Fantastic, individuality and free thinking are what hot rodding is all about, dont need to be a lemming. What does the rest of the car look like? Some of us struggle with stombergs while others blow us away with technology.
looks sweet congrats on the hard work.. 3 years and to enjoy the fruits of your hardwork.. rock on.. chris.
It is obvious there is no common plenum but, it seems to be common practice to pull a signal off of each bore below throttle plates and congregate to a single container collecting vacuum.
If you notice, there is a tube down the middle of the intakes.(You can see this in the picture on the engine dyno) Each body is connected via a jetted nylon tube. It's the ones running to the center. Smooths out the idle. The engine runs so smooth that it gets a lot of comments regarding that. The cam is Isky max 1 on 108 centers. I had them grind it that way. should idle rougher, but it doesn't. New engine will have a Roller. You are right on about the Map used for al***ude compensation only.
Here are some more photos. The 97's were my first try. You can drive it but the plugs read weird. Most people would have been happy, but I always seem to go into the cave looking for the bear. One photo shows how I reduced the runners. there is a spring inside the tube. I got a better turn in the runner this way. The shims blend the round to the oval shape of the intakes. I poured the epoxy around the outside of the tube from the top side. No biggie, I use to do this in go kart engines to get shape. Final test was on a rear wheel dyno. After all the testing on the dynos, you still need fine tuning on the road. The ignition was developed on the dyno. Not your normal curve. A distributor could not create the final timing map. The crab on the front just tells the spark where to go, not when.
Intake valve is 1.6. I said the runners were 1 1/4" but I was wrong. I measured them and they are 1 3/8". Sorry but I'm 72 and my hard drive gets locked up sometimes. You may need to go bigger if you start turning the RPM'S. I don't know.
CR is 8 1/2 to 1 Mileage is 18 mpg. Could be a lot higher if I had the injectors closer to the valve. I am running a bigger injector than I like but I needed fuel for the accel pump to perform. I have had a high of 24 MPG but couldn't get the throttle response I needed. I'm not running the tune I want, that's why I'm building a new injection system. Found out you need the injectors close the the valve. ****
Thanks **** This is the kind of foward thinking that will keep this p***ion of ours alive, in a world of rising fuel costs...never mind gains in performance. At some point in time our cars may be scrutinized harder for emissions. This R&D puts us a step ahead and in a better position
Virgil I just ran across you thread on "fuel injection'. I guess I should have started there. I really like the injectors next to the valve. I am going to build a new manifold, but I might try running a tube from the bottom of the injector to just under the intake valve in my present system. Should kill the atomization, but it may not make any difference since it's getting squirted into the valve/?????? Any comments from anybody/?? Also, dose anybody have experience with twin plug locations in a flathead ????? Photo of another project.41 Hollywood. ****
****, I was wondering about the need for balance tubes on this system, since injected, vacuum is not the source of fuel feed/signal. Now it makes more sense, I ***ume the injector is under the ****erfly but higher up in the throat. I can't see in the pictures. This could contribute to fuel fall out. I don't think running tubes under the injector will help, spraying directly on the valve or at the valve will. What are you using for the crank or cam sensor? is this running full sequencial? J
Thanks ****, the injector location is working good, where it shines is at low rpm under load where the fuel is discharged directly toward the valves and (my thinking) is not having the fuel falling out of the air due to low velocity in intake runner, could be all wrong but I am happy with it. as to the tubes I can't help, not enough smarts in the grey matter upstairs. Vergil
Kerker love the car and motor. Impressive fabrication for sure. I was wondering what the emissions would be like with your system. I have always held the belief that it will be people like yourself that will find ways to improve fuel consumption and emissions. Certainly these improvements will not come from the screamers. I am impressed.
Hi Kerker, just discovered this thread and I am impressed with your setup. Congratulations! Relocating the injectors to squirt at the backs of the valves made a big difference to my engine, especially at low speed and under acceleration as Vergil says, and more so when the engine's cold, before the ports get hot enough to stop the fuel condensing. I don't think it matters at high RPM but for a street engine it's gold. Several different twin-plug heads have been made for flattys but I've not seen any evidence that they work any better than singles, so long as the single plug is in the right place. With combustion in Ricardo heads being so rapid, I doubt if an extra plug would give more power but it might reduce emissions. Now how about some more pictures of that Graham? That's really piqued my interest.
Allan, good to see your post. I want to thank you again Allan for sharing your pictures and information on the fuel injection build, as of now if I done another it would be the same under the intake injector setup. Vergil
I talked to the engine builder for "Flatfire" and he claimed the it was worth 10% on the dyno. That's what got me interested. I think the reason builders don't mess with it because of the ignition nightmare. With 16 coils and a cpu to fire them, control gets a whole bunch easier. It will be inductive ignition. Twin plugs works good on Harleys and those guys spent a lot of time developing. It is easier to to develop a single cylinder then a multi. All of this is for nill unless you have a good test cell. I had one of the best when I owned KERKER. Seat of the pants only gets you close at this stage. The timing drops several degrees. I think this is better and can't wait to try it. . You can never lead by following. ****
Hello Vergil Been a while and I have put almost 10,000 miles the flathead. BUT, I got tired of dealing with individual throttle bodies. * throttle plates, ugh. Just fine 1200 rpm and up but the inconsistency at idle drove me nuts. It was also batch fired. I found a new ECU built by EM-TRON out of Australia. It is a much better operating system. You can tune each cylinder. The knock sensors pull spark out of individual cylinder and put it right back in when allowed. I found the 2 and 3 will knock at different times.6 and 7 are also guilty. We can also tune each cylinder with spark plugs that measure pressure. The fuel is also phased so the intake opens before the fuel is injected. Fan belt dosen't make one rev. and it cold starts. 2 maps, one for town and one for the highway. too many things to mention in a forum. Enclose pictures. Progressive throttle body and plenum. All throttle bodies remain, but are straight thru now. The runners worked so good I left them alone. I also moved the injectors down to the base. Much better. 8 coils that have a lot of dwell. I have more photos but cannot upload as of now. Cheers **** in Havasu
I'm speechless. Except to say that I have enough fingers to count the weeks till I'm 77, and those whiney *** younguns *****ing about "tradition" can go piss up a rope!!!!!!!
Beautiful roadster, fascinating tech. The torque figure impresses the hell out of me, and you are getting the throttle response/driveability too.This really got me thinking. That '41 Hollywood looks like a hotrod from an alternate reality.
With the phasing of the injection, throttle response and accel is 10 times better than the batch fire. I am sure moving the injectors closer to the valve also helped a bunch. **** in Havasu
The Jalopy Journal
