So I have this rather unique grill with some problems. Several of the stainless ribs have popped off the grill frame. Figured no sweat, take it to a welder and he'll make it good as gold. Wrong! He tells my partner that the stainless ribs cannot be (re)welded back on the grill frame because the frame is pot metal. He suggests rivets. So is that true? Can't weld the stainless to pot metal? How the heck did it get done at the factory?
I assume you are working on the 47 but you might tell folks what you are working on to give someone a better handle on what you are trying to do. And no as far as I know you can't weld stainless to pot metal. I don't think you can weld anything to pot metal but thee has to be some way to make it work. Detailed photos might also help. I was thinking silver solder but someone else might have a better idea.
What about welding small stainless steel studs on the back of the grill, drill holes and bolt it to the frame.
Beats me, how about you take some nice close up pics of the thing so we can see if we can figure it out?
What - you can't see the picture I have in my head of this thing? OK, I'll get some pics tomorrow and maybe it will make some sense The stud idea sounds interesting.
Just braze it or have someone do it. We braze stuff together that should probably never even be put together and it lasts!
OK. I took a peek at an old oxy-ace welding book I have and I'm having a tough time distinguishing what type of alloy "pot metal" actually is seeing as there is no set guideline. One thing is for sure, it contains zinc. That may be why no one wants to weld it. You know, zinc fumes. I'd ask ChromePlaterJosh on here, I know he repairs pot metal before chroming so he may have some insight.
pot metal is un-weldable. it is the shittiest metal on earth basically. like the other guys said braze it glue it or bolt it because your gonna fuck it up welding it!
I think maybe you need a little closer look at this grille to see how your loose pieces were originally attached. As a professional welder, I can tell you that the factory couldn't have welded stainless to potmetal, either, with a spotweld or any other welding or brazing process. They must have been pressed on, or crimped on, or you're missing some sort of clip to hold it. Or, the base is NOT potmetal. If all else fails, I would guess that your best bet would be to blast the backside of your stainless to give it some tooth, and use a good quality epoxy. Bud
Pot metal is the spam of metals. It is often mistaken for aluminum and is indeed unweldable. I agree with the brazing.
Yes Virginia, there IS a Santa Clause,... And you CAN weld Pot Metal Years ago, I was able to do some amazing repairs with this stuff,.. EVERYBODY said,.. "you can't do that !" (including, and especially Pot Metal),... But I did with this,.. It was pricey,. But it always worked. It can actually Join copper, aluminum, brass, pot metal, white metal, zinc die cast, stainless, galvanized, pewter and steel in any combination. ,..... No kidding, I have seen it done, I was really surprised to see the company was not only still in business,.. but has a web sight. I need to buy some to put up on the shelf,.... Some guys said they were able to do these types of repairs with "kirksite" rod,... I never tried that. But this stuff WORKS ! Cecil Muggy Super Alloy http://www.muggyweld.com/products.html In fact you can watch Pot metal welding & repair here,... http://www.muggyweld.com/potmetal.html
there are types of white metal that can be soldered... but not the kind that has zinc in it- "Pot Metal" used in automotive appications has zinc in it....as a result forget about doing anything that involves a torch...you will just melt it... pretty quickly. anything that is attached to what you are working on was cast into it- JB weld is your best bet-
OK one of you "braze it" guys explain to me how the hell you are going to braze pot metal? as soon as the torch gets near it it will be gone.
you can weld stainless, i`ve seen potmetal welded, but to each other, never......if you took it to a welder and he said no, it wasn`t becuase of fumes or other reason, its because it can`t be done......have to look closer into how the factory did it...
Pot metal is a slang term. Most of it is mostly zinc alloyed with tin and often a touch of copper. Solder? Braze? Both are just metal based hot metal glue. Metals with a greatly disparate melting point cannot be welded together. No solder that I'm aware of sticks well to 316 stainless (auto trim grade). Loctite makes a glue that was devoloped to stick aluminum skins on air planes, it is sold in most auto body paint stores as "panel adhesive". Some body men knock it pretty hard but it is way better than a shitty weld. Like some one else said:"Just cause you can don't mean you should."
Hey guys,...... Go to the links I put in post #12,.... I seen amazing things with this stuff. And I have amazed friends that are professional welders with it as well (I first used it in the 80's,... And it had been around for a loooong time before that),.... It's one of the best kept secrets because everybody says,... "It can't be done",..... but it can. The weirdest thing about it, is for application, It becomes malleable at 350 degrees,... But after it cools,... 350 degrees won't make it malleable again,.....
As I understand this you aren't really able to "weld" anything to pot metal - not by the traditional definition of welding anyways. The rods that they sell (I've often seen them at swap meets) actually do work and technically aren't welding - the melting point of those rods is below the melting point of pot metal - so in reality you are soldering - call it welding if you like - but in the end I don't suppose it matters a bunch if your goal is to stick two parts together. Last time I looked you could get these special "welding" rods at the local welders supply. I have to wonder if this is the same stuff that "muggyweld" sells - or are we talking about some other "new" form of "welding" rod.
I have a half dozen sticks of Kirksite rod that a welding shop sold me some years back,... And they assured me it must be the same stuff,.. because they never herd of Muggy, Like I said, I never used it (the kirksite rod) , so I don't know if its the same or not,..It sure don't look the same (different weight color, consistency, etc. ) ,.. and there was no flux they recommended (or knew) to use with it. I fixed a grill surround for a friend back in the 80's with this stuff (for a 32 Nash If I remember right),... there was about a 3/8" section gone,... so we tried to bridge the gap ,... Figured,... "what the heck" We made a basic form/jig out of hard wood, clamped the pieces in,... and in fact used a propane torch,... The joint was actually just as hard as the parent metal. Not only did it work,.. but he shaped it down, took it to the plater, and there was no discoloration when it was plated,... But, you guys go ahead and keep telling me it can't be done,..... I wish you guys would have told me this 30 years ago,... If I would have known it couldn't be done, I wouldn't have waisted my time fixing stuff with it all those years ago.
Brass has zinc in it, and it solders just fine. Amazing what a little copper will do. Anyways, I'm still wanting to see the pics of this grille, so we can figure out what's going on here.
sounds more like you're a dealer for this stuff- no harm in that, but would help to know when determining the validity of your faith in it.
I think I've seen the muggy stuff in action, or something close to it. I had bought some but I couldn't get the hang of it and gave up...it was just a "tinker" type project so I wasn't too dedicated. Here is the order I would look at it in order of my preference: Weld, Braze, Solder, Adhere.
I guess I would be pretty poor dealer, sence I didn't know they had a web sight or if the company even existed anymore,.... (as per my former posts). NO, I am NOT, nor have I ever been a dealer ! OK,.. forget it guys,.... It doesn't really exist,... it's a Unicorn, Dragon, and Pegasus all rolled into one,.... A total figment of my imagination,... sorry I even brought it up. Go buy some JB Weld.
But was it pot metal to stainless? I think that's the issue here. Pot metal can be "welded", it's a matter of using the right filler/process. But fusing it to ss seems to be the question in this thread. I've seen too many things done that "can't be done" to ever say never Edit...just saw your first post. I think some of the other posts are valid. Probably more "electric brazing" than welding...but as long as it holds, who cares? I use silicon bronze a lot for joining dis-similar metals. I use a tig torch, but it's really more of a braze.
I would have to go with glue on this. 3M has a panel bonding adhesive that is perfect for your grill. Not that these other guys are wrong, but do you really wanna chance it on a hard to replace part. Lets face it, if it was easy to find another one you wouldn't be asking how to fix it.
Did anybody even watch the videos on the sight I linked to ? http://www.muggyweld.com/1clip8.html http://www.muggyweld.com/1clip15.html Theres a number of other ones as well. Alright ,... well thats it,... I must be wrong,... I'm all done with this thread.
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