FLATCAD RACING Bonneville 2011 Build

where at Buddy?...........maybe I can hear it in person???

 

John Beck, Vintage Hot Rod-631 Country Drive , Chico, CA 95928

Be nice to see you while we're there!

 

let me know when you go!!!

 

Make sure you set up a couple of cameras for recording the birthing wail. Murphy is always at hand, and a little redundancy in the video capture department should insure that at least one of the cameras works. In the last 6 months I've been to a wedding, and an Eagle Scout Court of Honor where video cameras failed, resulting in some VERY disappointed folks.

 

Both Dale and I are taking video recorders, so I HOPE we capture everything-the trials and tribulations, along with the successes.

After we get make it home, I have an idea about editing the videos into one- kind of a theme based deal,then we'll post it.

 

Girdle setup looks good, as the entire engine. It should stay in one piece that way.
Greetings from Poland

 

I've been putting off replacing my ****py headphones but if y'all are gonna post a video with sound then its time for me to step up and get some good ones. I wanna hear this baby scream!

 

Buddy and friends..good luck on the dynotest! this build is wild!

support your FlatCad racingteam..buy a T...

 

Thanks a ton . . just about the best picture and ***ociated engine shot we could have. We GREATLY appreciate all our extended team members and all that you do to keep us marching forward. When the obstacles and bumps in the road happen, sometimes we need our friends to give us words of encouragement, a bit of motivation to keep us moving forward and chasing the dream.

We would not be where we are at without the help of ALL of you - keep it coming.

I'll have an extensive post this evening . . . jamming along like a one armed well digger.

B&S

 

Palle, That's a great pic! Looks like your Cadflat project is coming along nicely!

Let me know when you need those Zephyr gears!

 

Weekend Update: Fast the Furious! Sumptin for Everybody . . .

Chris and I have been going like mad . . . trying to get everything done for Buddy to pick this beast up. We completed two of the big remaining "custom" pieces of the project. This damn hand design/fabrication work takes a lot of time and effort - always is slower than you think.

1) Dry Sump Pump Configuration: The setup that Buddy bought from Barnes has two suction/evacuation stages and one pressure stage. It also has a really funky darn water pump mounted to the front - that drives the whole mess.

2) Injector Pump: This dry-sump setup can also be used to drive the injector pump - so it is configured for this as well. While having the pump on the dry-sump may work for the Dyno, I believe we may have to rethink this when we see how all of this fits in the car - given the motor mount location. Or - my guess is the motor mount of the p***enger side may need to be reworked. Anyway - we'll know more when Buddy gets this and the car in the same dang garage!

3) Creating a Mounting Bracket: Created a bracket that picks up three bolts from the front snout support and has a 90 degree mounting bracket to bolt to the water pump mounts.

Due to the funky water pump, it is a real PITA to make a mount and figure out how to get water OUT of the pump. I ended up using an old Flathead Ford water neck -- rusty and all at the moment.

4) HTD 8MM Belt: The bracket is designed to use a 800mm SBC dry sump pump belt - 3/4" wide. I believe I have everything exactly where it needs to be . . . just need to mount the idler once I get the belt (should arrive tomorrow).

5) Fabrication Challenge: Trying to keep things square during welding is a real necessity (due to belt alignment). I clamped the heck out of it - as I knew it will want to 'move' when I welded it. Also, I only welded about 1" at a time - moving around the part. It is a pretty complex design - due to all the angles that needed to be accurate. Even with the clamping, it moved a slight amount off of square -- took the BFH to it to "adjust it a bit". I believe the 8mm drive belt with track correctly - if not, we'll adjust as needed.

Here is the pictures of Bracket a GoGo . . .











The next post will show the 'water manifold' stuff . . . be up shortly.

B&S

 

Weekend Update: Lower Water Manifolds . . . Stainless Baby!

We've been pondering for awhile as to how to plumb water into the block in a manner that provides good and consistent cooling to both cylinder banks and the rear cylinders (which tend to run hotter). The stock FlatCad cooling flow is very strange:

a) Waterpump is on the front p***enger's side.
b) Water enters the p***enger bank - then travels through the middle of the block (in the valley area) over to the driver's side bank.
c) Water tends to be heated up on the p***enger side before it gets to the driver's side.

So - we wanted to plumb both sides of the block - using the freeze plugs. I've been thinking about how the heck to make some water manifolds that picked up the freeze plug outlets - just how to mount them? Ended up deciding to make individual manifolds (one for each of the two rear freeze plugs). I ordered some 3/8 stainless plate and some 1" tubing.

I then designed a very simple SolidWorks 3D model and sent it over to Chris. His work was nice enough to let him use their brand new HAAS CNC mill to cut these parts. Stainless is soft and sticky - took over an hour to machine each piece.



Chris came over Saturday afternoon and we made the pipe/****** extensions and welded them up. The ******s were then pressed into the thick plate pieces and welded from the back side.

On Sunday we drilled/tapped the block in four corners around each hole.



Then we tapped each hole for 5/16 NC bolts.





We temporarily mounted the manifolds - everything is cool as hell. You gotta love stainless when it is done - just looks nice.







I ordered some square O-rings from McMaster today - that hopefully can be used in the bottom of the freeze-plug holes. The idea is for the manifolds to press against the O-rings to create a very solid seal . . . hopefully with no other gasket material required. There are limited O-ring sizes, we'll just see if what I ordered will work.

Great job by Chris . . . he cranked through it and delivered at the 11th hour!

B&S

 

Dale, it looks great, and looks like everything will work great on the dyno!

...but, it appears the whole setup may not work in the car! I wish I had a better pic, but I don't. Look at the frame in relationship to the engine mount.

 

Yeah - the pump is as far forward as it can go and it can't really tuck much closer to the block (due to the water pump) . . . we'll just have to figure it out. I can't say that I'm a big fan of the water pump - it just complicates the **** out of everything and leaves very limited mounting options. Hind site is always 20/20 now isn't it!

 

Haha! I think we just have to own up to the fact, that we forgot to take measurements when we had it in there!

At work, we call these oversights 'job security'. The boss calls them our 'last warning'! Lol!

 

I'm not doing quite the custom work you guys are but it's nice to have the vehicle only a few feet away from the engine as you build it. lol

 

Monday Night Update: We Struck Oil My Friends!

Just got in from the shop - a bit knackered, but it was a good night.

1) Distributor Plug: Chris came over and he turned an aluminum plug to mount where the stock distributor was. I noticed that there was a pressurized oil feed hole DOWN inside the distributor bore in the block - would have been a big oil pressure leak if we didn't make a long very close fitting plug to go down the shaft bore and cover the pressure hole. Sorry - didn't take a picture!

Chris also hand-made gaskets for the valley covers and mounted them.

2) Oil Pan Kickout Bar: I was working on the rest of the oil system. When I designed the lower crankshaft girdle, I didn't want to counter sink the front main studs/nuts into the front girdle bar - seemed stupid to drastically weaken the whole girdle by two big counter-bores (down into the meat of it). So - this left a problem . . . where the heck is the front of the pan going to mount and seal? The dang studs/nuts are right in the way.

3) I like Dog Legs - Have a Set of My Own! Solution - I kicked the front of the oil-pan out (dog-legged it) - and instead of making the girdle shape a lot more complex (with a corresponding kick-out), I decided to make a 3/4" thick aluminum KickOut bar that bolts to the front of the girdle and then has bolts for the oil-pan kickout. Had to make that bar this evening out of 6061, drill tap a bunch of ****, etc.. There went about 2 hours . . . yikes!







Mounted it to the girdle and then started working on the pan (which has never been on the engine). Had to take the die grinder and relieve the center baffle to clear the center studs. I thought we may have to modify the front of the pan to clear the front studs (as the pan builder angled the front - we thought it would hit the studs).



4) Good Karma - Guess I'll Vote Tomorrow: Anyway, after the center baffle mods, the darn thing fit in the front! About ******** time we had some good luck! I had Jeff Fowler ready to do some aluminum TIG welding on the pan tomorrow (my welder can't do aluminum). Anyway, pan fits perfectly . . . all is good in the land of oil.

Here is the front of the pan - notice how it kicks out and bolts to the kickout bar:





Drill Baby Drill - It is Good for FlatCad! I guess that maybe because Buddy is in the 'Oil Business', the Gods smiled on us today and his good Karma came through.

Time for sleep - these next 3 days are going to be a real slog!

B&S

 

C'mon Tim, that would be too easy-anyone can do it that way!


Dale, I think you were probably working on the oil pan, when I emailed you the 'contingency plan'. Looks like it's time to go that route, with the fuel and oil pump!

 

Beautiful work as always Dale! I like the "kick out" how you left the "made in USA" on it. Touch of cl***!

 

Yeah - the FlatCad is a 'virtual race car' . . . pieces and parts made and worked on all over the dang place! Then we have to figure out how to put Humpty Dumpty back together again so it can go down the salt - lots of fun along the way.

 

Thanks!

You noticed the USA sign! I decided that I wanted that little marking to be on the outside, where maybe somebody could see it. LOL

B&D

 

can't wait to see and hear it in person!!!!! Go Dale!!!!!!

 

Garry did some more flow work with our head. We had 166 CFM with a .050 head gasket. Garry then used a .10 head gasket, and got 172 CFM flow. After a little work on the transfer area, and the .10 head gasket, flow went to 188 CFM. Garry just surp***ed 200 CFM on his engine.

So, it appears with a little more work to the transfer area, we can get the flow up, and use our .072 gaskets!

 

Something to think about - on a non relieved block, he is going to need a head gasket of .072 + .187 to mimic your block and flow. If he can do that, then I'd love to see the numbers as this will setup his transfer area to be similar (once the flow is past the valve pockets) as ours.

Just something to ponder!

B&S

 

Mimicking our block and flow is really not the exercise here, Dale. As Garry's block is not relieved, all we really can address is the flow on the 'high' side of the chamber.

As you know, when air leaves the valve, it likes to go 'high', not low-that is to say, it doesn't like to 'turn' the tight corner to follow the relief. Will it turn the corner- yes, especially with the boost. Reliving the block is a highly contested issue, with do***entation for it, and against it, available.

The natural flow path, though, would be high, in the transfer area. I believe if we improve that flow, we will improve overall flow. Down the road, when we are looking to get every little bit of HP milked out of this thing, this is an area I definitely think needs to be addressed.

Will the current relief and transfer area work for us? Obviously, we both believe it will, but that doesn't mean we should discount the natural tendencies of air flow, IMHO

See you tomorrow morning!

 

By the way Dale. I and I'm sure may others really appreciate your efforts in posting after a long day of work!!!

 

Thanks Roy! Will be another late night tonight - Buddy is coming by to pickup the motor tomorrow and it will be a slog (by both of us) to get it ready for the trip.

 

What day is the dyno? Might come up to see Carl then and bring him his new toy.

 

The Final Hours - Last of the Long Block:

Man, I must be an eternal optimist - it is always a much bigger job and takes so much more time than I think. Guess that is why I talk myself into these projects in general!

The following is from Wednesday evening - night before Buddy arrived. I needed to complete the ***embly of the heads . . . which all of you flathead guys knows is a real PITA. This is doubly true on a custom engine, where you built 'clam shell' heads, have never had studs in it before, etc.. You really don't know what you're in for.

1) ***embly Tip: Preaching to the Choir: When you have a custom engine (girdle, special mains, special crank, etc.) - it is a good idea to mark the girdle and block with your torque specs. If this engine has a life beyond me messing with it (one can only hope!), wanted the "next guy" to know what to do.

I stamped the girdle and the block with the torque settings for the mains, rods and the pan rails. We use about a .005 crush on the main caps (from the steel girdle). The stock specs call for about 150 lbs on the mains, but both Jeff and I didn't want to go that far . . . worried about cracking the block or pulling the webs out of it - so 130 it is.



2) Heads - Blue Gooooo: The FlatCad has custom 2-piece clam shell heads. Not only do we have to worry about sealing the deck surface, we have to worry about sealing the surfaces between the head pieces. As we have solid copper head gaskets (from FlatOut) - with a rubberized coating on them and stainless O-rings in the heads (mandatory with solid copper gaskets), we wanted some extra sealing insurance. (Who knows if even this will seal!).

a) Rubber O-Rings: When Chris designed the heads, he put in some square grooves around the perimeter and the plug holes - then I put in the same bulk O-ring material that is frequently used on high-pressure blower manifolds. Hopefully these O-rings, plus the hylomar will do the trick.



b) Hylomar: This is a special non-setting polyurethane concoction that is used in the aircraft industry and many others for specialized sealing/gasket situations. It is expensive and messy - costs about $55 for a brush on can (about 250 ml) and is available in a spray on can as well. We're using both:

- Spray on was used to coat both sides of the head gaskets. You spray one fairly thin coat and give it a few minutes to flash out the solvents (it never dries though).

- Brush on was used between the head pieces and also on the bottom of the blower manifold.



3) Head Studs: @#%@#$$@#$! These are one of those things that you know you need for blown applications, but you dread using them all the same. I had temporary insanity - coated the co**** (block-side) threads with a special teflon thread sealer, put anti-seize on all the surface, put ALL of them in for one side in the block . . . and then with stupidity and optimism, tried to put the heads on! You guessed it - not a chance in the world of putting a head on this way. (I know better, but I guess I'm too stupid to remember what ALWAYS happens with flatheads - you just can't do it this way!).



So, then I took about 3/4 of the studs out - put the head gasket back on, put the head pieces on and THEN put the rest of the studs in . . . one by one. I used anti-seize on all stud surfaces other than the co**** threads - don't forget to do this or you may never get the heads back off!

Also, we use hardened ARP 'hat washers' - that shoulder the stud and go down into the head. These really help align the stud and ensure a good torque reading. Also, they stop deformation/galling of the head itself. The head design had machined pockets to accept this style of washer.

Okay - this method works . . . here is one head on. Notice the thin line of blue Hylomar coming out - this is actually a good sign that we have good clamping forces and hopefully a good seal. This **** never hardens and about the only solvent that will cut it is MEK (not nice stuff - be careful! ).

Torque: Stock iron heads are 70 lbs -- I didn't want to go that high. I'd like to talk to some of the LSR boys and see how much they are using. (I used to go to 55 on my blown flathead Fords - but with limited boost).

I was conservative for now --> 50 lbs on the stock location studs and 35 on the 7 new ones that we added. I did NOT want to torque the new studs too much as the deck is thin (no stud bosses), and it would be easy to crack the deck and ruin the block. Again - nobody has experience with FlatCads, this is all semi-educated guess work at best.

My guess is that we'll increase the torque once the engine is warmed on the dyno - as head gasket issues and water sealing are typically some of the biggest issues to overcome on LSR flatheads.

Any experience on LSR torque on blown flatheads??? - please send me your thoughts!

Here yah go . . . so heads on block . . . looking kind of cool hugh!





Next post coming up . . . the final ship-out . . .

 

Hey Dale, learned about the "Blue Goo" from an English Army Tank Mechanic about ten years back, (long OT story) and agree, it's great stuff. Best of luck for a successful trip to the dyno with numbers beyond your expectations. We're all pulling for you!