he had to rebuild and straighten the front section of the frame since it was badly damaged. I know the Offy 220 was original according to the engine number - how many times the crankcase and cylinder block was replaced - I have no idea. I know the grille had been repaired - I ended up replacing several damaged bars. The tail section was not original since it was replaced by a fuel bladder. I would say that most of the body panels were original - but again - could have been replaced or reworked in it's earlier life. I would agree about restorations - since these cars were raced and consequently seen crashes and damage - parts that could not be salvaged would have to replaced or remade. In the end - I am grateful that these cars have either been put back together - restored or recreated - so that all of us can enjoy them. Thanks again for the discussion, Offy 220
The book that comes to mind is "The Marvelous Mechanical Designs of Harry A. Miller" by Gordon Eliot White. Others, though, that you might have, or want to have are "The Golden Age of the American Racing Car" and "Miller", both by Griffith "Griff" Borgeson. Then you can add: "Design and Development of the Indy Car" by Roger Huntington, "Indy Cars 1911-1939", the Ludvigsen Library Series; "Legion Ascot Speedway 1920s-1930s" by John R. Lucero. And, to understand the world of builder-racers of AAA champ cars: "Outlaw Sprint Car Racer" John Gerber's autobiography. Finally (though I doubt you can find one) "Speedway; Half Century of Racing with Art Sparks" by Eugene Banning
You're right! He had just finished looking at a car represented as a Volpi Alfa Romeo. The Volpi looks like an imitation of a Typo 158/159. The car had "Juan Fangio" on the side, to which I think Sir Stirling took umbrage. And, you speak of Fronty-Fords at Indy. I know of a car represented as a Frontenac Ford that ran to a 5th place finish at Indy. However this car sits about one or more feet lower than those that ran at the brickyard. My magnet is not attracted to the DOHC head or block. I believe the"Model T" block must be one of those expensive, five main, alloy ones, marketed by Zakira's Garage. The cylinder head has to be one of those built by George Parker, using the patterns of the Gallivan DOHC. The fellow (from, I think, Huntington Indiana) who owns the patterns, surfaced on another thread of the H.A.M.B.. There is not doubt in my cynical mind that the Chevrolet Brothers had nothing to do with that engine (and probably the car). But, it runs fast; and sounds great. With all that power (I hear, by good authority, 180+ h.p. at the flywheel) he used to beat me. But, on my "****rel", employing the tuning of suspension, engine and gearing, that my good friend and "race guru" suggested; I drive around him on the outside
McKee great pics. I spent that day at Meadowbrook with the Marmon 16 next to this car (Greg is the owner of the 1916 Packard racer you have photographed at Meadowbrook as well). Spent a lot of time right there as one seems to do at these shows and walked around this Miller and spoke to the caretaker (who worked for Davis) a number of times. He did not like my questioning the provenance of the car that is for sure. I really know nothing of this particular car but had heard it was put together a bit. You would not think that after hearing the obligatory story. I have heard so many stories regarding other old racers that it has become difficult to believe ANY OF THEM. Go to a show and talk to the owner and then get the restorer aside and see how often the stories match. One weekend I got three different stories from three different guys ***ociated with an early racecar. I wasn't even trying to get different stories, I just was interested in more of the details and the details were different. I have visited a number of shops during the so called "restoration" or "recreation" or whatever is the description of the moment and the post restoration story often is just a tad askew. I keep my mouth shut or I may be persona non grata on my next visit. I am going to have to side with Old Dawg on much of what he says. The deeper you dig on these cars as represented the more questions that arise. I also really appreciate what many of these owners have done. What Bill Castle has done with his Baby Chevrolet is simply amazing yet some people would probably say that is only a recreation. Who am I to argue-so what. Show me a Miller or old racer that really is restoration by definition. Other than the 2 Millers brought back to the US by Borgeson it is difficult to find Millers that were driven back to the stable and put away as many of these owners today would almost have one believe. I even am a huge fan of the Golden Sub yet when I bring that topic up I never know what I am going to hear. Without that "recreation" we would be guessing at what the Sub really looked and sounded like in the flesh. Much of what is being done are that cars are being resurrected out of whole cloth which is fine with me as we get to go on sensory overload with the finished product. Maybe it is the deceit that causes the problem. If everyone had to pony up with the true story then no harm no foul I guess. With the money involved, fat chance of that happening. If we came up with a thread of cars without any questionable provenance from manufacture til today could we make it past the first page?-I doubt it.-Jim
For the record the "Best" MILLER, the one Griff Borgeson brough home from the Bugatti factory has been TOTALLY restored THREE times! Borgeson, Harrah and Rubin, it is now in the Smithsonian. --------------- Thanks for the great photos of the V-16 McKee!
Here are some progress shots of One of the V-16 Miller race cars going on at Zakira's where I am presently employed. The Engine is the real deal... Two of the Blocks have original Indianapolis Tech stampings in them. The Ch***is is Totally recreated. Enjoy.
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