Well my 354 hemi heads are at the machine shop. I find out I need new valves. Are there any valves that fit with a little help? Trying to save some money, the hemi valves are expensive. I checked the hemi tech. though very informative, it was no help in this instance. Any ideas?
Check into all Big Block Chevy valve sizes. Pretty sure they can be cut down to fit the Chrysler head.You'll have to get BBC keepers though,,,no biggie.
I will run it by my buddy at the machine shop. See what he can figure out about the chevy valves. Thanks
The word was "cheaper" than those listed for the 354, intake valve wise. Actually the 392 valves are a lot cheaper than the 331, not so sure about 354 where the ex valve is already the same size.
I can't remember which valves they are, maybe Big Block Chevy, that will work with some minor stem and mating guide modifications. Was much cheaper for a set, but your machine shop will still have to do some modifications which may counter what you save in the valve prices.
Hopefully someone who has done this can fill in some details. I went with stock style stainless valves in my 392, but LAYDRAG on here has a set of old Mondello heads that have Chevy valves. I think the stem diameter is different and he has different rockers also. The Tex Smith books says something about 351 Cleveland valves but doesn't really go into detail. Most of the problem will be the rocker geometry with a longer valve stem.
Okay! Just talked to a guy who knew the details of this operation. Small block Ford valves (302 or 351, he couldn't remember), Hemi guides are supposed to be the same (I'll have to check), they have to be shortened just a tad, and they are just slightly larger in diameter at the valve seat. So if you have to do your seats, this would have to get done anyway. I may very well consider doing this on some 354 heads I have. Not sure the actual valve dimensions. I'll look them up in a bit. Not sure of the risks ***ociated with running a high compression, high-domed piston as well. Maybe none.
Just for reference... 354/late 331 valve sizes: Intake - 1.9375" diameter, 5.0312" in length, .372"-.373" stem diameter, 45-deg seat Exhaust - 1.750" diameter, 5.0312" in length, .371"-.372" stem diameter, 45-deg seat 392: Intake - 2.000" diameter, 5.0312" in length, .372"-.373" stem diameter, 45-deg seat Exhaust - 1.750" diameter, 5.0312" in length, .371"-.372" stem diameter, 45-deg seat
So, the real question is how much money will you actually save after buying new $5 valves and paying your machinist to make them fit. Yes, you may well need new retainers, new keepers and new guides anyway but how wil you deal with the new valves that are too long? Look through any valve catalogue and you will not find any valve with the same dimensions as the Hemi. New guides will 'fix' the stem diameter; no one else uses the oem style locks; the head diameter can be trimmed if needed; but if the length is not spot-on then you have to deal with lash caps (if you cut the length to fit the oem spring). Use longer/taller spring you say?? Sure, but what have you now done to the rocker geometry? Yup, it now needs 'adjusting'. Yes the rocker shafts can be moved to accomodate a tall valve but that is an additional cost on top of the rocker arm rebuilding charge. Shop around for the correct valve. Some NS1 stuff shows up on ebay on occasion and new SS valves are available from several sources including yours truly ($12.50/ea for Hambers) Spend your money wisely. .
Yeah, that's sort of what I was getting at with my earlier comment about the modifications. Still an interesting topic, none the less. It does appear that some SBF valves are close, but with a smaller valve stem diameter and a chance to run over-sized valves (which really isn't needed). Gary, are you offering both stainless Intake and Exhaust valves at 12.50 each? ($200 a set) Guides and retainer prices? Can't imagine a person would spend much less for good SBF stainless valves.
Sounds like the small block Ford valves would only be an option for the '51-'53 331 heads. 351W intake valves were 1.84 inches, and the early 331s were 1.8125.
Scott, yup, Int and Exh. Guides usually run in the $8-10 /ea range that is why I am a big fan of just installing a K-liner with the stock stem diameter. Retainers prices vary, guess at $1-2 each, depends on spring. All too often we get hung up on valve head diameter and forget the other important dimensions. I haven't looked at the early 331 valves (we just don't see very many) so can't comment on the ford parts, but again, the critical measurement is the length. Word of caution to those folks scanning the valve catalogues...pay attention to the valve material. You cannot use an intake valve as an exhaust valve...well, you can, but you won't like the results. .
Good thread! Also a word of caution, don't use old retainers: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=592267
Thanks for the info. I just sent this link to my buddy. I guess he will decide what is going to happen.
Yeah, you really got lucky on yours! This is just another area where problems can develop when mixing and mis-matching valves-locks and retainers. K.I.S.S. .
I just did a set & used BBC stainless intake & exhaust valves. If the guides are worn I use K liners. I cut the intakes to 2 inch from 2.060 and used the exhaust as is. I used new keepers & a set of used BBC retainers and installed new (longer) springs. I always run adjustable push rods and this combo works very well. SI does list valves & I buy from them a lot but I prefer this set up. Watch the spring diameter as a larger spring along with the increased installed height will require a slight dimple in the top and bottom of the valve cover. When I raced the early hemi I ran a 5/16 stem, ultra lite BBC intake and exhaust valve and big springs with a 2.00 installed height and the dimples in my covers were big= OK= huge. It's nice with SI right here as I can just walk in the door and the guys will help find my best options.
On a simialar topic, anyone ever sleeve down the valve guides from sodium filled valves?? That is possable right???
To answer your question yes, but !! You would need a boring tool with the larger size pilot. Most tooling for seat and guide machines use a 3/8 or 11/32 pilot & will not center in that larger guide. A sleeve could be made on a lathe to bush it down and that was what I was going to do but a phone call & I found the new bronze guides in stock at my local supplier and cheap. I do bore out the guides in BBC heads and drive in the new 1/2 OD guides as sleeves.
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