Phil told me at one of the Super Stock Reunions that Ford gave him the hardtop Fairlane after he crashed his T-Bolt but I did not know it had round track history before he got it.
hi tom - actually , all '64 fairlanes had a 115.5 inch wheelbase . i always thought it was curious that ford lengthened the WB on the '65 fairlanes to 116" - the nascar min. legal WB at that time . as the '65 fairlane was essentually the same as the '64 under the skin , i always wondered if ford had planned to use the fairlane as their GN entry in 1965 . i've heard dick brannan , who was ford's drag team captain in the '60's , say that he tried to convince ford's thunderbolt planners to use the hardtop rather than the tudor body , as the HT had a lower roof , and would be more aerodynamic . he was told that the HT was heavier , and they wanted to use the lighter tudor body . dick said he tried to explain that the car was going to be extensively lightened , anyway , to get it below the 3200 lb. min. weight [ then they could add ballast ] , but they went ahead with the tudor body anyway . incidentally , there's a great profile article on dick brannan [part 1] in the july issue of "drag racer" magazine .
hey frank - i know i posted these before , but you mentioned the car , so i thought i'd post them again . the first pic is of phil's thunderbolt HARDTOP . phil said this is the car that ford gave him , as nascar had outlawed it . this was taken in '64 - note his '64 falcon in the background . the second pic is one i took [ with my $10.00 camera ] at the first [ 1995 ] S/S reunion . the car had been restored .
Made a trip to H-M to pickup parts for the Junior Johnson "chicken car" While I was waiting to get loaded, I counted about 15 "cammer's" stacked up in a warehouse. What a sight.
One of the theories was that he did not warm the engines before take off and the carbs iced. At least that was what was going around in the garage area after the crash.
Somewhere I have several pictures of the "Banana" as it was being built. Bumpers were narrowed, sectioned, windshield the same. It was a show just watching anyone get inside the car. I remember what Norris Friel told Jr. when he showed up at the track with that car. Friel walked around the car about twice, looked at Jr. and said " one of the nicest cars I have ever seen, but never, ever bring a G. D. piece of s**t back to a race track"
Frank that was quite common in the day. You could run the convertible division or the regular GN series with one car. I have fond memories of watching Glen Wood in a '58 vert at Bowman Gray.
There are important differences (previously pointed out) between the original car and the restored car ... in my opinion it's too bad that they didn't make it to the restoration ... 1) The rear wheel openings on the original were larger than stock, much like one of the vintage pictures from outside the HM shop shows (pictures previously posted) and 2) ... the fact that on the original the rear axle was moved forward slightly. Both of these changes are clear in the vintage photo. There are as far as I've seen, only a couple of vintage shots of the Bonner '64 hardtop. Obviously I'd like to see more. In my opinion I think it's a lucky turn of fate that the original T-Bolts were sedan bodys ... I think they look much better proportion-wise. Joel
I came across these pictures somewhere on the net ... any information on this car? It is too bad that there isn't a GOOD book out there on the beach speed trials. Joel
hey joel - i asked phil if the rear axle had been moved forward , and he said no . he said it was probably the angle from which the photo was taken that makes it appear that way . i know , and i agree - it sure looks "altered" . but as we all know , trying to remember something from 40+ years ago doesn't always work . it sure is fun getting old , huh ?! if you have any other pix of the car from "back in the day" , i'd sure like to see them . i think this is the only one i've ever seen . 'course , my memory is surely slipping , also .
hey joel - me again that's andy hotton of dearborn steel tube in the '56 t-bird . don't know if he had any connection with FoMoCo at this time , tho he may have had some "help" . but as far as i know , the only FACTORY t-bird on the beach that year was chuck daigh's black one , which put a big hurt on smokey's corvettes . i'll post some photos of some of the beach fords shortly , and i agree - i wish someone would write a book on the beach cars from speedweeks . 'course , this is opening up a whole new can of worms...but i'm lovin' it ! those cars were really neat !
Well I'll be darned!!! All the years I have known about Andy Hotton and his company Dearborn Steel Tubing I have never heard of him racing ANYTHING. Did he race other cars?
hi frank - i remember seeing one B&W pic of a '64 fairlane - racing in '64 - and it seems to me it said "thunderbolt" on the car....but it wasn't a t-bolt , as it had a 289 in it . i think it said B/MP of B/FX on it somewhere - anyway , it was a "B" something . i know i'm being very vague about this , but it's been a long time . somewhere on the car i believe it said "dearborn steel tubing" . andy hotton MAY have driven this car . joel will probably remember more about this . darn...he HAS to remember more than i just told you . jack
here's another pic of andy hotton in that t-bird . he sure does look "racey" ! the second pic shows chuck daigh's factory t-bird , which won and set a new record in the acceleration event . the caption that says it was disqualified is only partially correct , as it was reinstated [ as were several other cars] and allowed to run . there's a lot more to this car , as i did a lot of research on it years ago - and then built a model of it . joel took some pix , so i'll try to come back with those and a bit of a story , if anyone is interested .
Phil is a good friend but I'm sure that that rear axle was moved forward a few inches and the opening made to appear "stock" T-Bolt. His '64 Falcon seen behind the HT T-Bolt also had the rear axle slightly adjusted. Both cars bore the Warbucks name at this time in late '64 to possibly early '65. Joel
The Andy Hotton Enterprises car early 1964 at the NHRA Winternationals running B/FX and I believe the same car in 1965 running C/Modified Production. If memory serves 1965 was the first year for Modified Production in NHRA. Just because it has Hotton's name on the early shot doesn't mean that is him driving it. Both pictures were found on the net. An issue of Pop. Hot Rodding from back around '65-'66 had another picture of this car in C/MP trim. My apologies for furthering the distance from the HM discussion. Joel
My apologies for furthering the distance from the HM discussion. Joel[/QUOTE] No apology needed Joel. There were many T-Bolts Hotton built that had the "Competition Proven" logo on them sometime in their lives.
joel - i thought you'd remember that fairlane . however , you misunderstood me on both posts . i was AGREEING with you , re: the phil bonner "thunderbolt" HT rear axle . i certainly don't [ and didn't] want to insult phil , so i was trying to tiptoe around the issue by saying memories are often faulty after 40+ years . it looks to me like the axle was moved forward , also - that's why i asked phil about it in the first place. as to the andy hotton fairlane , i was answering frank's reply that he'd never known andy to drive anything . i said that andy hotton MAY [ "MAY" ] have driven that car . i didn't and don't know , as i wouldn't know what andy looks / looked like unless someone posted a pic of him here . get that naval lint / army lint debate off your mind --- sheesh !
below is smokey's truck on the beach in '56 . photo below shows merritt brown's ford on the beach in '56 . i believe this truck had a connection to the factory [ depaolo] . both this and smokey's truck ultimately went faster than the speeds reported in the captions....a lot faster . more later .
The Rules tell you what you can't do - Not what you can do Then they told me Churn long enough - The cream will come to the Top!
the first part [ at least ] sounds like a smokey quote . this , by and large , was his rationalization for cheating .
Cheating - Research & Devilment As a kid I saw a lot my daddy told me one day you will under stand son. Remember those times a car would go out and lap the Field course it never finished the race. Told you I could out run you any day - lol enough from me y'all are telling real history keep it up
Relax Jack ... I'm not argueing with you ... I understood everything that you wrote. About that quote ... everyone stretches the rules, looks for what they can get away with and gain an advantage ... cheating if you will ... Ford racers, GM racers, Mopar racers and so on. Joel
OF COURSE everyone cheated !...but NO ONE cheated like smokey yunick ! i've always believed that smokey would've rather cheated and lost a race , than to have won a race without cheating . kind of like something my father once told me : "there are people in the world who would rather make one dollar dishonestly , than to make two dollars honestly " okay - i'm back to "relaxing" . let's talk about the cars .
Jack, Smokey said he never cheated. He said he interpreted rules differently. LOL Smokey did a tell all story in a racing magazine about his famous 7/8 scale Chevelle (which was really full size) with lots of "creative rules interpretation". He got a lot of negative feedback after the story ran. His reply..."do they think I was racing against a bunch of virgins?" Anyone have more pics of the inside of the H&M shop, or vintage pics of H&M cars? Pops
hey pops - i'm sure i read that article , too . i remember smokey denied the car was anything other than full size . but he'd formed a subtle little spoiler out of bondo on the rear of the roof , and was surprised he got away with it . he was right , tho- everyone cheated ; otherwise i doubt a totally legal car would've made the race . and nascar had to know about a lot of it . but smokey was a CHEATER among cheaters , and his reputation bears that out . but racers never admitted they were cheating . no , they called it "getting competitive" [] or "creative rules interpretation" [] you asked about more inside pix of the HM shop , or pix of HM cars . i doubt this is what you're looking for , but it's what i've got . i took these 2 pix when i visited the HM shop in nov. , 1990 . they show one of the 6 cobra daytona coupes ... it's chassis was being stretched so they could install a 427 . don't know much more about it than that . sorry for the poor quality of the pix - that's my $10.00 camera again - with the equally [ or worse ] flash . i do have a lot more depaolo - HM - stroppe photos , tho . i hope to show a bunch over time . y'all come back now . ya hear ? jack
Modified Production was around in 1964, if not earlier. Bob Ford Inc "T-Bolt-Too" driven by Jerry Harvey in A/MP at the 1964 Indy Summer Nationals. Just like the red 289 Fairlane driven by Al Szwed in C/MP at the 64 Indy Nationals, in the photo. Re B&W photo, at the 64 Winternationals, Jack Fuche aka "Skinny" drove the car, which belonged to him at the time. Ok, back to H-M. Regards, Dennis
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